This is the statement that seemed to me the most crucial re your relationship to your employer: "I could take on all kinds of challenges, even tried some impossible ones. All I ever really got was an "atta-boy" for those jobs."

I don't disagree with your decision; I do disagree with some of the other comments on this thread.

Jan

Thank you

It was. I discussed it with my beautiful wife. She has seen me suffer in similar situations too many times and she was a great sounding wall for me. She'll say she's tired of seeing me get taken advantage of. It was hard...and really was the first time in my career I said, "I'm not your guy (unless you pay me more)."

LOL!!!! When I retire I can be found on the beach...probably until the end.

That's important work jimjamesjames. Thank you for working for the kids...

I understand. In this case, I have done this work before (different location) and found out the hard way that it requires somebody with a great deal of authority to pull off. My current management either doesn't know that, hopes I'll just make it "go away", or some other spot on the learning curve... I, believe it or not, have taken a little time to educate my current boss on what's required and he's all ears. He's a great guy. I also emphasized, "I'm still on your team, and I want to help." I just made it clear that I, and anybody in my position, is not the right fit for the task.

That's beautiful. Thanks.

Thank you. I've been an engineer for 26 years now. It took 26 years before I finally said, "no thanks". about 4 more years and I'm out of engineering - but will remain open for lucrative stuff.

Well, can you get the same job from somebody
else at a higher rate of pay?--Are you getting en-
ough to eat, pay the rent, and pay utilities now?--
Which displeased you the more, the not getting the
pay you think it warrants, or having responsibility
but not enough authority?

I had a job once, the only one I really loved.
I worked on it a year, 7 months, a week, and 3
days. I was a carhop at 75 cents an hour, plus
tips and daily food allowance. (No time and a
half for overtime, of course). (This was 1970--
1972). But I quit that job because the boss
clamped down on me and kept telling me to
slow down. It got so where if I went fast enough
that the cashiers didn't have to take orders out
the side door, he'd tell me I was going too fast.
It absolutely ruined the job for me. I gave notice
and served it out. (I have sometimes regretted
that I gave him notice, instead of just walking
off the job).

I had been managing to save money in the
bank. But about 4 days after leaving, I got a
job in the furniture factory (at $1.98 an hour,
38 cents above the current minimum wage). I
made considerably more than I had been mak-
ing; the main complaint I had against the factory
job was that, compared to my former job, it was
very boring. But the carhop job had been a mis-
ery to me, since the boss had ruined my pro-
fessional pride in it. I never regretted leaving it,
only having to leave.

I have had many jobs since then, some good,
some not so good. I think I was treated the best
(though not paid the best) on the street vendor
job, which I held 27 years. But I have never
had a job I loved as I did that carhop job, be-
fore it was ruined for me. It had once been so
exciting.

Of course, if you are doing all right self-em-
ployed, you can afford to turn down assignments
that are not suitable for you.

Exactly. My exact words were along the lines of, "I have a career plan in place. In that plan, anything that takes me away from the technical work I love so much it must come with a pay increase." I got no argument - yet.

BTDT many years ago. And it is a great feeling. And BTW, the person asking for what I already knew was the impossible with the tools available was gone a few months later. I was still there until I retired.

Remember, if you're indispensable, you don't get promoted.

Congratulations and Good for you standing for YOU and what you do NOT the politics.

I agree with your analysis and have given you a point. I would also give you another point for mentioning Epicurus, but I lack the ability to do so. Please take another virtual +1.

Jan

I do not disagree with your decision, Abaco, but I come at it from a different rational.

I am 'them' - a corporate executive. We often move a poorly functioning employee around to see if there is a place where there is a better 'fit'; we also often move a premier employee around to see if they have even more capacity than they have already shown. We are a small company, and our paychecks come out of what we earn: This means that you have to move the good employee to the higher responsibility position before you raise their pay - because their pay increase comes out of a percentage of 'the more money the company is now making because of increased performance'. (Conversely, moving the poorly performing employee to a new job may be a prelude to firing him if the fit is still not good.)

What you describe, Abaco is something different: lack of fealty. I also do medieval reenactment (as do Wm and several others in the company), and I am of the opinion that there is a fealty relationship between employer and employee - a reciprocity of loyalty and - in medieval times - a profit sharing agreement. What you are saying, Abaco, is that your employer has broken fealty with you. You have pulled their chestnuts out of the fire several times previously and they have not rewarded you for it. This does not speak well of their quality.

I disagree with those people who say that a career is not important. This varies from person to person. I agree with giellopudding (! - never thought to type that sentence in my life!) in that you have to determine what is important to you. If a career IS important to you, then that is a valid life decision - acknowledge it and pursue it. You are an individual and you shape the character of your own life.

Jan

So few people know what they are good at and what they really prefer, and leap at any chance for advancement. We have all kinds of problems with management picking great engineers as leaders (can be the same, but are often not). You are very wise to choose to pursue what you enjoy and are skilled at!
Indirect responsibility is more and more en vogue. It is not always a disaster, but it does require very strong communication, interpersonal skills and a keen sense of where the "line" is to succeed. It can definitely work though. I witnessed a "powerless" congressional staffer tear apart a two star admiral on a simple subject the admiral was 1) wrong on, and 2) just taking the party line. After questions being thwarted by evasive non answers, the staffer said, "Don't worry, after this meeting I will provide you a question to which the answer can be "yes" or "no", and you will answer that question admiral". That admiral was fired by the deputy secretary of defense for acquisition about 4 months later.

Those that can do it seem to always get exploited and, because they enjoy the work, do it. When I was doing child protection investigations, my four coworkers averaged around 30 cases in progress. I averaged 55. My supervisor would come into my office and announce, "Another opportunity to serve." Yes, he was a commie pinko ex-hippie type from the '60s, but I never refused because a caseload that big was fulfilling for me.

I also applaud your decision and encourage you to continue to first recognize when and how you are mistreated and undervalued, and then to act out of self respect. Thank you for posting your story. It is inspiring to me.

Reminds me of a family tale:
My dad was the assistant night manager at a celebrity type restaurant. You know, the place where the entertainers and politicians hung out. The boss asked him to take over being the day manager. A much bigger responsibility, no increase in pay. Ol' daddy handed in his apron and bought a little deli and started his own business. No more celebrity autographs and free passes, and much harder work, but...like you say.....

For myself and another who can be named, Hoorah.

They are already paying you what they think you are worth TO THEM. If you think you are worth more $$, the only way to get it is to find another position

If you have to say that you want more money, you have already lost the battle. They will pay you what THEY think you are worth to them, and not a penny more. The way to get more money is to go out and see if someone else WILL pay you more, and then take it.

Wow ! Good for you !!
Will you let the Gulch know if anything further develops with this situation ? Do they come back to you with a better enticement ? Do they find someone else or just drop the project? Do you quit and become an independent contractor who charges 10xs as much since then you'd be responsible for all your benefits package ? Etc.

The sad thing is that this scenario seems so common that it almost goes unnoticed. I've been confronted with a similar dilemna just three weeks ago! But my life has been a little slow so I said: "Sure! But as an equal share equity partner."