excellent background article...one of the first lessons i learned in econ was ...always follow the money...money talks...people walk to the tune of the debt holder...

I wish them well in their endeavor, but I see no reason why the US government should be allied with the Saudi Arabian government.

While I share your views about the Saudi Arabian government and the House of Saud, Saudi Arabia is advancing culturally about as much as the House of Saud can permit without collapsing their power. I am not saying they should be able to wield such power, but as with Syria and several other Muslim countries, too quick an upheaval may result in a worse situation for us and the Muslim people than allowing unlimited freedom to a society not ready yet for it.

My criticism was directed at the Saudi Arabian government and the House of Saud.

Not to mention Mickey's wife Minnie wearing a
sweater when greeting Queen Elizabeth and
actually touching the Queen! An absolute
no-no. But this is low-class, no-class behav-
iour from our WH squatters. No surprise there!

While the vast majority of your article is true, particularly the history up until the last decade or so, Saudi Arabia is changing considerably in ways that we would like to see, albeit more slowly than we would like. Having taught a few hundred Saudi students, there are quite a lot of them who embrace engineering and entrepeneurship. They have expanded their business beyond refineries and petrochemicals in recent years as well. The wisdom in doing so has mitigated what could have been a much more financially unstable situation there this year. If you treat Saudis as the individuals that they are, you will be surprised how much like us that many of them are. While we will never have Objectivism in common with them, the Saudis are developing into respectable trading partners with whom value-for-value exchange is possible.

You're pretty sharp not to accept what Obama likes to show when you could not see his face. That news story must have gotten by you.
On the other hand, the video was the first thing I saw when Fox News and only Fox News reported the bowing just to have White House spin lies about it.
Anyway, that's why I did not even think to look for Obama's photoed face on the photo page. and paid little attention to the comic doctored stuff.

Thanks, Dino. Maybe he was just bending over to see how big a diamond the King had in his ring? Otherwise it is an atrocious error in protocol, and his diplomatic advisors should be flogged. Miss Manners should have something to say about this. Many years ago she reprimanded one of our diplomats (female) for curtseying to the Queen.

" its more likely that some in the Bush admin and in the US military knew in advance and helped it happen."
In your and Zen's discussion, it's seems like you're conflating two independent propositions:
1) Someone in the US gov't either new in advance or helped a plan to fly planes into buildings.
2) The attacks weren't simply flying planes into buildings. Missiles, planted bombs, nucelar weapons, etc were also used in the attack.
They could both be false, true, or one true and the other false.

Herb; I understand. The show on stage is always better if you don't look behind the curtain, and the frozen steak sandwich patty always looks and tastes better if you haven't watched and seen what they grind up to make it or add to it to make it stick together so well.

"False Flag"
Yes. That's what I meant when I said I can see elements in the Saudi and/or US gov'ts looking the other way or helping the perpetrators.

I still do not understand the reason for multiple attack modalities. It increases the chance of the conspiracy being discovered and doesn't add much to the effect the conspirators are going for.

You saw Obama's better side, but this video is way more clear about who bowed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fd425...

All those pictures show only someone's backside. It's not clear that it's Obama. I want better evidence. Some of them also reek of Photoshop. And the photo at the top of the article is not bowing, he's leaning towards the much shorter guy, probably to be better heard. And Obama has his hands held protectively in front of his balls...

I don't see that this gives the citizens any power -- especially since the Fed has already demonstrated willingness to buy any Treasury debt that the market won't, by just pulling money out of its ass.

"Borrow $1 and the bank owns you. Borrow $1 million and you own the bank."

free; You're right of course--but the vast majority of the population is just so ignorant of basic physics and basic propaganda tools to make it anything but a fool's errand to ever expect a significant portion, if any at all, to begin to question.

As to speculation, that's something the manipulators and propagandists count on. We don't need to grow more weeds and bushes for facts to become more hidden in. There are enough real, factual results glaring in plain sight for me to have satisfied myself.

Zen:
It is tempting to believe you. But, old guys like myself want to cling to the America we were brought up to respect and love. It's not easy to let go of the Reagan vision of the shining city on the hill. We loved and had so much to love. The bravery, the patriotism, the history.
It's hard when the child finds out his chocolate swirl in a cone is just a bunch of powdered chemicals.

On all the myriad of money shows, that simple, most important fact is never http://mentioned. It makes you want to throw ice-cold water in the faces of the populace.

The owner of those buildings...towers and building 7 made out like a bandit...I've been searching for that article...he's the one that gave to go ahead to blow the charges in the towers and later building 7.

Mostly true.

We (USA) just helped form, legitimize, and manage the governing body that did the divvying, and authorized/voted for it. That's all. This participation multiplied after WW2, making us beloved throughout the region.

Any time I mention the Bush Admin, I am not specifically saying Bush had knowledge in advance of all the actions taken. However, I do think all the statists act specifically to provide plausible deniability to those in power. I don't care how they dress it up in weasle wording. Bush's administration is culpable and the guy at the top was Bush. He is responsible.
I have no idea what you are referring to as "ins gag". Please explain?

The ins gag wasn't bull crap and Bush had nothin to do with that...just splainen why the buildings came down the way they did...the evil of it was that there was still people in there.

In practical terms, the Saudis could make a similar arms deal with either Russia or China and sell their oil there instead. Neither of those regimes would put up with Saudi royalty's actions, but they make a deal to get in the door, and then break it when the time was right.
Obama does these things because he is a traitor and Obama should be executed for it. The CIA could have that done in a couple of months and blame it on the Saudis. Of course, there might be other casualties and the truth would never be released until after the revolution, if then.

Let's do it and promulgate the constant war that we are in (meant facetiously). The Middle East is a cesspool, I spent numerous months there and it is not worth saving. Islam has polluted what could have been a so-so place without it. The rich British and European holiday in some places like Dubai and other places on the Gulf and other bodies of water. So, they are complicit in the farce known as the House of Saud. They are more than happy to take our dollars and pounds but would be more than happy to cut off our heads and put them on a pike. Let them lose their petro dollars as oil prices tank and keep pumping here and in Canada, let saudi rot with the rest of the Middle east as Shiite kill Sunni and vice-versa.

Cmon, Zen, where's your sense of adventure?
History is replete with events like this, including recent US history. Based on that, its more likely that some in the Bush admin and in the US military knew in advance and helped it happen, if not being the origintors. Eventually the public will react violently to these pirates.