Death of a Libertarian

Posted by Maphesdus 11 years, 5 months ago to Politics
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I thought this was a really good article, and it effectively sums up the biggest issue I have with Ayn Rand's philosophy.

READ ARTICLE: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/brynn-tann...


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  • Posted by Toneplay 11 years, 5 months ago
    The article says: "The ostensible goal of libertarian theory is a good one: equality of opportunity for everyone."

    I don't know about "libertarian theory" but Ayn Rand certainly didn't care about equality of opportunity. The essential political goal of her philosophy is *freedom*. Why? Because living as a man, rather than as a slave of other men, *requires* freedom.

    It's not about achieving a certain statistical distribution of income. It's about people getting to keep what they earn -- and that's it.

    Now before you say that such might mean people starving in the streets, I'll say that if a rich man is allowed to keep his income, he's not going to stuff it under a mattress, but instead he'll *invest it*. Such will create jobs for less wealthy men.
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I don't see at all how it violates anyone's rights. It's not like the person refusing to hire certainly people is the only way to do productive activity. I guess I can see it if your line of work is something specific to making cars and is not something outsourced to subcontractors. There's only a handful of ways to do that type of work. So a few manufacturers have a lot of control over whether you work. This hypothetical person is in at tight spot even w/o discrimination b/c he has such a narrow customer base. That's always dangerous.

    Regarding ending debates, I mean it would end political debate. For example, it would end the debate about whether sexual orientation should be protected the same way as age, race, marital status, and sex are; none would be protected.

    I realize this would legalize one more form of stupid behavior in the marketplace, but a) I don't see that as a big deal and b) I'm not convinced you really can outlaw stupid behavior like this. There's a whole world of people out there wanting to design, test, and assemble electronics. There's a whole world of OEMs and startups that need electronics. Both of them occasionally do stupid things. I don't see the law coming in and making us any smarter in our decisions.

    Also, I find business so difficult that I can't imagine pushing a political agenda. I guess it happens, but I can't imagine being so good that I could pick and choose clients and employees based on race or politics and still feel confident I'm the best choice for customers. Even if I were Flextronics' CEO instead of one guy with a few PT employees, my mind would be consumed with keeping layers of people around the world excited about being the best choice for OEMs, not about race and politics.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    How about a restaurant that doesn't allow kids after some idiot let her kid poop at the dinner table?
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    HOW does it violate their rights? Nobody has a *right* to work for me.

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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago
    You'd lose with me.

    This morning I walked up to a couple vendors I'm friendly with at Walmart, and said, "This equality stuff is BS". They both looked at me expectantly.

    A female customer with beautiful blue eyes had, very very politely, come up and asked where to find the candy.
    I was off-duty, but I had her follow me and began guiding her. She thanked me, and I said that employees are supposed to *take* customers to what they're looking for, not just point. And she asked, "Even if they're off duty?"
    To which I glibly replied, "Ah, well, I'm just a nice guy."

    Now, I've posted enough around here for people to know that I'd have responded that way had she been a 72 year old guy using a walker. I was fed a straight line, I didn't consider the source.

    But, then I have a sense of priority. First I'd get your hypothetical decolletage-encrusted female the directions, THEN I'd take the time to flirt with her...
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    " But how do we judge their prejudice? "
    Not at all?

    Okay, children, listen up, here's a lesson for you that you WILL NOT LEARN:

    EVERYBODY is prejudiced. Everybody.

    Of course we are. It saves time in most situations.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Watch... magic...

    ": a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes other people, ideas, etc. : a bigoted person; especially : a person who hates or refuses to accept the members of a particular group (such as a racial or religious group)" - merriam-webster definition of "Bigot".

    "
    bigotry
      Use Bigotry in a sentence
    bigotry
    [big-uh-tree]
    noun, plural bigotries.
    1.
    stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own.
    2.
    the actions, beliefs, prejudices, etc., of a bigot." - dictionary.com definition of "Bigotry".
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  • Posted by khalling 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    hmmm. I do not know what that means. the test is simple. An attractive woman dressed tastefully but showing quite a bit of decolletage comes up to you with a map. She needs to directions and points on the map to her destination. I'll bet money it will take you longer to give her the correct information. I'll also go so far as to say it will take you longer to actually look at the map-than a woman.
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    • Hiraghm replied 11 years, 5 months ago
    • johnrobert2 replied 11 years, 5 months ago
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Selling tobacco products to a minor is not only wrong, it's illegal!

    Sorry... you reminded me of that... idiocy.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    All animals are equal; some are more equal than others.

    All statuses are protected. But some statuses are more protected than others, apparently.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Why should pedophiles refrain from expressing their sexuality when homosexuals do not? Why should bestials refrain from expressing their sexuality when pedophiles do not? Why should every fetish on the planet refrain from expressing its sexuality when normal, healthy people don't refrain from expressing their normal, healthy sexuality?

    Enforced audience is also a form of oppression. You want to pretend your sexual hang up is normal and healthy, do so by yourself, don't inflict your irrationality on me.

    The nutty homeless guy wandering around the vestibule of Walmart is free to express his schizophrenia while talking to himself, but he tries to make a captive audience of me and security gets called.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Animosity can also be based on complete and perfect knowledge of the object of one's animosity.

    Familiarity *does* sometimes breed contempt.
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  • Posted by khalling 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You shall be the first participant in the map/directions test. since Bambib thinks women are too dumb to get the tilted glass test correct I have designed my own test to demonstrate male performance on simple tasks
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  • Posted by $ Hiraghm 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    " Libertarians claim that you have a right to be a racist. If you think that is a rational choice, then consider Ayn Rand's famous essay, "Racism." "

    Of course it's a rational choice; and even if it's an irrational choice, it's still your right.

    I will not eat liver. I do not like liver, I do not like the idea of liver, the smell of liver cooking makes me nauseous.

    I love eating steak, however, and the smell of a cooking steak makes my mouth water.

    I choose to discriminate between steak and liver in steak's favor. I have a right to like what I like, to dislike what I dislike, based upon whatever criteria I choose.

    Likewise, I can prefer redheaded women to other women, if that's my taste. Nothing rational about it, but it's still my right, and you have no moral right to dictate to me what kind of women I'm attracted to. Or to demand that I be equally attracted to all women. Maybe I'm repelled by women with blonde hair; again, my right.

    Imagine if one had to marry every person who wanted to marry you...

    "The hatred of one person for another speaks to a problem within those who hate."

    Yeah, all those people who hated Hitler, there's a problem with them. All the American soldiers who hated "Japs" had "a problem", it wasn't that the Japanese were worthy of hatred.

    Let's have the flipside: The love of one person for another speaks to a problem within those who love.

    Hate is as natural and normal an emotion as love. It can be misdirected, but so can love.

    "To love a thing is to know and love its nature."
    To hate a thing is also to know and hate its nature.
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  • Posted by $ johnrobert2 11 years, 5 months ago in reply to this comment.
    What makes you think I'm a lefty? My preference for the left side? If I'm facing you and I (may I? For demonstration purposes only, I assure you.) reach for the left side, which hand would I reach with? Jeez. So misunderstood.
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