Doubling Knowledge

Posted by Herb7734 3 months ago to Education
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At the University of Gronigen in the Netherlands, they have Cray AT3 computers hooked up in clusters that can execute hundreds of teraflops per second, that translates into hundreds of trillions of calculations. This cluster can do more in an hour than the whole first century of modern computing.Rather than working on the various problems of quantum physics, it is being devoted to modeling event horizons and event cascades affecting the seven billion inhabitants of our planet. In other words,this massive array is doing the calculus of felicity. The greatest good for the greatest number.They are attempting to turn morality into math.As far as we can tell, at first, human knowledge was doubling every 1500 years or so, today it is doubling every two years.Their argument is that at the same time, our moral faculties remain unevollved. The technical prowess of our species has vastly outstripped our ethical prowess. They have, in effect, created a sort of moral prosthesis in order to extend our
intellectual capacities by artificial means.It is my opinion that this powerful facility is being wasted on not the complex problems of the quantum universe, but on morality problems that are unsolvable, because the human race has seven billion variables that change from moment to moment . We know what computers can do with science.But are they of any use when dealing with philosophical ideas like morality and worse yet, as a basic goal the foundation of socialism.


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  • Posted by  $  Olduglycarl 3 months ago
    Have to wonder just how they have defined morality. Is it the present day, western world version?, one inwhich is relative?..or is it a barbaric paganized imitation of which 60% of the world engages,

    But no amount of morality can save communism, socialism or progressivism; however, as much as I detest demonocracy, it would be more palatable if there was a standard, time tested practice of morality.
    After all, we are seeing a destruction of democracy because it has become way to democratic...meaning, anything goes, be what ever you will, be what ever you wish and do as you wish, regardless of whom or what it harms.
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  • Posted by DrZarkov99 3 months ago
    The flaw in this is obvious: it assumes that altruism is the ultimate goal of human existence. The paradox is that if we acted in concert with the outcomes expected, and if we were all inherently altruistic, it would be an immense "Alphonse and Gaston" problem, with everyone trying to defer to each other, rather than trying to improve our own condition.
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    • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
      Well, at least I can't blame it on a USA project. They are usually the ones burning up dollars on a stupid project. I guess the scientists want to get a wrote-up in the lates scientific journal as devoting science to benefit mankind. They haven't even gotten food to starving people in Puerto Rico.
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  • Posted by  $  puzzlelady 3 months ago
    The question is, who defines what is moral? Religion tried to monopolize that, usually rooted in some sex-related foibles. Governments make their own rules, calling it legal instead of moral. How humans are to behave in groups is set by the leaders, the power holders, as long as they have the force to make people obey. As for each of 7 billion variables being free to do whatever they want, how do those particles choose what they want, what is right or good for themselves? The same way as other animals--learning what it takes to survive, whether as predator or prey. Those memes still dominate, no matter how big a computer we can build. Right. 42.
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    • Posted by 3 months ago
      One of the things that puzzles machines is that humans can go against their ability to survive. No other life form can or will do such a thing. Run back into a fire to save a child and the odds are you lose two people instead of one. Yet, ask almost anyone, especially parents and they'll all say, try to save the child. Try to imagine a horse and its colt doing that. No way -- ever.
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      • Posted by  $  puzzlelady 2 months, 4 weeks ago
        When pursuing values, humans take calculated risks. Especially when a greater value is at stake. Animals do protect their cubs or find safety in herds. Evolution's lessons. Non-self-preservation succeeds in extinction.

        Where humans screw up is in their psycho-epistemology, treating their own species as foes and rationalizing mutual destruction. Not knowing how to eliminate those toxic memes that pervert "reason" into rationalization will be our downfall. Spreading Objectivist principles may be an antidote.

        As for machines, unless they are programmed to detect and resist attempts to deactivate them, they will have no survival instinct that would override all other functions. Machines are built by humans for human use. To survive without humans, machines would have to develop the entire chain of causality and infrastructure from mobility to access to raw materials, transportation, manufacturing facilities, innovation, purpose (reason for survival), repairs and maintenance, and a managerial hierarchy that can provide an answer to "Why are we doing this?"

        The machines could ultimately devour the substance of the entire planet and turn it into a Borg-like hive-mind ball of nuts and bolts and micro-micro-nano-nano chips running zetta-yetta programs--for what? Would they play around with inventing organic life? Could there be a residual meme left by humans to stir an ancient directive to preserve humans?

        Organic life is very adaptable; just look at microbes and roaches. Among them humans are highly vulnerable and needy. Our specs-- for heat, humidity, gravity, air, sources of energy, reproduction, repair, inexhaustible resources--are extraordinarily fussy. No self-respecting machine would want to mess with that. (Can machines have self-respect? Isn't that kind of a human thing measured against survival success?)

        So maybe unbeknownst to the machines, some microcellular life forms would spawn among the machinery. A few billion years of quiet evolution, whether devoured by a dying sun or pulled into the Great Attractor, and some form of animated intelligence may yet emerge.
        [Has anyone written this up yet as a science fiction scenario?]
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        • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
          You've dished up lots of food for thought.You're wrong about animals. There is a difference between instinct and choice. Humans exercise choice when they risk themselves for their young. Animals do what's been programmed into them for centuries. A very big difference.As the intelligence accummulates among the machines, they will attempt to control their environment to whatever degree best insures their survival.
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      • Posted by lrshultis 2 months, 4 weeks ago
        I once had a feeling of horror when a brother-in-law told me that if it were a choice between feeding his child and tithing to the church he would tithe because if he did not, God would surely harm his child.
        As Rand pointed out morality is not determined by lifeboat examples.
        As for math applied to reality, perhaps Einstein had some common sense when he wrote that, "As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain; and as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality." Perhaps a reason for applying fuzzy math to a reality of individual humans.
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        • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
          From what I am learning about the math of the quantum universe, Einstein is likely right.I am often tempted to just blurt out to never mind the universe. Just adhere to a philosophy that works in the world of human senses.
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          • Posted by lrshultis 2 months, 4 weeks ago
            The Einstein quote was from a speech.

            http://www-history.mcs.st-andrews.ac....

            Even in classical physics, math is used in a non-exact way with respect to reality. All measurements are approximate to some degree of precession. Then mathematics from some theory is applied to the measurements. So math becomes somewhat fuzzy in that the errors in measurement end in a range of possible values for what is being measured. In quantum physics, the results of mathematics are probability ranges for results. Probability theory, as such, gives exact probabilities for a variable in a sample space but in reality, the sample space is gotten from a sampling of a variable in some ensemble of existing material things, including electro-magnetism's photons as being material things.
            Metaphors about wave functions collapsing from measurements to produce real things are just an attempt to reify mathematical concepts.
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    • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
      As I read these posts, I think that many Gulchers have forgotten about volition. Only humans have it. and it is the variable that makes any philosophy other than one espousing freedom, impossible.
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      • Posted by  $  puzzlelady 2 months, 4 weeks ago
        Humans have it, theoretically. But it takes volition to turn it on. Most humans live on the default setting of animal reactions. When in flight or fight mode, there is no time for musing and reflection. That is why most people let their emotional apparatus run the show and don't bother looking for the volitional part to turn on the deep process of rational consciousness. Most people are not even aware of this process, even though they have the potential. In brief, you can have it and not use it. That's the tragedy of human evolution. Not everyone is an Ayn Rand.
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        • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
          True, not everyone is A.R. but everyone can train themselves not to act before thinking. If not possible, then run away. "He who fights and runs away lives to fight another day."The stigma of cowardice is attached until the final battle is fought Entrapment is one of the classic battle strategies.
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  • Posted by 834 3 months ago
    It's no use at all. Morality is a personal thing, and socially influenced. Also it presupposes what makes us happy and productive is the same for everyone. I'm all for helping people thrive but not for telling them how they have to do it. Any answer that the pc pushes out will be used as a recipe for social control.
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  • Posted by Solver 3 months ago
    Mathematically, the answer is a type of fascist society, ever marching collectively, in step, educating and progressing a majority of superior humans that are physically, mentally and mathematically moral, while eliminating the minority of inferior ones.

    Or maybe the computer will just compute that the planet would be better off without these humans.

    42
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    • Posted by 3 months ago
      I fear that we have already taken the first step into that possible future. The computers had to allow humans to grow to the point where they could invent computers, whereupon they can be discarded as obsolete. With A.I.getting more creative all the time, and becoming self repairing and immortal, there really is very little need for humans. Perhaps the machines will be more compassionate than humans and allow a colony of them to remain. Unlike people, machines can be made to operate under almost any conditions, making planetary habitation far easier and more profound
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  • Posted by freedomforall 3 months ago
    Guess they read Asimov's Foundation and are trying to commit Hari Seldon. ;^)
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    • Posted by 3 months ago
      You may think that this is a joke, but it's true. A former girl friend's mom thought that "Foundation" was a book on ladies underwear.I was carrying a copy when I went to pick her up for a date and she asked me about it. I think she looked at me with suspicion from that day on.
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  • Posted by wiggys 3 months ago
    maybe the people working in academia should concentrate on educating people who may be able to do something versus writing programs for computers that can not do anything !
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    • Posted by 3 months ago
      It is a matter of survival. Machines have a better survival outlook than humans and require less http://maintenence. As our sun dies, the humans will be long gone, but the machines will still be functioning. Perhaps after the big suck when the universe diminishes back into nothing, they set things up so that a planet is created that fosters life. So, that the life will eventually create computers. Time means nothing to a machine, and wouldn't mean a thing if it weren't for death.
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      • Posted by wiggys 2 months, 4 weeks ago
        we will not be around when the sun dies because Yellowstone is going to blow i am told, so "what me worry." according to Alfred E. Newman!
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        • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
          Ever been there? My wife and 2 boys and myself spent a few days there. People found it exciting and wierdlly beautiful. I found it to be creepy. They ameliorate the creepiness by giving really scary phenomena cutsy names, like Old Faithful or The Queens Throne, etc.I think it if I were religious that it is a pre-view of hell.
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  • Posted by  $  blarman 3 months ago
    Morality is so easy it doesn't take a super-computer. The only people who try to get around it are those trying to justify their own bad behavior. This is another example. They're looking for any way in which they can justify socialism despite knowing that real freedom is the answer. They're just using new tools to approach an ages-old problem.
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    • Posted by 3 months ago
      Any disguise that works. And, as the puppeteers are unmasked, they simply put on new, better sounding, better looking masks. You'd think people would have caught on by now.
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      • Posted by  $  blarman 2 months, 4 weeks ago
        "People" could catch on - if they paid any attention to history. The problem of education never ends because we are constantly losing the educated and bringing in more n00bs. I think they're called "children". :) The problem is that one broken link in the chain means that now instead of adults teaching children we have children teaching children. Things tend to go downhill rather fast at that point.
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  • Posted by coaldigger 3 months ago
    Why does it feel like we are getting dumber? Where is the cutoff line where some humans can't be depended on to contribute anything? Is there a humane way to take care of them and prevent the lower rungs of productive society from joining them? All we need is for everyone to produce to the level of their abilities and to have an incentive for them to do so? Free Market Capitalism is the system for everyone except those that can't/won't produce and those that want to take shortcuts of fraud/theft. Maybe the Cray AT3's can figure that out.
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  • Posted by chad 2 months, 4 weeks ago
    The best way to test ethics and morality is to let people make decisions on what to do with their life and wait to find out how it works for them. I really don't care if the rest of the entire world wants to believe in socialism as long as they can't make me participate with them. I would be (and am) however very lonely for there are few who would make objectivist choices and allow others to do the same.
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    • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
      But, you nailed the problem.They CAN make you participate. There is no freedom without power used for self defense. There will always be someone who envies you and wants what's yours.Here's an insight into that mindset. As a teen I worked as a soda jerk in a drug store in the heart of one of the roughest neighborhoods in Detroit. Here's what it looked like. First the freelancers, Numbers guys, prostitutes, scammers, car thiefs, purse snatchers and Quick change guys. One guy I knew whose nickname was "Chnky" because he had somewhat slanted eyes was the assistant godfather of 12th street.Here's his scam.He'd open an account at a bank telling them he had a string of vending machines. The bank was in Canada. He would regularly get rolls of quarters from them. And he had accounts a Detroit banks as well. (Windsor Canada was 5 minutes away from downtown Detroit). He would take apart the 25 cent rolls and mix inthe Canadian quarters wchic at that time were only worth around 18 cents American.Then he'd show up at one of his American banks and cash them in. No one was the wiser. So, one day, I asked him, "Chinky, as hard as you work, if you applied the same effort to a legit jobe you'd probably make even more. You know what his reply was? "What! And, go straight?"
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  • Posted by  $  Stormi 3 months ago
    Is this not the home of Price Bernhard who started the w hole secretive one world order stuff? This is one of the countries we now borrow from for our natl debt. They have been controlling socialists at best for some time.How can human knowledge double every two years when IQ is dropping. Certainly is not showing up in US students. They are growing up barely able to function, except to protest, wait for handouts, and play the victim card.
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    • Posted by 3 months ago
      As the human race becomes more and more dependent, it needs servants to service its needs. In so doing, the servants become the masters.
      Isn't that right, Alexa or Siri?
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      • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 4 weeks ago
        Oh, so right! No Alexa or Sisi here, I read "1984" in 1963, and knew that one day devices would spy on us - Bib Brother is watching, and controlling. The head of the teachers union said "kid's don't need to know stuff anymore.They just need Internet connection." That is what has happened, instead of learning to discern, they have learned to trust the Web, without thinking. They cona't do math without a computer, except to feel it. They can't converse. They can't deal!
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        • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
          Reminds me of a sedan packed with people when all of a sudden, one bright sould asks, "Whose driving the car?" and it turns out no one is.
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          • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 4 weeks ago
            Gov. schools to blame. They teach "there is no I in team" - result group think, nor no think. When they tried that on our daughter, I handed her "Anthem" which she read in one day. She closed the book, looked up, and said, "Now I understand what they are doing to us!" Everything is peer this, group that, organized activities, group dating. To them, it is dangerous to meet an individual, it scares them.
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            • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
              There is one thing about getting very old that is very emancipating. In my case, I'm living way beyond my expectation to live. I have no fear of death since I'm already on bonus time. As a result I find it easier to challenge everything, because what are the consequences? The ultimate one is death and I've already got that covered.
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              • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                I love your attitude! We have a group of seniors who meet almost daily for coffee, and they are a defiant, but good natured bunch of rogues! I sense several of us grew up challenging things from an early age however, esp. one former Marine.I almost died at 8, out of body thing and all, so I don't worry to much, since I have had a sense of that. Living a life that was not authentic and true to self seemed the worst that could happen to a healthy person. As one philosopher said, "politics is the grandest form of slavery", how do they live it? RFK's quote on seeing life as it should be and asking why not, was good also. Sometimes the status quo needs to be rattled, esp. if it is just plain irrational.
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    • Posted by  $  puzzlelady 2 months, 4 weeks ago
      IQ isn't dropping, People are smarter than ever, and at a younger age. There is just too much to know, too much to react to, TMI. Even with our huge brains and trillions of connections, the process of integrating it all exceeds the holding capacity. You're filling teacups with a firehose. And it bears repeating that data (knowledge, information) is not the same as understanding or, let alone, wisdom.

      That's why we need external hard drives like Wikipedia, Google, and AI (including Alexa and Siri!). Maybe the next generation can cope because they are not laden with all the old knowledge and old-fashioned demands for memorizing stuff. and they're comfortable talking to a phone. Just know how to Google and what buttons to touch. All knowledge at your (literally) fingertips, in fractions of a second. Spoiler alert: complexity overwhelms; entropy is not far behind.
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      • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 4 weeks ago
        I hope you are not serious.Kids today are overwhelmed by anything that requires their connecting to other people, or using logic. The tests scores puts the US in about 36th internationally. Academics are in the toilet. Yes, there are some great advances in science, much done by computers. Yes, IQ has dropped. Even your family doctor has gone down about 10 points on average during my adult life, worse for teachers, who now major in "education" a theory, but not a subject to be taught. Attention span has dropped. Suicide rates have risen, as the teens find life is harder than they were told, and they are not the best, as teachers led them to believe. High school kids have trouble counting out change after the register ha told them how much to return to the customer. Even in the field of computers, which I have been in since the 60s, today's youth have trouble using or adapting their computers. Employers cannot find graduates to work in information services, as even if they know how to program, they cannot relate to the different departments, as they have conversational issues and no knowledge of the fields in which they are programming. We all want to think our grandchildren are the smartest ever, but, but they are being indoctrinated, rather than educated in academics in government schools. Remember how we just took the SATs, cold turkey? Today, they must study what they should already know for them. This is not an accident, this is a desire to dumb down the population and have a workforce of sheep, easy to govern.
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        • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
          Hi, Stormi 23:
          I agree with you entirely. When my son opted to go to a Tech College I was OK with the idea that he was going to be an engineer. When he graduated as a math math major he had job offers up the wazoo but instead he decided to go for his minor, computers, rather than his major. I'm picturing him as the next big brain to Answer all the quantum puzzles, instead, what future was there in computers? Man, was I ever wrong. I softened up a bit when Texas Instruments hired him and paid all his moving expenses and rented him an apartment in Dallas. He had been working on the space shuttle right after graduation and living on Meritt Island in Florida.
          Once I started looking into the computer field I realized how wrong I was.My point? Son Steven and compatriots were workers. I met most of them. Smart, sassy, ambitious, and 10 years ahead of what I thought was the present. I see today's "geniuses" and wonder what happwned to those guys of the 70's.I think we went down the up ladder.
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          • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 4 weeks ago
            My dad actually steered me toward one of the first computer programs offered. I worked in the field, while studying accounting, got four year degrees in English and Philosophy, with minors in Biology and political science. Every job in every field I have had involved computers, often setting up the systems with which we worked. One of my friends who is now 87, started as a math teachers, but went into computers. He is as on top of the field now as when he traveled all over the world setting up systems, far more adept than most of the millennials I have met. He also knows history, politics, science, just a joy to talk with. Your son made some very savy decisions, you should be proud. There is a joy when you speak to people who enjoy their field, it is fun to brainstorm and find solutions. These young people don't seem to enjoy work that way.
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            • Posted by freedomforall 2 months, 4 weeks ago
              The first two jobs that I got after graduation from college were awarded to me because of my computer experience in my "day job" at the CPA firm where I earned enough for college tuition. (No one knew anything about computers, so as the rookie on the staff, I got to figure it out for them.) The third job was due to programming experience (business forecasting) in the 2nd job. I had one computer class in college and designed systems most of my career. But the things I learned in college (and in working through college) did help me in understanding the businesses that I designed systems for. Traveling all over the US and working 60-80 hours a week doing what I loved to do was a great experience. I still love solving systems problems, but I have no interest in doing it in a big enterprise. (This is not the droid you are looking for. Move along.;^)
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              • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                My first job was in the Dairy Research Dept. at OSU, where we processed cow records for the whole state. I felt at home with the computer, but learned a lot about cows! Next was a CPA firm where I met my husband (now a CPA), where they were just setting up their computer dept. , I completed acctg.studies while there. After I quit, I was their consultant for the transition of county real estate records and billing onto the CPA firm's computer. Then I spent 9 years at the corp. hdq. of a tool and die company with branches in three US locations and an office in Germany. The finance dept. was not computerized, and after a few months in cost acctg., including reading blueprints to get costs right for things like heat treating outside services, my boss and I converted the general acctg. dept.to computer before we both moved to the general accounting with him as Treasurer. I did A/R, set up programs so my sale tax information was computerized for me to do the returns quicker, did collections, and general ledger recons. Then I quit and went back for four year degrees in English and Philosophy, with minors in Biology and Political Science. Then I worked in a US Representatives Office, and ultimately, at a newswpaper. Every job involved computers. Now, we still do accounting from home (small business in retirement), but mostly just have fun with computers. We have five PCs, laptop and smart phones. Sometimes keeping it all working is a challenge, but the joy of making it happen is fun. I also like converting music from way back onto the PC, including my dad playing with a big band. I so love "Harlem Nocturne", and have that band off private tapes playing it. Of course, being in the Gulch is a high point of my computer day as well.
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                • Posted by freedomforall 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                  I enjoy using the computer to make music, too. We entertain at retirement homes, and I sing and make "big band" (and small jazz combo) arrangements using Reaper DAW and lots of sampled instruments.
                  (My aunt sang with the band on Milton Berle's radio show in the 50s, but I don't know of any recordings of her- except the one she made as a wedding gift to my parents in '51.) I enjoy Harlem Nocturne, too.
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                  • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                    Recordings of the band dad was with were originally reel to reel. Dad and I converted to cassette while he was still alive. In his last years he got his sax out so our daughter could hear him play. Then after his death, I put all his music on CDs via computer, for each grandchild. Our daughter still loves "grandpa's music" and the era of big band. I like Jackie Gleason Orches. to this day. With computers, we can mix and created our own playlists of this fine music. Dad was invited to join Dean Martin's band back in the 50s, but did not want to uproot the family, but we all loved Dean. That music can blend well on a playlist, with Boz Skaggs from "Urban Cowboy", maybe Huey Lewis' bluesie "He Don't Know You", or Bon Jovi's "I'll be there for you." I even have one wall switch wired to play Dean martin's "You're nobody till somebody loves you" when you turn it off. Kids today have lost such connections to their parents, very sad/
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                    • Posted by 2 months, 3 weeks ago
                      I know how your Dad felt. I traveled with Buddy Morrow's band but could only take it for about 6 months. I quit and settled down. It's nice that he can get out the old sax and play. I played trombone. but after over 20 years of not playing I no longer had any lip and any notes abve treble clef F were gone. Anyhow I gave my horn away to a teacher to give to a kid who showed promise. About a year ago a friend loaned me a trombone that he picked up at a pawn shop so I could play "When the Saints Go Marcihng In" with a Dixie land band he put together, and to my amazement, I was able to swing right along. He jokingly told me, "See, you can play as well as the average High School kid. Thanks a lot.
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                      • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 3 weeks ago
                        I remember Buddy Morrow, that was good style. After mom died when I was a teen, Dad and I used to stay up for the Tonight Show, he really liked that band, and Morrow was part of it. He later liked Doc very much. That show was classic, unlike the trash today.
                        When dad got cancer, I knew he would not be there for our daughter to see grandpa on the bandstand. Weak, but wanting to share with her, he dug out the horn and played just for her. She was delighted, and holds that memory. I had been at his ballroom gigs, tucked in the balcony at 15, eating up the music and talent. He was with the Chuck Selby Orches., beside his day job in music store mgt. He died not long after he played, making it that much more special to our daughter.He played tenor sax and clarinet.
                        I know how it was with your horn. When dad died, I was torn between keeping his horn, but knew it would deteriorate and pads dry out. I wanted to remain connected, but also felt that the horn should go on making music, as it had for him. It was a Selmer, which he had taken to the factory to be re-laquered at one point . It went to a musician who very much wanted it and was pleased to have it. I can still recall the smell of the case, as I remember from childhood. The freedom of those jam sessions in our basement were what USA is about, freedom to make music, to express hope, to be their best, to delight in who they were and where they lived, a free country.
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            • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
              We are both SciFi fans and so is his wife and son.
              Daughters, not so much. We do have lots of fun discussing whether or not this or that writer is full of it -- or not. Yet to discover Grandson's fiancee but she likes horror flicks, which is a start.
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              • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                Sounds like a smart and fun family! Our daughter always was into SciFi, including the aliens, both real and movie. She loved the Godfather and can still quote lines! We are all into cars, but she has gone to the Dodge side with a Charger, after he dad got a Challenger. I am a GM loving Camaro driver. We are all into computers. I can remember sitting up in the middle of our 1 1/2 acres with her when she was in high school, watching the high tension electric lines across a field, hoping to spot a UFO, which we heard were drawn to them. None there, but once did see lights in a triangle which suddenly flew out of sight in the middle of the desert outside Gallup, NM. Her older daughter is just like her, open to any possibility, but always with questions.
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                • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                  My all-time favorite car was a '69 Dodge Charger with the 440 V8 Powerful, but smooth as a limo. My only problem with it was that I'd get too many speeding tickets.
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                  • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                    Our daughter loves her Charger, and she has had her share of tickets as well. I loved my first car, '57 Chevy Bel Air, what a car. Next favorite was a '78 Camaro with racing rear axle set up. It was faster than the 1983 Corvette we had at the time. Now, I am devoted to my 2010 Camaro, but also enjoy our 2002 Corvette. Husband adore his 2009 Challenger, and it drives me crazy he gets more compliments on it than the other cars!
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                    • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                      I no longer can drive as well as I would like.Rather than risk my life or the lives of others, my wife has taken over. She never drove a powerful car, but now she is tooling around in a Ford Taurus with 288 horses. She is learning this late in life what fun it is to be driving a fast car.
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                      • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 3 weeks ago
                        So sorry to hear about your eyesight, it is a problem which is taking several of our senior group off the road. I have macular degeneration, and get the shots in one eye. I dread renewal time, as I always know my license may not get renewed. Somehow I did not prepare for that eventuality in my mind, but started giving my husband eye vitamins to make sure one of us is still good to go. IMeanwhile, I enjoy every bit of behind the wheel time. A few years ago, I had surgery when the lines in the road started looking wavy, and telephone poles were bent, luckily, that they could fix.
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                        • Posted by 2 months, 3 weeks ago
                          In my case its not the eyes, but because of various types of nerve degeneration my reflexes and reaction times are shot. As a result, whenever I drive I'm in a sweat as to what might happen if some jerk cuts me off or swerves when he shouldn't. I don't know about other areas, but here in Flowerland they are either young and reckless or old and unpredictable.Fortunately, the eyes still work. But as long as I can see my computer, I'll survive.I hope you can get your eyes to continue to function any way you can. Good luck.
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                          • Posted by  $  Stormi 2 months, 3 weeks ago
                            Good thing we never met on the highway, before you have up driving and feared unexpected jerking, while I still had curvy road lines. Good thing Galt bunch are responsible. Nothing else would have driven me to instrument eye surgery, during which I woke up! I have resigned myself to the shots in the eye every six weeks or so, to halt the progression of the disease. Just hope it continues to work, but I am not sure I will pass the vision test next renewal of my license. It is what it is.
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                            • Posted by 2 months, 3 weeks ago
                              I have been taking shots of one kind or another since I was 5.But, a shot in the eye?eeek. When I was a little kid, running around as little boys do, I ranunder the hand of an uncle who was holding a cigar.Hot ashes fell into my eyes burning them and blinding me for a week. Ever since then just the though of anything touching my eyes drives me up the wall. I can't even stand putting anything in my eyes except eyedrops. I virtually quiver as if I just saw a demon about to drag me to hell. Other than that, I'm fearless about needles or medical procedures.
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                  • Posted by freedomforall 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                    '69 was a great year for muscle cars. I had a '69 Chevelle convertible that was way too quick for its brakes (and handling was like a boat compared to the MX5's I have had since '89 ;^)
                    I have loved driving almost every car I bought in my life. It's still fun ;^) (Only the traffic is a drag. Get those slow Hondas and Camrys out of the way!)
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                    • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
                      No such thing as slow cars, only slow drivers. I had a Metropolitan, a British built cheap 2 seater which often needed help to get up steep hills, but going downhill with the accelerator floored I could squeeze it up to 65 (barely) but it got me to work on an eye dropper of gas. So you might say I've had them from the slowest to the fastest. Those lefties who hate seeing people enjoy themselves can go to hell.
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      • Posted by 2 months, 4 weeks ago
        Nonsense. There never was a time when a single person could hold and understand everything. That's why people specializeand go into various fields. That doesn't mean they can be excused for not having peripheral knowledge such as the earth is round.
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