Can friendship or any relationship be unconditional?
Posted by rashisway 6 years, 3 months ago to Philosophy
Any relationship deemed unconditional is meaningless. If a person enjoys unconditional support from another, it implies that the support comes without any cost, irrespective of the actions, ideas, thoughts and choices of another. Since these are the very core of someone's identity, unconditional relationships are basically independent of the people involved, thus proving to be meaningless.
This came from an episode that happened a while ago, where someone claimed that a friend is not supposed to argue or oppose one's actions but support them. What amazed me was, this is actually accepted among the masses. What has happened to common sense and the basic concept of right and wrong among people? When I read Atlas Shrugged, I thought, Ayn Rand has depicted certain exaggerated versions of people in order to emphasize the importance of what she is conveying. I never thought I would actually see the Jim Taggarts, Bertram Scudders and Simon Pritchetts, and Philip Reardens coming to life. I used to think that her words just ring true when you read them and would happen to everyone who read it. I mean why would anybody identify with Jim Taggart and not try to change himself after having clearly been shown the right kind of people. Now, coming in touch with people in college I realise how terribly faulty was that thought.
This came from an episode that happened a while ago, where someone claimed that a friend is not supposed to argue or oppose one's actions but support them. What amazed me was, this is actually accepted among the masses. What has happened to common sense and the basic concept of right and wrong among people? When I read Atlas Shrugged, I thought, Ayn Rand has depicted certain exaggerated versions of people in order to emphasize the importance of what she is conveying. I never thought I would actually see the Jim Taggarts, Bertram Scudders and Simon Pritchetts, and Philip Reardens coming to life. I used to think that her words just ring true when you read them and would happen to everyone who read it. I mean why would anybody identify with Jim Taggart and not try to change himself after having clearly been shown the right kind of people. Now, coming in touch with people in college I realise how terribly faulty was that thought.
We have all had our hardships. I have friends who have been raped. Others dead from drugs, or violence.
Good people who offered to help an estranged wife go get her stuff, all killed by the psycho laying in wait.
The survivors of many horrible things.
What I believe makes us Americans, and makes us good people is the willingness to come out the other end and BE BETTER FOR IT. To overcome. To do MORE than just get by, but to thrive DESPITE (or because of) these atrocities we have faced.
It is not always easy, in fact it is terrible at times. I remember a young rape survivor who was good in school (barely High School), and almost dropped out w/o finishing because the event overwhelmed her. She had a lot of help... But I hope that my message helped as well:
you can either choose to let this define how miserable you are going to be for the rest of your life. Or you can be like Ayaan Hirsi Ali and let it power a drive inside of you... You are sitting here worried about what people think of you... When you are not giving them anything inspirational to see... Focus, work, overcome... And nobody has to know, in fact, nobody will suspect. BTW, she got to a better placed and moved out of state where nobody knows her, and she is thriving.
The point being: we SHOULD EXPECT MORE from those we are in relationships with, and we should hold them to a higher standard.
The current education system, and no winners/losers sports DOES NOT do this. And unfortunately, the families are disintegrating. The only thing we could afford growing up were values and rules. I am grateful for them both!
Technically I suppose two people related by blood will always be "related" in some sense, but if that person becomes more trouble than he's worth, one should be open to breaking off contact, and even moving far away and/or changing name to make it hard for that person to find you again.
My father -> daughter Relationship is unconditional. We are related.
The tone and tenor of that Relationship is QUITE Conditional. When she was young, I would reminder her:
I am not punishing YOU I am punishing your behavior. I LOVE YOU, I do not like your SPECIFIC BEHAVIOR.
So, I will change the word to Friendship. (True Friendship based on caring).
Yep, every Friendship must be conditional on the values set forth that should not be violated. My daughter had a friend,
who spun out of control, hanging with the wrong people, drinking under age, etc. etc. etc. My daughter terminated the
friendship. The person was beyond help, and did not want any. She recently hit bottom, and reached out to my daughter,
and apologized. I was proud of my daughter for saying they can be friends again, but ONLY if she is done with the bad
behavior.
In fact, SOCIETY works because we are SOCIAL. And the FIRST FORM of punishment is OSTRACISM from the group.
If you cannot abide by societies rules, you do not belong, go out on your own.
The same goes for people. I love my daughter unconditionally (just not all her behaviors, lol). But I was clear with her...
Go out and start doing drugs... And you might as well pack your bags. I will sooner dig your grave and bury you, then to
help you. The decision cannot be undone in my mind. I explained that watching friends and family members abuse drugs
teaches you real quick that the fear is not that they don't work... But that they do! (ie, they make you feel better). Because if
they work, then when and why should you stop doing them?
In the end, people will find their own values, and they may cause you to not be able to relate to them. But if you care about them, I imagine you would be able to talk to them. I also know from real life experience that "what people believe" is far more powerful than the "truth".
Shallow people tend to believe the first thing that they are told.
What people want to believe very often overwrites reality and can have a huge and devastating impact on relationships.
So there's not really anything my kids could do that would make me sever my relationship with them (that's my CHOICE) - although there are certainly things I could do that would have that result, and justifiably so. After reading the rest of the comments, I'd like to append: certainly, just because I love them without condition - that doesn't mean I will put up with anything they choose to do, or accept any way they might decide to treat me. But the love will always be there...whether demonstrated or not.
However, voluntary relationships (husband and wife, especially) cannot be unconditional and continue to have value, unless one or the other partner is willing to put up with ANY behavior from the other, and would continue the relationship regardless (at that point, "value" is meaningless). Given the ~50% divorce rate, whether people choose to recognize it or not, marriages (and other romantic relationships) are never unconditional.
BTW for me and my husband, this is an EXPLICITLY STATED fact. Our marriage is not unconditional.
Friendships on the other hand, are by definition, conditional...unless there is a condition that binds them, ie, one own's the other for one's life or condition of life but even those friendships can and are broken.
You are born into a family by happenstance, not by choice. Common blood is not a sentence, it is a bond. But that bond needs to be based on reality, not blood. My adopted (my wife's -34 years married) son's son (my grandson) stole many of my silver and gold coins, chainsaws, guns, tools (about $16,000).. to finance his drugs and electronic shit. I loved this kid from birth until I found out what he had stolen (he was about 17) and he was living with me at the time. When I asked him, face to face, did he take my wife's gold necklace ($6500) he said, "No." He is now 21 and has been in and out of jail (currently in jail, six months for driving DUI, no insurance). Relationships are based on CHARACTER and VALUES, nothing else (IMHO)
1 : the state of being related or interrelated
studied the relationship between the variables
2 : the relation connecting or binding participants in a relationship: such as
a : kinship
b : a specific instance or type of kinship
3 a : a state of affairs existing between those having relations or dealings
had a good relationship with his family
b : a romantic or passionate attachment
I had a drunken mother and left home at 15 but I am still "Related" by birth regardless of that condition, like your wife, I choose not to nurture that relatedness.
I think we are using "relations" differently.
In my mind, the only relationship that is unconditional or what some call, "Unconditional Love", only exists between living matter and that which that caused it to exist in the first place...doesn't matter if it was chance, purposed or consequential.
1 : the state of being related or interrelated
studied the relationship between the variables
2 : the relation connecting or binding participants in a relationship: such as
a : kinship
b : a specific instance or type of kinship
3 a : a state of affairs existing between those having relations or dealings
had a good relationship with his family
b : a romantic or passionate attachment
By Birth, you have, like it or not, a relationship with Mom, Dad, sisters and brothers; Etc, whether or not you chose to nurture that relationship.
Friendships, on the other hand, are voluntary exchanges, therefore conditional.
I did check several to make sure it wasn't a "Progressively" revised definition.
Merriam-Webster is usually right on with historical definitions for the most part.
How about: You have a "Kinship" with Mom, Dad and Siblings but you do not carry on a relationship with them.
But, sorry, Kinship in this example is unconditional...
To me the reason the word relationship doesn't work in this context is the question of it being unconditional. Relationship in that context is a choice. I would contend that a "relative" is a fact and still not sure the word unconditional fits because there is no choice.
When religion gets involved their belief that they are superior because they forgive whoever will destroy them that demonstrates the true result of unconditional "love" for they are used and abused by all. The same happens when you have a government that makes the same demand of its citizenry when it states that everyone must accept their use of force unconditionally until such time as the citizens can convince the governors that they are wrong, then they might relinquish.