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PEOPLE WILL DIE!!

Posted by Storo 2 years, 2 months ago to Government
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So over the years I've asked many people "If I __, (you fill in the blank) does that mean I won't die?"
I usually ask this of people who feel they have the right get on my face and harangue me about smoking.
The answer, of course, is invariably "No.", but that doesn't seem to ring any bells in their empty heads.
The same is true of Obamacare. If you have Obamacare it does not mean you won't die. But listening to Demagogues..err....Democrats, they have been coming out of the woodwork telling us about all the people who will die if Obamacare is repealed.
Yes, people will die. They will die in car wrecks, they will die of old age, they will die in drive-by shootings, they will die from cancer, they will die from heart disease, alcoholism, liver failure, stroke, aortic aneurysms, seizures, drug overdoses, and a myriad of other causes. But they won't die for not having Obamacare.
The fact is that people die every day. And Obamacare can prevent very few of these deaths, and the few people it does "save" will ultimately die anyway. We all do.
So why are the leftist Democrats so upset that Republicans are trying to repeal Obamacare? It is simply that Obamacare was passed to get the votes of those who would benefit from it.
The Socialist Democrats have had power, and have clung to it for so long by providing the ignorant, greedy masses free stuff at taxpayer expense ever since the last Roosevelt administration. And it really ramped up after World War II. Roosevelt passed a few things during the depression, but the real ramp up in government giveaways began with Lyndon Johnson's "Great Society" programs of the 1960s, which to date has cost taxpayers an estimated $40 Trillion with no discernible results.
In the beginning Democrats could get votes by knocking off the little things - like a modest Social Security benefit to keep old people from being destitute. Or a modest unemployment benefit during the Great Depression. However, once these small things had been handed out, they needed more things to give away for free to get the votes they needed to stay in power. And the more they try to find stuff to create new entitlements, the bigger and bigger the things they find are.
Which brings us to today.
Obamacare is arguably the biggest, farthest reaching giveaway yet. It is 17% of our National Economy! It encompasses every aspect of our lives. It's passage, despite Obama's claims to the contrary, has resulted in millions losing the healthcare plans they had and liked, ever increasing costs, ever increasing premiums, ever more limited providers, ever decreasing choices, and fewer people covered. Billions (Trillions over 10 years?) are in play. People be damned.
The primary goal of Obamacare - wait for it - is to do so much damage to the US Healthcare system that the only option left is a government, single payer healthcare system. Think Canada or England, where people routinely wait anywhere from 6 months to 3 years for a simple MRI. People under these systems also routinely die while waiting to see their doctor or a specialist, or they are denied certain treatments because they are too old, or too sick. That's reality under a government, single payer system.
There are other realities that will come into play with a single payer government healthcare system. Think government is already too intrusive into your life? Under single payer the government can promulgate all manner of new regulations (no legislation required) that dictate to you what you can eat (think banning fast food) what you can drink (think 18oz sodas), where you can live (think environmental impact), where you can work (think coal mines) what games you can play (think banning football) all in the name of being safe and having a "healthy lifestyle", in the delusional hope of holding down healthcare costs.
EDITOR'S NOTE: it also gives leftist politicians a hellava lot of power over a big chunk of our economy, and thus our lives.
It will also result in restrictions on how much and what kind of medical treatment you can get. Think death panels. If you're
80 years old, suffering from heart disease, you could be deemed too old and have limited years to benefit from a heart transplant. In other words, death panels. In other words, people will die.
I will die some day, and so will you. There is nothing that can prevent that. Some will die earlier than others, and there's no way to predict or prevent that either.
An elderly friend of mine recently said "I've lived so long that my doctor tells me that if I want to live longer I have to give up everything that makes living worthwhile."
So it will be with single payer. The difference is that my friend currently has a choice. Under single payer, that choice is gone.


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  • Posted by  $  blarman 2 years, 2 months ago
    One of my favorite explanations of risk was given by Milton Friedman when talking about the Ford Pinto. He correctly points out that the issue was not a matter of whether or not Ford did the right thing, but that risk mitigation ALWAYS comes with a cost and people must be free to decide for themselves at what cost that mitigation provides value to them. This is the key that many people fail to understand.

    Getting out of bed in the morning involves the risk of tripping over your shoes. Climbing a flight of stairs involves the risk of falling down them or inducing a heart attack. Driving a car involves the risk of some other lunatic running a red light and t-boning you. Everything we do has ramifications for the future we have little or no control over, yet people act as if either they can control everything or as if they are unjustified victims to everything that happens to them. The reality is somewhere in the middle. The choice is to control the important things while letting things we can't control slide. Otherwise we spend a lot of time and angst worrying and complaining instead of just getting things done.
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    • Posted by preimert1 2 years, 2 months ago
      Reminds me of the commercial where I kid's mom wrapped him in bubble wrap before he could play hoops with his buds. they promptly pushed him over and had fun rolling him around on the court. I laughed every time it played
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  • Posted by  $  Ben_C 2 years, 2 months ago
    All excellent comments. "People Will Die" while the physician is trying to figure out the computer code to use to be compliant with health insurance policies. The hidden ice burg is the insane bureaucracy thrust upon the medical profession by government which adds to their workload. Patients rarely see the room of people filing out paperwork and searching for a code to submit for payment. Thanks to government and "ambulance chasers" the medical field is not what it used to be nor will it ever regain the stature it once had. Glad I entered veterinary medicine and stayed away from human medicine. I get to do what I love to do without the hassle.
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  • Posted by jerryconn 2 years, 2 months ago
    You have to look just at Canada or England, You just need look at the VA here to see what O'Care is and certainly what a single payer system would look like.
    The other comment is No One gets out of here alive , we are all going to die. Healthcare is meant to make the time we have here as good as it can be. nothing more.
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  • Posted by Herb7734 2 years, 2 months ago
    We have lost sight of the fact that providing healthcare is not the job of the government. Healthcare is the job of the medical profession. Paying for it is the job of the person receiving the services. Insurance which is paid for by the the person paying the premiums in a gamble to to see who winds up paying for the medical service. Once the government got involved it has become a tangled web of who pays who for what. The Democrats struggle mightily to to squeeze the system into as close as possible to a single payer system.The Republicans want to get it as close to free market as possible. Up until Obamacare it was generally accepted that the USA had the best overall system, and Britain and Canada were held out as examples of single payer where people had to wait 6 months to get a MRI. Now, how far from sanity are we at present?
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  • Posted by DrZarkov99 2 years, 2 months ago
    Don't trust the polls that say the majority want to keep Obamacare. The Dems always trot out the moochers that have heavily subsidized policies with no deductibles to show how well Obamacare is working. The middle class struggle with expensive premiums and high deductibles that make any payments by the insurer rare. However, the attempt by the Republicans to create a replacement is hesitant, unimaginative, and uninspiring. There are so much better ways to create options to get the government out of the market and return the relationship to between doctor and patient instead of government and insurer, with both doctor and patient becoming roadkill.
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  • Posted by  $  gharkness 2 years, 2 months ago
    "The primary goal of Obamacare - wait for it - is to do so much damage to the US Healthcare system that the only option left is a government, single payer healthcare system. "

    Yes, thank you! I thought you'd never get there! This is the actual ultimate result they are looking for. Some I am aware of are even coming out and saying so. They don't characterize it as "damaging" the current Healthcare system. I think they call it "improving" it, but I am unable to discern how any of their "improvements" do anything BUT damage it.
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  • Posted by jimjamesjames 2 years, 2 months ago
    OvomitCare was DESIGNED to fail to bring us closer to single-payer. The GOPoop is playing right into that by keeping any of it alive.

    Rand Paul has the answer. Why is it not being discussed by the congress critters? Because it would make them and their looter friends unneeded.

    https://www.paul.senate.gov/imo/media...
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    • Posted by freedomforall 2 years, 2 months ago
      Repeal of Obamacare in its entirety is the first step. Killing off all other federal laws interfering with the free market in medical care is the second.
      Paul does not go far enough to solve the problem caused by federal meddling that protects entrenched players (e.g., big pharma, alopathic service providers) from competition.
      Making the expenses of health care tax deductible does not lower costs to patients; it just encourages the service providers to raise prices.
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      • Posted by jimjamesjames 2 years, 2 months ago
        No disagreement there FFA.

        Why not: Obamacare is repealed, everyone get insurance as you see fit and can afford.

        Of course the answer is: rent seekers/looters/parasites would be left out of the equation.
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        • Posted by freedomforall 2 years, 2 months ago
          Insurance is not health, contrary to the propaganda.
          If only the other 99% could see past the propaganda and understand.
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          • Posted by jimjamesjames 2 years, 2 months ago
            Reality: not everyone has health insurance.

            Reality: EVERYONE gets health care when they show up at an ER.

            My wife worked as a ER RN at a large hospital in Bakersfield, California, for 3 years. In one 12-hour shift, the ER did 284 intakes, 23 intakes per hour. A new one walking in every three minutes.

            No one was turned away, even the drug seekers, the drunks, the phony heart attacks, the tiny scratches, the bug bites, etc.
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            • Posted by freedomforall 2 years, 2 months ago
              Not everyone wants health insurance as required by Obamacare.
              One size does not fit all, and all should not have to pay for the cost of others who choose to take higher risks, or voluntarily choose a specific lifestyle that entails greater voluntary costs, e.g., maternity, abortion, diseases related to sexually activity, AIDS, travel to 3rd world countries where diseases, parasites, etc thrive.
              The free market once offered health insurance with a reasonably priced menu of risks. Only the free market can fix the mess created by 80 years of government meddling. TANSTAAFL.
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              • Posted by 2 years, 2 months ago
                You're right - not everyone wants health insurance. Especially if they are young, single, no kids, operating a small business, have a one-man business, and the like.
                Large employers offer health insurance as a benefit, and pay part of the cost. My last job gave me employee-plus-one coverage for about $50 per month. Family coverage was about $150 per month. But the real cost of that insurance for me was about $800 per month.
                Everybody gets hung up on presumably having to pay for healthcare for others who "love an unhealthy lifestyle". But insurance has always been backed by large groups of people who have policies, and thus spread the risk of catastrophic illness over a large group. That's because the large group won't require a heart transplant, just a few.
                What bothers me is that I have always had a choice of what coverage to buy - individual, employee-plus-one, or family coverage. Under Obamacare there is only one plan, because Obamacare mandates what coverages you will buy. I'm a 69-year old male, and I don't believe I will need maternity coverage any time soon, but Obamacare says I must buy it. And I know I am speculating, but it would not surprise me to learn that the reason men under Obamacare must have maternity coverage is to have a bigger pot of money available to pay Planned Parenthood to perform abortions for those women who want one, and hide it as "women's health".
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              • Posted by jimjamesjames 2 years, 2 months ago
                As my ol' man used to say, "You buys your ticket, you takes your ride."

                Now, government wants to dictate what you buy, how much you pay, where you go, how you get there, what happens to you when you arrive. It's NONE of government business what I buy and where I want to go.
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                • Posted by 2 years, 2 months ago
                  My grandmother used to say:
                  "You pays your money, and you takes your chances."
                  I can't think of a better description of Obamacare, or one-payer government-run medicine.
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  • Posted by  $  Olduglycarl 2 years, 2 months ago
    The Cry: People will die! is a ruse taken right from Rules for Radicals...only things have change since hiltery, Alinsky and Cloward and Piven wrote those rules...now the creatures that spout and shout are, in fact, completely useless idiots and truly believe this chant.

    There is not one thing in obobo care or the single payer socialized sickness careless allopathic medical complex that will make you well nor make you live longer or at least improve the dignity of life toward the end of which was promoted by what they've done to you...all the while...earning undeserved profits.

    Do we take part in our own demise? Yes we do, but it is our choice to do better for ourselves or not but it usually doesn't come down to just one bad thing we do to ourselves or what they do either...it's a host of multiple things cumulatively.

    BUT: we haven't been taught, informed or otherwise made aware of just how to give us the best chance to live long and prosper. There is a plethora of misleading false hoods out there. But, all and all, amongst the many things that would be good for us is above all...moderation...after all...too much of a good thing is just as bad as a lot of bad things.

    Not to mention...no matter how many good things you do in moderation...you just might get run over by a car driven by a junkie, demoncrap sexting on their dumb phone while playing with themselves and doing a selfie in a car paid for by your taxes...and to add insult to injury...they will get away with it so they can do the same thing again another day.
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  • Posted by NealS 2 years, 2 months ago
    I gave you a thumbs up on this even before I finished reading it, because I didn't want to forget. I can hardly think of a government program, beyond any sanctioned by the Constitution, that has ever worked as "intended". Perhaps that was the plan all along and most are actually working as "intended".

    I use VA Healthcare but my needs are such that there is little to rate. In any case I never realized before that drugs were so prevalent in treating any and everything these days. Perhaps it's a coverup for, "I don't know what's wrong with you, here take these pills, come back in 3 months".

    All the issues about Obamacare are strictly political, on both sides of the argument. Make it better? The only resolution sanctioned by the Constitution is to repeal it, then stay out of it.
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  • Posted by CarrieAnneJD 2 years, 2 months ago
    FOr example: See Charlie Gard in the UK! While the legal battle dragged out as his parents appealed and appealed and appealed the hospital's decision to NOT treat him further, his brain deteriorated and the previous ~50% chance of effective treatment in the US (which they were requesting) dropped to "too late to do anything." The innocent baby literally sentenced to death by "human rights" courts, and it's not even "news." puke

    EDIT: Also, someone shared this video in the Gulch a few weeks ago... thought it'd be entertaining here, too: http://ijr.com/the-declaration/2017/0...
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  • Posted by preimert1 2 years, 2 months ago
    It seems like the main goal of Republicans is to thoroughly purge any and all traces of Obama's term irrespective of whether it has any redeeming features whatsoever--even before they have anything to replace it with. (I'm not arguing that it was needed in the first place. I mean has anyone stopped to consider if ANY government health care progra is needed at all--except for the VA)
    This just smacks of pure partisanship and people be damned!
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    • Posted by Abaco 2 years, 2 months ago
      No. They like bigger government. This is the new GOP. They don't represent those who voted for the old GOP. Problem is, most of those who voted for the old GOP haven't figured it out yet.
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      • Posted by CircuitGuy 2 years, 2 months ago
        I'm 42, so I became aware of this stuff around the time President Clinton was declaring the era of big gov't is over. At that time I believed the group of "firebrand" Congressman who took office in '95 were about cutting gov't and increasing borrowing. I believed that forced President Clinton to adopt a anti-big-gov't line. Their fight plus the end of the cold war led to a balanced budget.

        But after that time I no longer believed the parties had a position on reducing gov't. In the 90s GOP wanted to cut Medicare, and Democrats said it was kicking grandma to curb. GOP called their tactics "mediscare." When President Obama wanted to cut Medicare to make Obamacare work, the roles completely reversed. GOP adopted 90s Democrat talking points. At that point I no longer believed in it one bit.

        Keep in mind I'm not saying either group is bad people. I think their job is to get elected, and if they don't focus on that they don't get to or stay in office. And you get elected by dividing people into groups and giving out gov't funds and/or policies favorable to certain groups.

        They hardly even pretend it's about ideas. You rarely hear "their ideas are wrong." Both sides want to get the other side "locked up" on a technicality for accidentally violating federal law.

        I said I'm 42 b/c maybe there was a time before I remember when it was different. But given what I've seen I'm baffled when people say, "I am surprised a Republican wants to expand gov't intrusion, spending, and borrowing." Of course they do. That's how you get elected in the absence of Constitutional limits on power and spending. I am not surprised in the least by it.
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    • Posted by 2 years, 2 months ago
      If that were only true!
      We've all heard about the number of bills passed to repeal Obamacare during the Obama Administration. 47 or so? They were all show votes to let Republicans say they tried. But they knew Obama would veto them.
      What I don't think people realize is that the GOP's opposition to Obamacare in the beginning was also a show vote. Obamacare passed without a single Republican vote. But they knew the Democrats had the votes to pass it anyway. Thus people like McCain, Collins, and the rest could vote against it then, and vote for repeal like in 2015. Now that the GOP has House, Senate, and White House, they have to show their true colors and vote against repeal!!
      Hypocrites all!
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    • Posted by freedomforall 2 years, 2 months ago
      If that was true, Obamacare would have been repealed in January. It hasn't, and the looting GOP senators have no intention of doing so at any time unless it is continued under a GOP Banner.
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  • Posted by term2 2 years, 2 months ago
    Obamacare is so inefficient that I could argue that the costs of it could actually mean a faster death because one cant afford to eat healthy things while working more hours in order to afford things.
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  • Posted by chad 2 years, 2 months ago
    A lot more people will die with the ACA than without it. Increased costs, increased deductibles, increased taxation (to fund this there are taxes added to real estate, medical appliances, medical bills and the direct required assessment) and reduced services allowed under the Act. When they come to collect my payment someone is going to need Obamacare.
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  • Posted by Abaco 2 years, 2 months ago
    Watch the video in youtube "The Story of Your Enslavement". The very beginning of narration mentioned how we started to really fear death and that is how they got our hooks in us.
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  • Posted by GaryL 2 years, 2 months ago
    Well said Storo!
    I like this analogy. You can coax a cute little bear cub into your house with food and raise the cub to adulthood with said food and comfort. What you cannot do is stop the free food or take the comforts away. The rule with all animals, humans included, is never ever hand them anything for free except in infancy and when old or unhealthy. Hunger and shelter are mighty motivators but the human animal learns very quick that free hand outs cause nothing but a lack of survival motivation instincts.
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