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Communists are, in fact, extremely dumb

Posted by rbroberg 3 years, 4 months ago to Politics
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Judge me how you will, but I decided I wanted to understand Marxism since it is the antithesis of Objectivism to be able to anticipate theoretical objections and arguments and find clever ways to knock down the Berlin Wall in thought. I expected some moderately intelligent insights distorted by a dialectical process. Here's what I found in Marxist Economic Theory by Ernest Mandel:

"Every increase in the productivity of labor beyond this low point [i.e. subsistence] makes a small surplus possible, and once there is a surplus of products, once man's two hands can produce more than is need for his own subsistence, then the conditions have been set for a struggle over how this surplus will be shared."

Well dammit Ernest! I didn't expect this on the second page!

Let's quote Rand here because it's a fact:

"There is, of course, no such thing as a social surplus."


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  • Posted by ProfChuck 3 years, 4 months ago
    Orwell described ENGSOC (English Socialism) as a pyramid. At the apex is the "inner party". Its members recognize socialism as a path to power that is enabled by the establishment of Socialism as a secular religion with all of the attendant trappings including dogmas, catechisms, sinners and saints. This structure is supported by the "true believers" which form the middle layer of the pyramid. This is the "Outer Party". Members of the outer party believe in the party line with a religious fervor and view anyone that does not share their beliefs as heretics. At the base of the pyramid lies the people or "Prols" as Orwell called them. They support the system because it promises "free stuff" and life without consequence.
    When viewed from this perspective ENGSOC and Communism are indistinguishable..
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  • Posted by $ blarman 3 years, 4 months ago
    Several points of interest:

    What is "subsistence living" and who sets the bar for it? Note that a surplus is defined as anything past a given point - thus the importance of identifying a true measuring stick for the point of "adequacy"!

    "once man's two hands can produce more than is need": Note again the subjective declaration in the word need. Here it is not the producer himself/herself defining need, but some third party instead assuming the task of declaring for another something inherently personal and subjectively declaratory.

    "conditions have been set for a struggle": Note the implied use of force brought about by the imposition of a third party in affairs.

    "how this surplus will be shared.": Note the implied maxim that a third party has some right or claim to the production of others. Sharing in this case is not a voluntary action either, but rather (as noted in the previous portion of the paragraph denoting an impending struggle a coercive act of taxation - a compelled confiscation used for the betterment of others.

    rbroberg, I actually must congratulate you on identifying a most cogent argument summarizing the Marxist position! Well done!
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    • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 3 years, 4 months ago
      Funny...marxist think they know better than nature; which the free marked is based upon.
      Every individual has different needs: Men and women each have different needs, the sick have different needs than the healthy, each bloodtype has different needs from other bloodtypes and last but not least, those that live in the cold climates have different needs than those that live in the warm.
      Now, individual subjectivity multiplies the difference in needs from the whole. We are not all the same nor will we ever be unless...we are Transhumanized with electronics...which is the plan by google, silicon valley and governments.

      Something to think about..?

      My posit, as many of you already know, is each cell in our bodies are fully responsible for it's own survival. Once those needs are met, the value is passed on.. So, might not the community of cells we call you and I act the same way?...if allowed?, directly one to another or via a free market?

      Yes...marxist, communist and socialist, (add, demoncraps, liberals and progressives), are certainly the dumbest among us.
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  • Posted by fosterj717 3 years, 4 months ago
    It is amazing that Communists have never been right about anything other than how to promote violent revolution then preside over massive depopulation activities afterwards!

    Unfortunately, the academic elite who promote Socialism, Communism or Fabian Socialism can never show where their preferred form of government/economy has ever improved the human condition. Arguably, Fabian Socialism (the Happy Face of Communism) that promotes a more nuanced implementation using flowery language (Orwellian Newspeak - I.e., "Smart Growth", "Sustainable Growth (Rio Accords), etc.) and subterfuge when in reality, it is the soothing "feel good" rhetoric that once the movement reaches its Tipping Point, will pull the rug out from everyone's feet and Freedom as we know it is dead.

    Instead, freedom is replaced by those nameless, faceless, un-elected bureaucrats (I.e., Brussels and the EU being an example) whose brand of Socialism is supported mainly by the largess of our Federal Reserve system using for the most part fiat money through sister institutions such as the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund (all constructs of a system for the benefit of the international oligarchy that cares little or nothing for political structures as long as they can control them, or other goe-political niceties that may matter to the common man (and woman).

    Instead, the benefit of seems to be for the shadowy overlords (I.e., the banking elite, the military industrial complex and the True 1% of the 1%, and willing co-conspirators in the governments of the world). Ultimate control targets the intertwined economies world through NAFTA and other emerging International Agreements.

    There is little or no concern about the fact that monies thus distributed end up in the hands of despotic leaders that when they become so addicted to their fix of largesse from the wealthy nations, they are now in fact owned by the overlords and thus the NWO becomes a reality, all to the detriment for the most part of the common folks.

    Communism's appeal to the simpleminded and intrinsically lazy is thus assured once they masses have determined that class warfare is the key to their salvation and and fulfillment. This is the myth that is perpetrated by the Academic elite who actually believe that they will be the ones to run this "Brave New Orwellian World" however, reality is that they will be purged just like the academic elites of past Communist revolutions! This is a simple Truth!

    In closing, the refrain, "they pretend to pay us and we pretend to work" is the legacy of that form of government. It is human nature! Why produce more when you will only ever be able to get what in theory you can create as part of the hive cooperative? Subsistence and no more!
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  • Posted by $ allosaur 3 years, 4 months ago
    That last bit, "--then the conditions have been set for a struggle over how this surplus will be shared" immediately caused old dino to reminiscence having years ago previously observed on the telly the delightful Bentley Townwomans Guild's "in a lighter vein" artful for tastefully subtle "social surplus" reenactment of the Battle of Pearl Harbor~
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlYEq...
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  • Posted by chad 3 years, 4 months ago
    The idea of a third party to arbitrate by force the use of the production of an individual seems an inherit trait among humans since the dawn of man's ability to understand reality. This superstition or religion seems to permeate civilization (the group) and conflict with man's reason and yet it is almost impossible to teach the idea of the superiority and morality of liberty to most people. Those who would live free are dominated by those who prefer slavery. I has been this way for as long there has been human interaction and I don't know how to change it. All most all of my efforts have been rejected even amongst those whom I have had the most opportunity to teach, my children.
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  • Posted by $ WilliamShipley 3 years, 4 months ago
    There is a difference between a surplus and a "social surplus". Certainly if we consume everything we create as we do so, there is no wealth. There is just survival. Of course you have to be a hunter-gatherer to do that. It's hard to make a living consuming computer code so I have to have a system of trade.

    But back to the guy who caught two rabbits and only ate one. He had a surplus rabbit. And there can be a struggle over that rabbit. He could save it for the next day. Somebody with a club could take it away from him. He could give it to someone in exchange for something.

    So there is the point that economics begins when someone has a slight surplus over their immediate needs. And economic and political systems are built on that.
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  • Posted by $ Stormi 3 years, 4 months ago
    Those in power, both in the US and Russia, who believe in communism, know exactly how it works. They use other people's labor to live lavish lifestyles. Then they "share" other peopls's surplus (defined by those in power) to share with those who did not earn it. That keeps the power elite in good standing. Dumb like a fox, and completely corrupt.
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  • Posted by Herb7734 3 years, 4 months ago
    But there is such things as shortages. There's shortages of brain power, shortages of accomplishment, shortages of desire, and worst of all, shortages of incentive.Which is why communism will never out produce capitalism. It seems to be a blind spot that all lefties refuse to recognize.
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