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Watched the Debates. We're Doomed.

Posted by $ Abaco 10 years, 4 months ago to Politics
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OK, I have avoided the debates until recently. Watched most of the Repub one last week and almost all of the Dems (on the dvr yesterday). I have come to the conclusion that we're probably doomed. With the Republicans...if you really listen closely you see this overwhelming desire to use government to fix things. There are, surprisingly, promises to "tax for this" and "tax for that". I don't remember hearing a peep about smaller government.

Then...there are the Dems. Of the three in the debate, Omally (sp?) is the only one who sounds sane. At all. Seems like a decent person, actually. Has no chance in hell. Hillary, to even my surprise, offered ZERO solutions to anything. (I don't expect any hint of a hands-off approach from this crowd, so work with me). She pointed out that the lead in the water in Flint had to do with race. I have always thought she'll be the next president and, apparently, she thinks so too. Very scary thought. Worse than the current guy in there? Anybody's guess. Then, there's Bernie. Sometimes, he actually makes a little sense. But, there is his tireless fixation with other people's money. He absolutely sees wealth as something to be taken. He's very open about it. And, just this morning I heard a clip of him talking up Fidel Castro. Anybody here ever been to Cuba? He said that the lack of an uprising is proof that the people like the Communism there. Very scary stuff. Way out of touch with reality. Yet, I check social media this morning and some people I know back Bernie.

I think things in America are going to get much worse before they get better. My little son made some interesting statements. He has a disability, but has progressed well. He'll actually sit and watch these people talk and figure out who's full of crap (all of them). After watching a while he looked up at me and said, "Dad. What will you do if Sanders gets elected?" Without hesitation I responded, "Hide our stuff." That turned into a short, fun conversation...


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  • Posted by roneida 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    to freedom for all,,I'm far too old to give up and commit suicide...what do you propose ???more social/lib class hate??? more executive orders instead of Congressional vote,??? more destructive social meddling and forced associations, more politically correct butt kissing?? I have no great hero worship of the Republicans but after watching the debasement of America from internal incompetence of the current pretend leader, I don't think we can do worse.
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  • Posted by DrZarkov99 10 years, 4 months ago
    It's all about expectations. There is a natural expectation that society progresses, both materially and morally, with the ideal being that eventually anyone being poor or sick will have to make some really bad decisions to get that way, and major conflict will be a thing of the past. Utopian vision, admittedly, but it's at the core of nearly everyone's ideal world.

    Politicians get elected primarily on how well they appeal to our Utopian desires, rather than how well they address the more immediate, mundane problems. Those politicians that make a concerted effort to detail exactly how they're going to fix the various near term problems usually lose, as the interest of the voter is simple minded and fickle.

    Regardless of what the political candidates promise, any success will depend on how pragmatic they are, and how gifted they are are making the deal with the various interest groups on the Hill (did I just use a Trump term?). Given that reality, I assess each competitor on their personal history and performance. O'Malley ranks at the bottom, since the city he mayored (Baltimore) and the state he governed (Maryland) are socialist economic and crime basket cases. Ted Cruz doesn't fare much better, as his only major accomplishment has been getting elected, and he's proven to be an unproductive pain in the backside in the Senate. Trump has a history of success based on tremendous negotiating skills, and Kasich has an admirable track record, both in Congress and as a governor of Ohio.

    Trust and integrity are also important, with Clinton at rock bottom on that score. Sanders is more trustworthy, which is frightening in a way, as you can believe he'll try his best to institute a socialist government. Rubio looks and sounds good, but he's a toady for the sugar industry.

    I was a Rand Paul supporter, but I've lost faith in his ability to promote the small government message effectively enough to win broad support. Intellectually he makes the most sense, but he lacks Trump's skill at gaining the media attention necessary to capture the crowd's emotions.

    Are we screwed? While I'm skeptical anyone can easily overcome the friction of an incompetent, corrupt unelected civil service institution, I don't think we are - yet. If a Democrat President captures the SCOTUS, the heart of our republic is in serious peril. Like the candidate or not, I'll vote Republican, as a vote against, as Will Rogers advised.
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  • Posted by strugatsky 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You mean to say that you would trust them in self non-proliferation? Noooo, we need a government program to ensure that...
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  • Posted by $ allosaur 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I disagree. Politicians need to wear condom suits.
    Kinda like Kickass's green costume in the flick by the same name..
    I recall Kickass approaching the apartment door of local black gang boss Raoul and being asked by a fat hoodlum guard, "Who are you? The Green Condom?",
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  • Posted by Ben_C 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Wealth is not income. Wealth is capital assets - whatever someone else is willing to pay for the stuff you own. A person may have 300K in income but not have much in capital assets. Bernie needs to figure this out. His pipe dream of 19 trillion in tax revenues over a ten year period will add to the irreparable harm that is already present.
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  • Posted by Ben_C 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Well said. I wonder if CircuitGuy knows the origin of the phrase "drinking the Kool Aide?"
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  • Posted by scojohnson 10 years, 4 months ago
    "Talking to Fidel"... Lol, he took off and immigrated to The Soviet Union for several years to live in his communist utopian fantasy. He brought his new bride with him and she was going to go back to the US with or without him.

    Assuming either will win is not rooted in reality, Obama turned filibuster-proof democrat majorities into the largest Republican control of the House and Senate in 70 years in 2 cycles, it's looking like another 10 seats this time. Maybe you live in a left district or something, but doesn't square with electoral counts, polls are just a poll, not electoral points in the winner-take-all state by state system.

    The Swift Boat campaign is running already on Hillary, most of the strategy was to give Bernie enough help to either beat her or severely wound her.

    Trump is actually much higher than he even looks because they poll 'likely Republican voters', 7 out of 8 of his attendees in Reno were unemployed steel workers, blue collar workers, etc., only half with a college education, and are never thought of as Republican. When the field collapses around him, he gets 100% of Republicans because we would never vote for a cackling witch or a communist, he is also going to drag a lot of the Union and non-union laborers... Would likely look like Carter v Reagan.

    The guy hasn't spent a dollar on a TV ad yet... And looks like he just took out Cruz in Iowa for free.
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  • Posted by blackswan 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Economies of scale are declining because of technology, and will continue to do so. That means that government will have a more and more difficult time meddling in people's affairs. The politicians don't get it; they're just pandering to the clueless voters who've been led to believe that the government can "fix" anything.
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  • Posted by term2 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I wonder how many nuclear bombs the Iranians will make with the $150 billion we freed up for them. You can bet that $150 billion will NEVER be invested in a way that the US could put a freeze on them again !!
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  • Posted by term2 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    These arent debates in the strict sense of the word. They are just candidates spouting talking points in forums designed to get people to watch commercials.
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  • Posted by term2 10 years, 4 months ago
    As a country, we ARE doomed to go down the socialist path like Venezuela. In fact there should be a TV series showing how government becomes more and more restrictive as the economy gets worse and worse
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  • Posted by freedomforall 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You have just described the next 4 years if either a GOP or a Dem is elected president.
    The Republicans are far from inexperienced. Unfortunately the experience they have is only good for a stronger, more intrusive fedgov and the continued destruction of individual liberty and free markets. The GOP promises the good (liberty) and delivers the evil (socialist-facist statism.)
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  • Posted by Herb7734 10 years, 4 months ago
    Looking at the front runners all I can say is that America has declined from the hope of humanity into hopeless humanity.
    Your son is most likely a better candidate than the likely nominees, but I would hate to put such a burden on one so young.
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  • Posted by roneida 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    jbrenner.... They will immediately get "better" when the current occupier of OUR white House is replaced by any one of the Republican candidates. None of them are running on an identity basis, but on ideas and disgust with what American government has become.

    If you think the Republicans are inexperienced and hopeless, you have been on another planet for the last 7 years. We have seen experience community dis-organizing at its worst . If our dying large cities get any worse, we will experience real martial law and desperation as the non producers jealousy is fanned by a regime that flourishes on class hatred and jealousy.
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  • Posted by SubVet 10 years, 4 months ago
    In one of the earlier debates, Rand Paul sounded like his father calling for a federal government so small that you don't see it...
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  • Posted by SubVet 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Although I have not apparently participated enough to "Like" this post, this comment should get me on the path to sufficient participation.
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  • Posted by wiggys 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    abaco,
    did you need to see or hear the debates to come to that decision. haven't the past 8 or more years given you the necessary knowledge to know that?
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  • Posted by evlwhtguy 10 years, 4 months ago
    "With the Republicans...if you really listen closely you see this overwhelming desire to use government to fix things."

    You are right on with this.......They see government as a potential solution, not what it is....the problem.
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  • Posted by ewv 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    True, but sperm are that way by nature; politicians are ex-humans who choose what they are and exploit terrible ideas to implement it.
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  • Posted by ewv 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Things are not "amazingly good right now". You are dropping context.

    Technical progress has continued despite the government, not because of it, but is being progressively controlled and exploited for nefarious ends. Advances in medicine are undermined with shortages of doctors and a regulatory morass as doctors drop out and government regulates and taxes our medical care for redistributionism.

    Racial resentment and conflict are increasing in violent outbursts as they are being deliberately stoked by "irrational lives matter" racists. Despite the fact that racism among ordinary people was minimal and declining, it is worse now than the days of forced busing and the onslaught of affirmative racism.

    The threat of nuclear war with Russia subsided despite the Democrats and now on the increase, along with the Iranian threat enabled by Obama. International terrorism is on the rise while Americans are subject to increased surveillance and restrictions and the primitives are protected by multi-culturalism political correctness. Immigration has been replaced by cultural and political invasion for third world "fundamental change" of our country.

    If domestic "crime" has declined at all -- apparently they don't count drug robberies and burning cities -- it is replaced by government crime through progressively increasing bureaucratic abuse under exploiting regulatory decrees. We are progressively in a worsening post-constitutional era threatening all of us with arbitrary government power. This includes intensified anti-private property rights, anti-industry viro agencies and the politically motivated tax police state. Rape has been illegal all along; now the innocent are being falsely accused from political correctness. Small companies are terrorized over refusing to "bake cakes" under government-forced entitlements. Major companies are leaving the country over the high taxes and regulations, and ordinary citizens at all economic levels are cutting back or retiring early.

    It is increasingly difficult to enjoy the gains we have made despite political progressivism and government power as we constantly look over our shoulders in fear of what will hit us next. This is all "amazingly good right now" all right -- for liberal fascists who have progressed faster than they dreamed possible. It's great for apologists for Cackles and Obama. It is no time to celebrate our achievements and be lulled into complacency while ignoring the further statist, irrationalist decline we are threatened with.
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  • Posted by coaldigger 10 years, 4 months ago
    I read a quote today that I think is appropriate here: "Politicians are like sperm. One in a million turns out to be an actual human being." I am afraid that we haven't met the lucky one yet!
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 10 years, 4 months ago
    "I think things in America are going to get much worse before they get better."
    I have to point out that things are amazingly good right now. We have amazing technologies. Crime has declined. The threat of a full-scale nuclear war is less. The notion of beating your spouse or committing rape being okay under certain circumstances is just gone. MLK had a controversial dream that's not had all controversial anymore, after just 50 years. Marginal tax rates > 50% are gone, hopefully for good.

    Things are far from perfect, and not every area of life has seen improvement, e.g. the stuff in your post and the nonsense politicians say.

    Overall things got better in my life time, are still getting better, and will continue to get better.
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