The cure for a failing empire

Posted by $ MikeMarotta 9 years, 10 months ago to Culture
87 comments | Share | Best of... | Flag

If you were a druid from 180 AD and had Merlin's insight, what could you tell the emperor Marcus Aurelius about the coming collapse of the Roman Empire, and how to avoid it? That is the question raised and answered by Ugo Bardi, a professor of chemistry at the University of Firenze (Florence, Italy). Prof. Bardi is also an active writer on the problem of "Peak Oil" and its consequences for our civilization. His essay on Peak Civilization, delivered first as a talk to the Association for the Study of Peak Oil, was reprinted by the Financial Sense blog (here: http://www.financialsense.com/contrib... ). It runs 24 pages and bears a complete reading.

http://www.financialsense.com/contrib...


All Comments


Previous comments...   You are currently on page 3.
  • Posted by $ 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    +1 for that. I believe that new forms of wealth creation are beyond the ken of the controllers. You got a reply from jhagen about how the mass media are controlled by those in power. To some extent that is true, as it must be. However, millions of people - left, right, or center - look to other sources of information. Millions more simply ignore the noise.

    That is all that that is: noise. New technologies are deeply endemic in our culture today. It may be centuries before they all gel and stultify into some kind of socio-political stasis. I mean, that would have to include the miners in the asteroid belt, and I do not see that happening soon.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I do not agree, though I note the Plusses from others who do. Atlas Shrugged was never intended as a predictive or prescriptive story. If anything, its widespread popularity actually prevents the end it warns against.

    It is too easy to read the headlines and accept them as social reality. I recommend that you visit the Ayn Rand Institute's Essay Contest pages. They have been running these for 20 year or more. Many of those who enter come from Catholic schools. Think about that.

    The undercurrent of change is only not yet perceived.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Funny that works for me perfectly. If the teaching system has done there job there is no need for study. If the student has done their job the results will be good marks at the end of the course, during the the course or years afterward.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    As the writers and editors of The Invention of Enterprise point out, in Rome, being a merchant as not held in high regard. A successful businessman turned his works over to his freedmen and slaves while he retired to the country to live on a farm like a nobilis.

    I agree with your premise, of course. In fact, I believe that this is the fatal flaw on the theory presented. We can create not only new wealth, but new forms of wealth creation if we are free to do so.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Here's something interesting I read a while back about changing the past.
    Quantum Physics suggests that if the outcome of some past action or even your actions in the present, is unknown...it can be changed. As soon as the outcome IS known...it's history and cannot be changed.
    EXP's were done in some universities where some students studied before an exam and others only studied after...both groups were not told the outcome. After the second group studied after the results were tallied and the group that studied after got the highest marks as a whole.
    I think it's too late to study after because we've seen the outcome of past falls.
    What we might try is that which has never been tried then study after the fact to see if we changed the past...which of course was once out present.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Hey! I'm a fan of the Mongols and the Kurds. They pray to Allah or some other God then reclean their weapons and check their ammunition. Objectivism rules.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Paranoia. If the whole world agrees with your interpretation it is not paranoia it is truth. It's not that you aren't being watched. It's the fact you are throwing a birthday party for one of the children. That is your crime. Your happiness is terrorizing the neighborhood.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You are in an area that has suffered a complete black out. Power, Phones, cell radio telephones everything. Using foresight you prepared in advance. Suddenly you are the only house in the area with light showing and upon closer inspection cheery music playing.

    What is wrong with this picture?
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by Herb7734 9 years, 10 months ago
    So...I told the truth, predicted the outcome ..but nobody listened. There were those just as intelligent as me, with as much knowledge, and foresight, but when it came to outlining consequences -- nobody listened. I saw a once mighty republic rotting on the inside and when I showed the danger to its structure - nobody listened. I saw evil men with evil agendas gain power and when I pointed them out, nobody listened. Why didn't they hear me? What does it take to unblind the blind? Aren't these wise men who have attained great stature? If I'm right why won't they see what I see? There must be only one reason that I can discern. I must be insane.
    Either that, or the world is.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by helmsman5 9 years, 10 months ago
    Thanks for such a thoughtful and insightful essay, especially with the humorous refrences to Druids imaginary and recent.. Even the word exploitation is overcharged. I get that we rarely see the negative feedack or make the fundamental adjustments. What makes me lose sleep is how utterly impotent elected representatives are collectively, who are pettily distracted from any and all well intended sincere 'druid's'..
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by Flootus5 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The mongols had many nasty ways to produce the death of an individual. Like pouring molten silver into someone's ears, forcing someone to swallow small pebbles until his entire esophagus was full, or even what they did to the Caliph of Baghdad - rolled him up in carpets and had elephants stomp him out!

    And we argue about the death penalty!
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by jhagen 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    An interesting thought - a very good point. We have the printing press, the postal service, tv, radio, many thousands of schools, AND the internet. Systems even better than Spargue de Camp could mention. But since so much of each of them are controlled by people who don't like America, having this amazing ability to communicate and transmit information clearly isn't enough.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ allosaur 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Something the ancient Romans were into.
    Romans hated druid priests for stirirng up Gauls, Brit tribes and so forth.
    I believe that is what Merlin was, though he lived after the fall of Rome or so his legend goes.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ jlc 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Isn't it neat to be able to carry hundreds of books around with you in one hand? I am having trouble charging my Kindle right now. :>(

    Jan
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Battle Star Galactica that's where I heard that word. I checked with Amazon Kindle. That book and a follow up all time travel stories are now in my reader. $1.99 and .99 or 2.98. I'm never going to run out of books to read at this rate. As for my theory of time travel if you go to the future you are venturing into the unknown but then all from that point is the past and can be used when you return to your Home Present. If you travel backwards changes can be made at will as you are only doing what was already done which of course is how you got to the start point. Also landing zones are easier to predict.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Certainly explained how we got here, we a nation. So far each time I've followed the trail from start to finish I found clear evidence of greed and overstepping rights granted along with outright of the 'intent' which did not include rigged ballots, politicians for sale, and usurption of the Bill of Rights. Perhaps Congress exempted itself from the lead poisoning rules. Either that or Pelolsillyni has been passing out the giggle weed?
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    As I recall they were well on their way to just that when Temujin died and the Generals started bickering. His control of the Gobi area completely dominated wast west trade under a fee system. His punishment system was eminently fair. Get caught get beheaded.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The interstate was a copy of the German autobahn know originally as the National Defense Highway System. One of Eisenhower's project and the name one of the reaaons for building it. That begat UPS and FedEx, add computers and the ma bell breakup gave us overnight order and deliver. Russia on the other hand still does not have one complete paved road from Vladivostok to Moscow. A friend from
    Irkutsk said when the road and train service does arrive his old home town would be connected to the world for the first time. That breeds trade and trade makes jobs.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Easier on a boat. one 100 watt panel and two 50 watt panels one charge controller wires and fittings are pre made very little to do but buy the rail mounts and have an electrician check the circuits. The big panel mounted up went past 13.3 and hit 15. in ten or twelve seconds.

    cheers

    MichaelA
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ jlc 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Congrads on your solar array. I am still working on getting mine.

    Jan
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ jlc 9 years, 10 months ago
    The most interesting answer to this question was made (in 1939) by Sprague de Camp in his SF novel Lest Darkness Fall. Time travel: A mousy archaeologist is transported back to Visgothic Rome. He decides to try to prevent the Middle Ages. He does this by inventing the printing press, semaphore, corporations...(and making sure that certain battles are won/lost). Since de Camp was, himself, an archaeologist, the details are accurate (to 1939).

    Bottom line is that improved communication and better transmission of information are essential for holding an empire of that size together.

    As I have said before, I think that political models may be overturned by new technology, even as fracking has overturned the concept of the amount of petroleum products that are left.

    Jan
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ allosaur 9 years, 10 months ago in reply to this comment.
    With old dino's insight for saying about the same Merlin kinda thing for this day and time, I would just be ignored save for this board,
    Lust for power and ill-gotten gains has Roman kinda put the USA on its death bed.
    Reply | Permalink  

  • Comment hidden. Undo