Today the Washington Examiner shows Barack Obama also made a large "carbon footprint" to make a speech about climate change.

If he were serious, he would Skype that speech, and tell his listeners/viewers why.

Ugh. Yes.

That is the captive elephant in the room. Someday, we will wake up and know that we are strong.

Jan, like an Ent

Good summary, blarman. But whether you agree or disagree with the watered down definition, my point was because those 4 points can be applied both to AGW deniers and to AGW activists, it does not add much to the debate.

My thanks. A wealth of info to refute/expose the environazi's and the UN's real goals.

I studied Economics in both undergrad and graduate school, mercifully after I'd read most of Rand and under her recommendation a lot of Mises and other free-market economists, before starting college. One of the first things I learned from Mises and the other rational economists is that mathematics has absolutely nothing to do with Economic theory, including especially "predictive" models. And that applies to most sciences outside of the truly physical sciences, and "weather" or "climate" isn't one of them.

IMO, almost all "computer modeling" is worthless, except for perhaps very narrow market forecasting models and some truly scientific "predictive" polls, e.g., Rasmussen. And those examples are closer to art than science.

However, I had no choice but to learn a lot of it, and what I did see in the "ClimateGate" scandal was horrible, even if you accept the theory. The whistle-blower was a techie himself, and spotted not just bad programming but some outright false data. A little bit of it made some legitimate press, especially in Britain, but most of what was exposed was eventually forgotten (like say, a Clinton scandal), and the UN and others still trumpet clearly false "models". Big surprise.

Yes, but original sin ONLY applies to white people

Ok so now I have reread the Anthem,,Again

Well I am sure that when this is implemented, we can all sit by where the camp used to be and sing Koom-bye-AHHH. ( please excuse my spelling)

The golden rice thing is amazing. I say be nice until they start making their circular arguments, then rip into them. I think it is important they and other people listening in know that people not only disagree with them, but do not think their agenda is well intentioned.

Indeed. Al Gore owns several houses, at least one of which is incredible in square footage. His "carbon footprint" makes the Jolly Green Giant (pun intended) look like a midget (oops, or is "little person" the current PC term?).

Also, once again easy to find online, but his "Inconvenient Truth" film is full of very convenient lies, over and above a lot of the "scare scenes" in it are animated. His Oscar is about as well deserved as, hmmm, Obama's Nobel Prize...

I was kind of begging there

They would not have us freeze in the dark, the UN Agenda is doing it now. It is nearly completely in place per Dr. Ileana Johnson Paugh, author of UN Agenda 21, Environmental Piracy. Her home country of Romania she describes as filled with wind turbines, A/C is turned off even in hotels, brownouts are frequent, refrigeration of food impossible, and gas prices out of sight. That is the future they plan for us as well. Oh, not for the Gores and Clintons, Pelosis and Bushes of the world, they are the ruling elite. Don't think animals will survive, the cows let loose too much gas, the UN thinks pets should be outlawed, with no farms, how would the farm animals survive long range. These people can only think past their noses when it involves the accumulation of power. Remember, rand predicted this in "Anthem", where the collectivist society had only "we" who lived in the dark after the incandescent light bulb was locked in a vault by the all knowing rulers.

Wow! Great rendition on Agenda XXI (aka - Smart Growth, Sustainable Development, Open Space Preservation, Re-urbanization, etc. etc.). This is also an example of the NWO in action!

Excellent! Hitler actually wrote her about his support for her writings on the subject. He like them so much that he based his entire master race scenario and subsequent evil programs on Sanger's works.

Funny thing about slavery, it has not been eliminated, it just morphed. You are only not a slave if you own yourself under the law, and there is not one government in the world that recognizes that people own themselves

Environmentalism is ANTI-MAN.

I want to rip into them sometimes...but I think that by being reasonable I actually made an impression on a couple of them (who did not know about golden rice!!!). I have not seen one of those two people since then (she was actually a scientist; Wm and I kinda double teamed her).

Jan, sometimes longs for berserk

And just a little monkey wrench to completely jam the whole "Global Warming" bs, it's SNOWING IN THE TOWN WHERE I LIVE. Right now, this very minute as I write this... Gotta love NW CT in the "spring"!!

The best response I ever heard to that came from Milton Friedman:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWsx1X8P...

Well said. Or in other words, scientists believe in their own ability to understand the universe.

Well earned.

I thought his concept of 'original sin' was Incredibly Useful.

This is the concept I have been looking for to address why we (who may individually have been environmentally conscious) may be considered EVIL by Environmentalists...It is because of Original Sin! Wow.

This concept also has straightened out my thinking as to why we are all Racist and Sexist. We have had slaves and second-class citizens in our history and because of that we are all tainted by Original Sin. Great. Now I understand.

And what I understand, I can argue better against.

Jan, delighted and a bit grim

thank you

I love the outdoors and used to consider myself an environmentalist - but that was back in the day when people were talking about wolves and pointless ('fun') killing of animals and sealife and whales and...

Now I find that most people who are Green don't camp and don't really have a clue about the wilderness. Most of the best ecologists are the hunters, who actually talk about 7 year cycles of predators and game animals. (One such hunter just told me that he was not going turkey hunting this year because he thought that turkeys were are their 7-year-low. He wanted to wait another few years until they were approaching their max population and he could then be a good predator.)

So, I am an environmentalist (note absence of caps) but am totally opposed to Environmentalism.

Jan

Yeah. I tell Greenpeace about this on occasion, when I am not telling them about golden rice...

Jan