Barry Goldwater on Religion and Politics
On religious issues there can be little or no compromise. There is no position on which people are so immovable as their religious beliefs. There is no more powerful ally one can claim in a debate than Jesus Christ, or God, or Allah, or whatever one calls this supreme being. But like any powerful weapon, the use of God's name on one's behalf should be used sparingly. The religious factions that are growing throughout our land are not using their religious clout with wisdom. They are trying to force government leaders into following their position 100 percent. If you disagree with these religious groups on a particular moral issue, they complain, they threaten you with a loss of money or votes or both.
I'm frankly sick and tired of the political preachers across this country telling me as a citizen that if I want to be a moral person, I must believe in "A," "B," "C" and "D." Just who do they think they are? And from where do they presume to claim the right to dictate their moral beliefs to me?
And I am even more angry as a legislator who must endure the threats of every religious group who thinks it has some God-granted right to control my vote on every roll call in the Senate. I am warning them today: I will fight them every step of the way if they try to dictate their moral convictions to all Americans in the name of "conservatism."
Speech in the US Senate (16 September 1981)
I'm frankly sick and tired of the political preachers across this country telling me as a citizen that if I want to be a moral person, I must believe in "A," "B," "C" and "D." Just who do they think they are? And from where do they presume to claim the right to dictate their moral beliefs to me?
And I am even more angry as a legislator who must endure the threats of every religious group who thinks it has some God-granted right to control my vote on every roll call in the Senate. I am warning them today: I will fight them every step of the way if they try to dictate their moral convictions to all Americans in the name of "conservatism."
Speech in the US Senate (16 September 1981)
Previous comments... You are currently on page 5.
In fact all the countries you mention were built on the ethics of Christianity. Not to mention the dark ages.
It is worthless arguing with someone who believes in revealed truth. One more outrageous comment like these and I will hide your posts.
You are nice not to throw things at me.
Jan, ducking - just in case
Don't be ignorant, the evidence is in front of your face every day.
If an artist built a sculpture the size of a skyscraper, with intricate moving parts, and was one of the most beautiful sculptures ever made, you'd think that artist was quite possibly the best sculptor in history. And rightfully so.
Yet, you look at creation in all of its beauty and try to explain it away so you don't have any responsibility to anyone other than yourself. To hold yourself up on a pedestal as if you, a human being, are the pinnacle of all that is in the entire universe. It makes you feel good, and no god is going to get in your way of doing so.
So be it, that's how you feel, but don't claim that there's no evidence.
You think that your lack of having "done more of it before committing" would have improved your chances at a successful marriage. *nothing* could be further from the truth.
There are ways (besides God's way) to have a successful marriage, and, sometimes, you can trip over and stumble on a way that works for you. But there is only one way that has been proven time and again, and that's God's way. We're imperfect human beings, so we fail at it all the time, but better to try and fail at the perfect way, than stumble in the dark and hope to find a way that randomly works.
http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/bate...
A study published on the topic, which (surprise surprise) hasn't been repeated since:
http://ije.oxfordjournals.org/content/26...
There are more recent studies focused on the psychological effects to women which find that because women tend to be more emotionally invested in relationships (including the sexual desires), that even casual hookups create significant barriers to future fulfilling emotional relationships and lower quality physical relationships (since women's sex drive is much more emotional than men's).
Another issue is that when you have sex outside of wedlock, you take the real risk of children. Children deserve to be born into a committed, stable relationship and the social science on that is incontrovertible: children born into homes without fathers form the predominant populations of our prison systems and high school dropouts.
I'll also just for good measure toss in the prevalence of STD's (and that you can only get them by sleeping around). The CDC gives actual infection rates and they are sobering. When you get down to reading the effects of many of those diseases (few of which are curable), it really puts a chill on the whole notion of "casual sex". What I find most interesting is that most of them cause infertility.
As to the homosexual thing, you might want to peruse the CDC's statistics. HIV infection is 37x higher for a male homosexual than a male heterosexual. You can also look up Herpes, gonorrhea, syphilis, Hepatitis C, and others.
Having sex outside of marriage and commitment is playing Russian Roulette. The traditional enjoinder is simply that: a warning about the potential consequences. Heed them or not at your own risk, but the science becomes clearer and clearer every day: there is real value to monogamy.
And later, that same Franklin:
"Before I sit down, Mr. President, I will suggest another matter; and I am really surprised that it has not been proposed by some other member at an earlier period of our deliberations. I will suggest, Mr. President, that propriety of nominating and appointing, before we separate, a chaplain to this Convention, whose duty it shall be uniformly to assemble with us, and introduce the business of each day by and address to the Creator of the universe, and the Governor of all nations, beseeching Him to preside in our council, enlighten our minds with a portion of heavenly wisdom, influence our hearts with a love of truth and justice, and crown our labors with complete and abundant success!"
Another version of the same, written by James Madison, who says he wrote it as read from Franklin's own handwriting:
I have lived, Sir, a long time, and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth- that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have been assured, Sir, in the sacred writings, that "except the Lord build the House they labour in vain that build it." I firmly believe this; and I also believe that without his concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better than the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our little partial local interests; our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall become a reproach and bye word down to future ages. And what is worse, mankind may hereafter from this unfortunate instance, despair of establishing Governments be Human Wisdom and leave it to chance, war and conquest.
I therefore beg leave to move, that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and its blessings on our deliberations, be held in this Assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the Clergy of the City be requested to officiate in that service.
And, considering Alexander Hamilton, the speaker at the time, utterly despised this suggestion and openly ridiculed it, the entire rest of the assembly blatantly ignored his impious remarks, seconded Benjamin Franklin's motion, and carried the measure unanimously.
So, don't give me this crap about how human wisdom built this country. You want to build a country on human wisdom, you get the Soviet Union, Nazi Germany, Vietnam, Cuba, Ethiopia, East Germany, etc.
All in favor?
Vote passes unanimously. No abstentions.
Holy Chao!
You can now change your statement about "Everyone you know who has had the "unfortunate" experience of sex with multiple partners..." regretting sleeping around. I have had sex with multiple partners, and regret nothing. In fact, I wish I had done more of it before committing to my first marriage, which failed. Further, I couldn't be happier that my first marriage failed, since it brought me to my present, excellent relationship. So you should no longer make this foolish statement. If you like, I'll introduce you to as many people as you like that feel similarly. Maybe you should meet some people that haven't been brainwashed yet.
You will need to point me to real evidence of homosexuals lifespans being significantly shorter than heterosexuals, and specifically data supporting it is shorter on average than smokers.
As far as biblically-guided people feeling happier, I suspect no human is happier than my Labrador Retriever, who similarly worships me with considerably more evidence of my existence, behavior and desires.
Load more comments...