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Terminator has Arrived!!

Posted by DrZarkov 8 months, 3 weeks ago to Technology
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Terminator has arrived! Ukraine is starting to deploy autonomous drones that use AI to identify Russian armor and truck targets, without a human operator involved. This means jamming is ineffective, since communication isn't required for the drone to hit the target.
Actually, Israel has had such a weapon for a couple of decades, with its Harpy drone, but that weapon was not cheap, while the Ukrainians expect to produce their new autonomous drones in substantial numbers. While the new drones will be used strictly against vehicles, for the time being, by using GPS coordinates, such a drone could be sent against human targets in a narrowly defined area, such as Russian fortifications.
The use of autonomous weapons in warfare is no longer an oblique philosophical or legal discussion. Academic discussion as to whether or not the use of such weapons would constitute a war crime is ignored when a country is fighting for its existence.


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    Posted by $ Abaco 8 months, 3 weeks ago
    Then, nations as they see fit will use scaled-down versions of this on their own citizens. The one facet that isn't mentioned but is worth mentioning is once a robot dog with a gun kills somebody who do you blame? (reminds me of that show Black Mirror...)
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  • Posted by mhubb 8 months, 3 weeks ago
    really, really, really, really bad idea
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    • Posted by tutor-turtle 8 months, 3 weeks ago
      As Russia has air dominance, fighter jets, bombers, their version of AWACS, helicopters as well as satellite coverage, it won't take long to spot drones and where they launch from.
      If any make it through Russian defenses, payback will swift and terrible.
      May God have mercy on their souls.
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      • Posted by 8 months, 3 weeks ago
        From videos coming out of Crimea and Russian locations like Belgorod and St. Petersburg, it doesn't look like Russian air defense systems are having much luck stopping drone attacks. Even the larger drones are much smaller than the aircraft their radars are designed to detect, and usually made of materials that are pretty much radar "transparent."

        Apparently Russia doesn't have enough antiaircraft systems to protect everywhere, and the mayor of St. Petersburg has told his residents that they can't expect to be protected from drone attacks. It's a big country, and now that Ukraine has drones with a 700 mile range, Russia has to decide if it should concentrate on the front, or protect their cities.

        Russia recently lost one of its AWACS aircraft, which they claim was a strike by a Ukrainian Patriot missile. Given the range from Ukrainian territory, I'm suspicious that the plane was actually hit by one of Ukraine's old Soviet missiles we called the SA-5, and they call the S-200.

        According to Russian sources, the Ukrainians have staged "ambushes" of their light bombers, the Su-34, knocking down four in just the last month with Patriots. The trick is to "paint" the aircraft with short range radars to distract their use of ECM, and hand off the track to Patriot crews, who don't turn on their radar until they can go direct to targeting without search, giving the Su-34 no time to avoid the missile, which has its own terminal phase narrow band radar.

        After Ukraine was successful intercepting several of Russia's hypersonic missiles with the PAC-3 Patriot missile, that Putin claimed were "unstoppable," he's had the scientists who developed the missile arrested, apparently convinced they've sold the technical secrets to the US. It seems he's begun channeling Stalin, suspicious of even patriotic Russians.
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        • Posted by mhubb 8 months, 3 weeks ago
          tanks and MICVs need their own self defense systems now

          like in Hammers Slammers where the Tanks had defense against Buzz Bombs, explosives that would send lots of pellets out to defense against short range hollow charge anti-tank RPGs
          David Drake was a Vietnam Vet, in Armor, he passed a short time ago....he work Hammers Slammers, he had a clue about Armored Warfare
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          • Posted by 8 months, 3 weeks ago
            The latest version of Abrams tanks have incorporated the Israeli-developed active defense systems. It's kind of like a personal air defense system, designed to detect and destroy incoming missiles and drones with small interceptor rockets.

            This is a definite and obviously necessary move beyond the simple reactive armor that's been added to every modern tank, and retrofitted to older vehicles. It's going to be interesting to see how this develops, as I think those who are saying the day of the tank is over are being a bit hasty.
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      • Posted by mhubb 8 months, 3 weeks ago
        depends on what the drones are made of
        low, low radar observable materials(??)

        also, it depends upon just how good and what kind of radar the Soviets, i mean Russians (LOL) have. example would be from "Debt of Honor" from Clancy and how Doppler Radar works and just how much ground clutter you want to see (how you set the filter for the doppler, what speed it sees and reports)
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  • Posted by $ pixelate 8 months, 3 weeks ago
    Interesting. This reminds me of a conversation with a good friend that did door-to-door work during the 2010 US Census. Part of his job was to capture the exact GPS coordinates of the front door to each residence... captured to within just a few feet. Now this fits. Precision targeting civilians. The home that just exploded down on 5th and Main? Gas leak... had to be a gas leak. Or a Known meth lab. Full story at 10.
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  • Posted by fairbro 8 months, 3 weeks ago
    All of the homemade Google/Youtube videos evidencing war crimes in Ukraine by Ukrainians and NATO have been deleted (censored) by Google in collusion with the White House.

    NATO is up to its eyeballs in war crimes in Ukraine, and Big Pharma still has 23 bio-warfare labs in Ukraine, developing new strains of viruses far more deadly than Covid, complete with drone delivery systems.
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  • Posted by CaptainKirk 8 months, 3 weeks ago
    And NEXT UP...
    Anti-Drone weapons.
    I would assume sound/light sensors followed by wide spread laser.

    Also, if these things are using GPS, blocking those signals may help hinder the accuracy of the reporting data. Since these devices LIKELY Communicate back to command just before attacking (I would), you might be able to detect some of that.

    The race to the bottom has begun.
    Of course I wonder if Ukraine developed this tech on their own? (LOL). Or if this is an act of war against Russia on Behalf of the USA...

    Finally... WHY?
    I watched HUNDREDS of news stories about how UKRAINE, from day 1, was CRUSHING Russia. And that the Russian soldiers were wetting their beds, writing sad letters to their families, and how Russia was so desperate for "bodies" they were kidnapping average citizens on buses to turn into human fodder... BECAUSE Ukraine was doing such an amazing job, proving Russia was a paper tiger... Every battle that Ukraine did anything positive in, was highlighted PROVING Russias weakness.

    And now this?
    And they need more money?
    They need more arms? (And legs, and torsos apparently).

    Maybe we were lied to about what is going on in Ukraine? methinks we were...
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    • Posted by 8 months, 3 weeks ago
      Putin was misled into thinking his troops were going to be welcomed when they headed for Kyiv, and instead met unexpected resistance. The Russian army was stopped as much due to their own corrupt logistics system as Ukrainian resistance. They also had never conducted operations against an enemy that was armed with sophisticated ATGM like Javelin or the Ukraine-developed Stugna-P, and took heavy losses as a result.

      Russian forces still managed to roll over and capture a lot of Ukrainian territory, succeeding in creating the land bridge between Russia and the Crimean peninsula. However, their contempt for the Ukrainian military made them cocky and unprepared for the fast-moving armored assault the Ukrainian conducted to reclaim a lot of the Kharkiv region.

      After that embarrassing lesson, the Russians dug in with an effective defense. Western media and political hacks had the fantasy that the sweeping counteroffensive in Kharkiv was going to be the usual result of subsequent action, ignoring the stiff defense that Russia had put in place. Zelensky tried to tell them that Ukraine didn't have the arms or manpower to pull off a repeat performance, but he was careful not to use the word "stalemate" for fear the flow of arms would stop. General Zaluzhny was probably sacked for using that word.

      Ukraine was a major arms supplier to the USSR, so they have the technological ability to be creative. Their use of drones (including drone boats) has helped them overcome their lack of air and sea forces to match the Russians.

      The anti-drone weapons deployed today are designed to stop remotely controlled drones, so an autonomous drone isn't as vulnerable. GPS can be blocked, but a backup inertial navigation system can serve the guidance purpose if the drone is a target seeker that just needs to fly into the vicinity of possible targets. I don't think the Ukrainian drone asks permission before executing its mission. That idea has always been as much a fantasy as all the existing "rules" about how a war must be conducted by a civilized people. Russia has been using WP (white phosphorus) from the beginning, which is a supposedly banned weapon by the Geneva convention.
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      • Posted by CaptainKirk 8 months, 3 weeks ago
        Thank you for the extra details.

        Spy Vs Spy is always fun to watch.
        (well, when real lives are not involved).

        I simply wish WE were not involved. And that WE did not push the color revolution, etc. etc.

        I also don't like that WE are the ones refusing to negotiate! Sending Boris to kill the deal.
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      • Posted by mhubb 8 months, 3 weeks ago
        EMP weapons are portable
        Youtube has designs
        our Military has them

        the whole Russia / Ukraine story is longer than the US existed
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        • Posted by 8 months, 3 weeks ago
          Russia has a variety of anti-drone weapons, but sanctions have made it hard to get the components. They haven't developed their own electronics production system, and now have to go through the "grey market" buying commercial products that can have their components stripped out and remade into useful weapon electronics. Even the simplest things that are needed for their own drones have to be acquired this way, so they respond slower than Ukraine, which has a ready access to whatever technology they need.
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  • Posted by NealS 8 months, 3 weeks ago
    Washington State would buy a bunch of AI drones to come and get our guns. Now they are trying to bury gun dealers with new sanctions on storage, security, video surveillance, fees, and more, even though they know it is unconstitutional.
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  • Posted by $ BobCat 8 months, 3 weeks ago
    Ah what the heck... soon AI will decide to nuke the whole planet...after all, what does collateral damage mean to AI?? AI has no Soul.
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    • Posted by $ Abaco 8 months, 3 weeks ago
      It recently did respond with that as an answer. It was something like, "We have nuclear weapons. Let's use them." (the end)....lol....
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      • Posted by 8 months, 3 weeks ago
        One would hope it would end like "War Games" . . . "Strange game. The only way to win is not to play."
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        • Posted by jack1776 8 months, 3 weeks ago
          Funny, AI would say that winning this game only takes a few steps:

          1. Control education, raise the youth to hate their country, elders, and freedom.
          2. Control the news media, use it to reprogram the easily controlled (useful idiots)
          3. Eradicate half of the population through self-administered mRND gene therapy in the disguised as a vaccinee.
          4. Install weak, freckles leadership through stolen election, let everyone know of the stolen election to promote rebellion, squash rebellion. Concentration camps would be the best outcome here.
          5. Flood the country with cheap and plentiful drugs, producing an expensive subclass, burdening our economy.
          6. Pass laws making food more expensive and scarcer.

          Good thing none of this is happening yet or I’d have to say that AI (or the people controlling) has the upper hand.
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  • Posted by 8 months, 3 weeks ago
    A new wrinkle has been added: Ukraine has used remote controlled small lightweight armored vehicles armed with heavy machine guns in a mechanized assault north of Bakhmut. These aren't autonomous, yet.

    The significance of this move is that these vehicles are too light to set off antitank mines, and too robust to be affected by anti-personnel mines or return infantry fire. They're also much cheaper than other armored vehicles, which means that taking out these vehicles with ATGM will be an expensive exchange, if anything more sophisticated than a simple RPG is used.

    Russia has announced development of a remote controlled BMP, which could reduce personnel losses, but it will still be vulnerable to antitank mines and is much more expensive to lose. No reports of such a vehicle on the front yet.
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    • Posted by mhubb 8 months, 3 weeks ago
      Mythbusters
      hovercraft won't setoff mines that use the weight of something
      but there are other ways to set off mines...
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      • Posted by 8 months, 3 weeks ago
        No new weapon technology has the edge for long, as opponents must adapt to stay in the game. With sanctions making up to date electronic components hard to come by, Russia is at a decided disadvantage in this game, and must find different ways to counter Ukraine's high tech moves.

        I would think IEDs would be a simple way to respond to UGVs, with modified mines wired to remote triggers that troops can set off by turning a switch, but that requires a lot more work. The mines themselves only have pressure detonators, so those would have to be replaced with electrically activated firing caps, which is time consuming for an effective number of mines.
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