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consider a Ruger PC 9mm Carbine
can use Glock 17 (19), Ruger SR9 mags (comes with those adapters
other adapters to use Sig 320 and Beretta mags are available
9mm from a 16" barrel is effective
my 2 are Take Downs, so they fit in a backpack, along with ammo, mags, a pistol
Years back, used a friend's Marlin Camp 9 with a folding stock. Very easy to shoot and accurate at 100 yds,
the farthest I used it. I think Marlin stopped production about 20 years ago.
iirc, it could use an S&W magazine.
they also come in 40S&W
i got His and Hers LOL
both were fun and accurate
they were the ones without side loading gates, so i sold them, i got Rossi versions with side loading gates, combat weapons (for some reason....:-) )
How did your Rossi's compare to the Henry's?
the Rossi is fine for its purpose, neither would be a primary grab in case of an emergency
a 357 out of either (_Henry or Rossi) has about the same energy as a 556, around 1300 foot-pounds
i like having multiple for the same caliber
one issue with my Henry, a friend's son put a 38 special into the tube backwards, was a pain to get out
that day we had lots of toys for them both to play with, Garands, M1 Carbines, ARs, the son LOVED the Henry, with 38s, it was like a BB gun for recoil
So if one has a .357 revolver and one must choose between an AR15 or a .357 carbine (assuming that they have very similar capabilities), only having to carry one caliber of ammunition is a significant advantage in a bug-out.
i can give someone a set all using the same ammo
and in most places, 75-100 yards is enough range
357, 44, 9mm, 10mm are the sets i have now
go with an AR-57 and FN Five Seven
the AR-57 has 50 round mags in states that can read the Constitution
and Five-Seven can have 20 or 30 round mags
the 5.7x28mm is a very, very nasty round
i have
AR-57
PS-90
Five Seven
with 10 round mags, i make ammo also
my plan (civil unrest)
i have a AR-15A2 clone, will carry that
i will carry a 45ACP pistol
may carry a M1 Carbine as backup
other options are availa also, depending upon what is going on
PTR-91
M-14SA
SOCOM-16
Garands
FNAR (accurate long range, get one if you see one)
1903 Springfields are good options also, if you have to bail from your home
good for Wheel Guns!!
:-)
S&W M&P full sized 45acp or Sig 220 45acp on belt
lately i've looked at carrying my Ruger SP101 357 reverse belt carry, for in the car, while driving, if bad stuff starts in my area, 5 rounds of 38+p HP ammo
people, please, please prepare and practice with what you have
no need for new, take what you have, learn to use it
In the SP101, .357 ammo made my wrist so sore after 2 rounds that my accuracy was ineffective.
đź‘Ť on practice, too. Be prepared.
factory 357 are ok in it
used Sp101 seem very pricey, maybe because they make good clubs when empty? LOL
mine is a snub, i could hit the steel plate at the rage at 150 feet all day long with 38s
the SP101 are accurate!!!!!
https://www.guns.com/news/reviews/rev...
and a single shot 500mag rifle
:-)
These rounds in a lever are pretty awesome too.
there are not lists of what people buy?
in my state all must be registered as the state cannot read the Constitution
Same applies to your arsenal.
With the price of BULLETS these days. After you wound them with the gun, just a little slice on the sides of the neck, insides of the thigh, and let father time run his course.
Washing the bayonet is much cheaper. Besides, when you are out of ammo... It's still a useful weapon! (especially if you are the only one who knows)
and what is it with liberals and out-lawing bayonet mounts????
i've not seen any Drive-By Bayonetings!!!
Its time to develop new weapons which will immobilize from a distance, but not kill the attackers. Foil the attacker, but not give them or the government the ability to drag us into court and perhaps jail us for a long time. Develop these and one would become rich before the government tries to make even these illegal to own.
You THINK that wont be the attack.
We have drivers being paid, to pull in front of SEMI TRUCKS and brake hard, to collect the insurance payouts, and the legal extortion (they know the settlement numbers).
They will purposefully attack you. There is ZERO consequence to their bad actions. Worse case, they will PREY ON YOU with a bigger group.
I disagree. Kill them. Kill them hard. Kill them Fast. And pay the lawyers to do their job.
If you lose, you FIGHT IT ever step of the way.
I would rather die fighting, than on my knees!
And I would MUCH RATHER take as many with me, as I can.
But if I can thwart the attack by non lethal means, I would rather do that than go through the courts
I think attackers would be much less inclined to attack if they knew I could simply stop the attack thereby preventing them from gaining anything.
If I was a cop, theres no way I would shoot a black person,. Given this, I would never BE a cop in this country at this time.
Take away the courts, and an attacker would most assuredly die if he/she tried an attack on me or anyone else close by
https://youtu.be/3ZV9ZV5kHs0
And don’t even think about mugs….
đź‘Ť
But at least it chose her instead of that sleazy CZ..
Eastern European guns smell like cabbage and are just after your ammo……
That is a game changer.
I reload and make cast bullets, but I can’t find a die set to cast this bullet, nor a bullets sales source. But for now, I buy LCD ammo for my back up, in case I’m attacked by angry mutant watermelons…
That looks very good, 1.40/rd at present (plus shipping and tax.)
As Thor indictated, you don't need to stack them too deep ... yet.
I have liked the performance of Winchester Ranger T in reviews, too, but this would be an excellent one to load.
https://palmettostatearmory.com/liber...
(Palmetto does not have the best price, just some reviews.)
I did a bunch of 9mm ammo research for wound channel etc. Can't remember the best. I have to start writing stuff down.
Big fan of 10mm. Too bad it is so expensive, and there aren't too many 10 mm carbines. 9mm doesn't gain much in a longer barrel, but 40 S&W does, and 10mm does some too. You can shoot 40 S&W in most 10mm's. I'd really like a 10mm carbine. That has a lot more energy than 9mm, almost like 357 mag.
Great website: http://ballisticsbytheinch.com/ - it is no longer maintained. I should see if I can take over. GREAT data!
.40 is definitely more powerful than 9mm regardless of the barrel length.
The Ranger T 9mm round that I mentioned elsewhere is the reincarnation of the Black Talon 9mm.
Black Talon got a reputation in the 90's and was removed from production.
(The moron media called it a 'cop-killer' bullet because it could shred a thin poorly designed vest -
thanks to government stupid vest specs.)
Then later, quietly production was restarted without the black coating or the name.
Black Talons sell now for about $8-$10 a round due to limited supply and infamy.
The Ranger T is about $0.80 a round for the same good personal defense performance.
Re 40. My point was that 9mm is designed to get maximum energy out of a pistol barrel. It doesn't benefit much from a longer barrel. Many other rounds (40, 10mm, 357 sig, 357 mag, et al) take great advantage of a longer barrel.
Really wish 30 carbine went further. That is a great round! Great in a rifle. Great in the few pistols it was available in. Flatter than 38 super, et al. More powerful than most pistol rounds, and WAY more powerful in a rifle barrel. It got a bad rap in Korea, with nonsense about thick clothes (or frozen clothes) stopping it. Complete nonsense. My brother bought a Ruger Redhawk in it. I can't bring myself to pay the crazy numbers for the semi auto someone made (can't remember it). When I get better at gunsmithing, I'll make one.
It appears to me that the Corbon and Speer 9mm rounds shown are getting 40-50% increased energy from the 18" barrel over the 3".
The federal 9mm are lower energy performers but may have other benefits.
If I choose the Speer Gold Dot 9mm round that was tested, I get higher energy (and 300-400 higher fps) in a carbine.
The .357 magnum looks like the real winner on carbine energy, but it loses on handgun number of rounds without re-loading.
One of my favorite arguments to "tough guys" with 357 snub noses is that 38 is just as powerful in a 6" barrel. 357 in a short barrel is just a fireball toy, not a practical round.
I'd just carry a 22 magnum, if the rim fire was reliable. I don't think I've ever met someone I'd be threatened by with a couple of 22 magnum holes in them. Somehow I have a mental block against 25, so I just stay with 9mm.
Lots of good choices. Relatively cheap, reliable, accurate (as the shooter) and with the right round, good defense.
Gotta look more into these light, high velocity rounds with expanding/break apart hollow points. I worry a bit about over penetration, and little about vests (maybe changing). Need to look more at these unusual rounds.
Do you reload?
It had been sitting in the boxes unused for years by then.
Sometimes I wish I had kept it all, but, otoh, I could replace it easily and I haven't done so.
9mm out of a 16" Ruger PC Carbine gains 200 -300 feet per second
that extra velocity allows the 9mm to go through level 3 body armor
and i relaod so i can use the best power needed
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJYce...
I maintain that whatever you are doing with 9mm, you can do more with 40, 10, 357 Sig, et al.
ballisticsbytheinch.com/megraphs/9mm....
ballisticsbytheinch.com/megraphs/40sw...
I haven't spent anytime looking at velocity in something like a 50 grain bullet, but if penetrating body armor is the objective, that is the way to go.
https://youtu.be/jAnf-Gd1298
These rounds may be what Bidet is referring to about “blowing a lung out” with the all powerful 9mm weapon of war.
Maybe I should just stick with my DE 50 AE. Kinda hard to conceal tho….
I just take a few steps forward closer to them and whisper “not yet”…
Been using that line for a long time. Recently saw someone using it in a meme.
For handguns, bullet speed leads to over penetration, unless the argument is around vest penetration. Both a 9mm and 22 magnum will go right through a person, causing a wound channel that is the bullet diameter plus the energy transferred in the passage.
What is different in this video is the energy transferred. This is due to the bullet features. The bullet is clearly expanding and/or coming apart in the higher velocity rounds. If this was a 2,200 fps FMJ, the bullet would go in/out, just like the slower ones. The energy has to transfer to make the water melon explode or a big wound channel. Velocity itself does not cause this energy transfer.
Regardless, 40cal, 10mm and 357 Sig are/can be better than 9mm for either velocity or muzzle energy. Which was my original point. The other end of the argument (which is annoying) is the 45 ACP, a big bullet, and rarely over-penetrates, but has has limited capacity, and limited muzzle energy.
DE 50 AE is cool. Looks and bragging rights over performance, but damn cool.
apps, et al, even with EForm, is 6 - 8 months.
I got so sick of bureaucracy, I left.
I was a persona non grata anyway. PM me and I’ll explain why.
It’s a hoot when libtards get played, and too stoopid to even know they got in the deal a greasy feeling down under..
1. Ruger
2. Sig Sauer
3. Smith & Wesson
4. Glock
5. Springfield Armory
6. Mossberg
7. Taurus
8. Colt
9. Henry repeating Arms
10. Beretta
Ruger is totally doing the Marlin line right, moving it, making the designs manufacturable, and doing one line at a time.
I really wanted a Ruger GP100 for my revolvers, but can't reach over the frame to the hammer with my thumb.
I'm shocked S&W hasn't given MA the bird yet. Colt is moving out of CT, and Mossberg did too.
I was all done with Colt after machining the seer-block out of an AR lower so I could put a normal upper on it, and finding out why they put them in. They had a Army general as CEO who though civilians should not own firearms. He was happy to screw them up like this, and only wanted military sales. When they lost AR manufacture due to poor quality, they almost went under. That company was a complete mess, surviving on name only ... until CZ bought them last year.
CZ from Czechoslovakia, the country that voted in their own, new 2nd Amendment a couple of years ago!!! Those people are minded like us, and disparately from Europe! CZ may turn the Colt-cesspool around.
love my snub SP101,
i have 2 Mossberg MVP Bolt Actions
the 556 one uses AR-15 mags
the 308 one uses AR-10 mags
very accurate
That people were ponying up the extra fiat for the Mossy 590 over the 500 tells me that Home Defense is on everyone’s mind. A few lone wolves are ready to Snipe their way into SHTF with the 700s.
The lever action Henry is just for cool sake in my opinion.
Small enough to easily carry concealed. Firestar's still appear for sale on occasion at reasonable prices.
I think that many AR15's are manufactured by small companies
so the total is spread over many companies.
If the total number of AR15's sold was included, it would probably be number 1.
and lots of people buy receivers and make their own
i've made several lowers, for uppers, best to buy them all put together
purchased. Buying a separate upper and separate lower and combining them
yourself easily with 2 included bolts saves you the tax and drives a stake into
the heart of the vampire fedgov.
So, you mean there is an outside chance they were telling the truth?
https://www.galtsgulchonline.com/post...
inexpensive too
i love mine, i want another
for many years, and it has for a striker fired pistol an incredibly tite reset.
The XL extra inch probably adds 50fps and 50ft-lbs.
Plan to also try a Kimber Mako and a H&K VP9SK ... looking for a CCW.
One of my soccer buddies who I got into shooting has a full size VP9. Nice gun!
I'm really in to CZ 75s. With my Shadow 2, I can put 4-5 mags into a 6" circle at 75 ft. Take a look at the CZ 75 compact. It feels SOOO good in your hand!
awesome Battle Rifles, a bit heavy, accurate, they like steel cased ammo (like TULA), did i mention they are accurate?
less expensive than a G3
#7 or #8 birdshot will likely not go through an outside home wall
for my Mossberg 500, i have the mini shell adapter, mini shells are less likely to over penetrate
My Remington 870 shotgun is a match on your list.
I had to annually NRA qualify with it when I worked for the Alabama Department Of Corrections for 21 years.
Bought mine for its familiarity when invited to a dove hunt about 8 years into that career. Had no trouble bagging several birds and pan fried their beasts. Yum!