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    Posted by Aeronca 1 week, 4 days ago
    WHY we can't is because teachers formed a labor union. I don't know if it should be banned altogether or just reformed back to something decent. My public High School was pretty good, on average. I got the basics in math, science and literature, no garbage. They had wood, metal and plastic shop too. That's all gone now. Can we just eliminate the Department of Education?
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    • Posted by capnbitleg 1 week, 4 days ago
      12 years to teach us what should only cost us 4-6 years to learn even at only half as many hours in the day!

      They steal half our childhood from us, fill our heads with a lot of watered-down half truth, and condition us to be passively useful. American History, World History, Social Studies, even PE was a joke.

      Computer Programming? They were always 5 years behind me. English, Math? 2 years behind me.

      I refuse to be grateful to my kidnappers for feeding me bologna sandwiches while I was held in their cages.
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      • Posted by 1 week, 3 days ago
        Bologna sandwiches? You were lucky! At my grade school the kids were fed slop. I mean, bread pudding with tomato squished up in it, sauerkraut, etc. But after New Year's, when I was in second grade, my mother started packing my lunch; usually I had a couple of sandwiches and an apple or something, or maybe a cookie or two. (She gave me 3 cents to pay for milk at school; later it was 4 cents. Eventually my parents got me a thermos jug to take milk to school, but later it got broken.)
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    • Posted by 1 week, 3 days ago
      I don't think it would be enough to eliminate the Dept. of Education. I am against public (government financed, government-operated) education, on principle. It does not protect man from force/violence; it is not part of the proper function of government. And also, education teaches thought processes, which the government should definitely not_be in charge of.. This can, and will, and does, and must, eventually lead to government thought control. This is why its abolition is necessary in order to achieve a free society.--
      And I'm not interested in any such "states' rights" nonsense as saying it's all right at the state level, as long as we get the Federal government out of it. It is _government_which should not be involved in it, period.
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  • Posted by eckert16 1 week, 4 days ago
    Careful what you are exempting. Military sends their 'selected' folks out to be 'educated' at the 'elite universities' for promotions, and their more common members out to 'public universities' to get educated for promotions. Even the military's own service colleges and universities and acadamies are ALL IN on being woke.

    Get rid of the Dept of Education. During the last Government Budget Shutdown, if I recall over 95% of DoE personnel were deemed 'non-essential'... SO... have another Gov Budget Shutdown... and automatically fire anyone deemed 'non essential'. Bingo... they identified themselves for release...why is the Gov hiring 'non-essential' anyway?
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    • Posted by 1 week, 3 days ago
      In the military, the personnel have to be taught how to used the equipment (guns, surveillance of the enemy,etc.) That is why I would exempt that. But at least they are not indoctrinating children or forming (or ruining) their minds.
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  • Posted by $ splumb 1 week, 4 days ago
    I almost commented on Massachusetts's compulsory education attendance act of 1852, but then I remembered Plato's Republic.
    This is an old, old battle.
    Parents vs. the State.
    Either way, I don't believe for a second that these edicts were designed for the good of the children.
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  • Posted by starguy 1 week, 4 days ago
    Abolish the teachers unions
    Shut down the federal Dept of Education
    Issue school vouchers for every schoolchild, including homeschoolers
    This isn't that difficult.
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    • Posted by 1 week, 3 days ago
      Well, that idea about school voucher for everybody is interesting. But that would just be a way for government to insinuate its way into power over the citizens and their children.
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  • Posted by bobbitchen34 1 week, 4 days ago
    Public education used to be a good thing. Maybe it would still be if Bill Ayers had been sent to prison like he should have been.
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    • Posted by 1 week, 3 days ago
      I don't believe it was ever a good thing. It think it is wrong in principle. But excuse me, who is/was Bill Ayers?
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      • Posted by 1 week, 1 day ago
        Sorry, bobbictchen34, I can't go along with your defense of the idea. Maybe you did get what you could from it. Perhaps more rational influences existed in it at the time, but it eventually has to lead to government thought control. That is why I do not want it to exist. And do you want educators to be "more altruistic"? You say that in"Galt's Gulch"?
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      • Posted by bobbitchen34 1 week, 3 days ago
        Hello Liberty Belle,
        I do disagree especially in principle as that is what I think is the only thing sound. But I am open to hearing your viewpoint if you have the time to expound.
        Basically my premise is that I am a mutt with above average intelligence and it scares me to think of where I'd be without the public education I did receive.
        I was lucky to live in a time when educators were more altruistic and actually were interested in imparting knowledge to young people and were actually open to disagreement. Not being from a rich family I had to depend on public education and there was a lot offered there if one took the initiative to get as much as they could from what was offered and available.
        In 4th grade I had a teacher who on her own time spent hours after school to help me learn Japanese. I was on the debate team later in high school where I learned how to make a logical argument.
        Bill Ayers was a criminal terrorist who is probably responsible for killing at least 1 policeman in San Francisco. Him and his wife were building bombs and mailing them out to people they wanted killed. He is also implicated as the ghost writer for Obama's autobiography.
        His wife was convicted for her part in the bombings but he had connections with a parent high in tyhe department of education. And instead of serving time he somehow got a position in government education. I believe he is a major contributor to what has devolved into the current state of education.
        PLEASE don't take my reply as confrontational to your views. Given the current state I completely understand why someone would feel as you do. But I had a positive experience and gained a lot. I had to apply myself to gain but I also don't know if there would have been an opportunity for me without public education as it was in the 50s and the 60s.
        AS it exists now though I am completely in agreement that it has to go but the principle of educating people is not the problem it's the execution of it as a tool for changing our culture.



        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Ay...
        This article whitewashes things a lot. There are a lot of people who believe that people were killed by Ayers and his wife. Especially the case of the SF policeman. That was never resolved to any real degree of proof.

        edited: added addition to a comment on the Wikipedia article stating my doubt of completeness.
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        • Posted by $ Dobrien 1 week, 2 days ago
          Bill Ayers dad was the Chairman of the Board at Commonwealth Edison. Bill Ayers , He pretended to be oppressed in the 60’s . Life was very tough having a silver spoon in his wretched mouth.
          He groomed and handled Barry Soetoro in Chicago
          Put him in with the Activist’s crowd and VJ.
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  • Posted by term2 1 week, 4 days ago
    Great Idea. Give back the tax money to the parents and sell off the school buildings to private enterprise and let the parents decide which school the kids go to.

    Will never happen though, as the educational establishment is way too entrenched in our political structure, and the unions would have a fit and win. Maybe a better solution is just to accept the property taxes as just another tax, reduce the number of kids we have, and send them to private schools that are available. Let the public schools die.
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    • Posted by 1 week, 3 days ago
      But many parents can't do that, because they are already taxed to pay for the public schools, so they don't have the money left to pay for private-enterprise education. (also a reply to term2).
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    • Posted by 1 week, 3 days ago
      For many centuries, Europe had established churches, even during and after the Protestant Reformation. But after a while, the Americans did not just passively accept it. We don't, ultimately, have to just accept an Establishment of Education, either.
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      • Posted by term2 1 week, 1 day ago
        Actually I went to catholic schools up until 9th grade. I think my mother at the time thought the public schools were not that good. 10th-12th was in public school for me, and essentially worthless. If I had kids I wouldnt bother sending them to public school
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  • Posted by $ Ben_C 1 week, 4 days ago
    My daughter learned more in three years (six / seven and eight grade) in private school than she did in four years of public high school. Her high school was a joke and prepared her poorly for college. Sadly her private school did not offer high school otherwise she would have continued with them.
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  • Posted by $ blarman 1 week, 4 days ago
    It is interesting to read from the primers given to schoolteachers back in the 1800's. Their certification was rigorous and expansive. They had to read from various poetic authors as well as all the basics of mathematics, geography, spelling, diction, government, etc. And because they were hired and paid in most cases by the parents of the students themselves, they were very vested in real education. And because the parents paid for that education, they were very intolerant of bad behavior at school.

    Abstracting both the payment of teachers and the payments BY parents to government entities has created a kind of third-party payer problem in the world of education. Instead of being responsive to students' needs and working with parents to address them, teachers are now beholden to their unions and their school principals. Because parents don't pay directly for the education of their children, they tune out of the education process and remove the single most critical element of education - themselves! And not only the children, but all of society suffers as a result!

    Try going to a parent-teacher conference. Most of the public school teachers I've talked with about my children are honest, caring educators, but a majority are lucky to get 25% of the parents to attend and go over their students' progress. (Unsurprisingly, the parents who do attend are generally the parents of the better students!)

    Can we fault the public education system? For perverse incentives? Yes. For radical indoctrination? Absolutely. For parental neglect? Nope. For behavioral problems in students? Nope. I'd say there's plenty wrong but not all of it can be blamed on the system.

    (Disclaimer: I am a CURRENT parent of nine children currently in the "education" system. I have three in college, two in high school, and four being home schooled by my wife.)
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    • Posted by 1 week, 3 days ago
      i think that sometimes parents do want to send their children out of the house, to get rid of them for a large part of the day, rather than be bothered with them.
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      • Posted by $ blarman 1 week, 1 day ago
        Yes. And those aren't really parents but guardians. And I feel bad for those kids.

        Kids are remarkably simple to understand. They want love. They want someone to care about them when they fall down. That's typically the role of Mom. They also want security, meaning a place of safety where their needs are met. That's usually the role of Dad. And when you have both of those, children are far more likely to end up being producing members of society. And that's before you end up attaching any particular value system to the equation! Children need BOTH their biological parents - preferably in that stable arrangement historically known as Marriage.


        On another point, my mother-in-law taught kindergarten for several years. She had one student who was so bad he had been sent to several different schools. (Yes - a kindergartner.) He literally disrupted class for all of the other students but because of the school district's policies - and the mother's unwillingness to address the problem - it took months to get the child's bad behavior even evaluated by the principal.

        I think that the idea of making education a universal goal is noble, but stupid. There is no point in trying to have a third party force kids to do something. They either have to want it themselves or it is wasted effort. Worse, it's a major distraction to all the other students in class who want to learn. It's very telling that you don't see discipline issues in private schools.
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  • Posted by rhfinle 1 week, 4 days ago
    I consider myself a victim pf the public school system. When my kids came along, we made a decision, early on, that we would not inflict (and that's the kindest word I can find) public school on our kids. My kids were home-schooled, then sent to private schools. My son has a degree and makes good money. My daughter in an exceptional engineering student and is planning for grad school and probably med school after that. Meanwhile a friend of mine, who works in and lauds the public school system, has total-loser kids who would be poster children for avoiding the public school system, but I don't think they all actually graduated. You get what you pay for.
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    • Posted by 1 week, 1 day ago
      There was some question on the radio the other year about whether [public, I think] school teachers should be allowed to go on strike. I called in and said that when the school children were allowed to go on strike, maybe I would consider it. I said, "Until then, forget it."
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  • Posted by Aeronca 1 week, 4 days ago
    My Mother was an English teacher for about 20 years from the 80s to the 90s. She observed the standards being deliberately decreased over time. By the time she was fed up and finally quit, she was not allowed to correct spelling, grammar or punctuation.

    Now with the assault weapon called Critical Theory, I read about the Critical Math Theory project, after Bill Gates admitted that Math is Racist on National Television.

    Focusing on getting the right answer is racist. Having each student work alone is racist. Requiring students to show their work is racist. They want everyone to work on the exam together and the smart students will pull along the rest and everyone gets an A.

    This is a direct assault on Civilization and Competence. It is not compassionate, it is evil destructive resentment, being pushed into the children by the Destructocrats. The deconstructionists, postmodernists, Communists, it's all the same damn thing.

    And they think they are doing a compassionate loving thing.
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    • Posted by 1 week, 3 days ago
      "Having each student work alone is racist." Only now? During my second-grade year (1959-1960) my teacher got very nasty with me for going away from others to work alone (I remember,once, during some sort of play assignment). That was her last year there. I think she was some kind of Deweyite. (And do you remember Equality-2757's remarks on his society's condemnation of thinking or working alone, in Anthem?
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