What's Next? Galt's Gulch?

Posted by $ johnrobert2 10 years, 7 months ago to Culture
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Dammit, this has got to stop someplace!!@!!


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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    See, that's actually one of the fundamental problems of Objectivism that I was talking about. The whole "non-contradiction" thing certainly seems simple and straightforward enough on the surface, but once you start getting into deeper, more advanced philosophical theories, it starts to unravel. This is especially true when dealing with advanced mathematical theory, on which a significant amount of philosophy is based. For example, Harvard mathematician Barry Mazur wrote a 24 page paper dealing with the nature of identity and equality titled "When is one thing equal to some other thing?" And Terence Parsons, professor of philosophy and linguistics at UCLA, wrote an entire textbook on the issue, titled "Indeterminate Identity: Metaphysics and Semantics." Then there's also the critically acclaimed and bestselling book "The God Problem," by Howard Bloom, which actually references Ayn Rand directly, and explores the history and origins of the equation A = A. You can skip Terence Parsons' textbook, but at the very least you should read Barry Mazur's brief paper and Howard Bloom's book, "The God Problem." It'll make you rethink your position about A = A.

    Here are the links:

    "When is one thing equal to some other thing?" by Barry Mazur:
    http://www.math.harvard.edu/~mazur/prepr...

    "Indeterminate Identity: Metaphysics and Semantics," by Terence Parsons:
    http://www.amazon.com/Indeterminate-Iden...

    "The God Problem," by Howard Bloom:
    http://www.amazon.com/The-God-Problem-Go...

    Now don't get me wrong, I believe Ayn Rand provides a great deal of much needed and invaluable insight into the diametrically opposed theories of capitalism and socialism, but anytime she gets off the topic of economics, her arguments tend to be less than convincing, and I frankly don't see how adhering to a particular mathematical philosophy has anything to do with promoting capitalism.

    By the way, using Objectivist theory to try and prove the truth of Objectivist theory is circular reasoning. That's like asking an insurance salesman whether or not you need insurance (you won't get an unbiased answer).

    Anyway, I'm sure I'll get around to reading Leonard Peikoff's book eventually, as you suggested, though I'm currently reading other books about Ayn Rand, so it probably won't be until I'm finished with those. But thanks for the recommendation. ;)
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  • Posted by Rocky_Road 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    "Why did you choose those type of articles to make your point?"

    Your post does a good job of answering this.
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  • Posted by $ Mimi 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I think it’s pretty clear most here are Libertarians, Republicans or Tea Party members, or like myself, lean in those directions but like to be viewed as an Independent.The one common thread: We love Atlas Shrugged. So why do you insist on posting articles that are so incredibly negative to the very audience you are trying to relate to? How do you feel about the term Tea bagger? Tea bagger is a vile description. I’m not going to follow a link that starts off with such a insidious description, without a qualifier from you. Why did you choose those type of articles to make your point? And if you choose to use articles that are going to raise eyebrows (don’t play stupid because you are not) then defend the premise of said articles from YOUR POV. Good grief, if I had to humor and explain to some around here why I linked to a history-piece that had nothing to do with politics because they objected to being linked to an article from PBS, then you at least should explain some of your choices. What do you want? What do you believe? What words would you use to describe yourself if not a Progressive? I think you allowed yourself to get blown off course when you made the statement the American Family Association was a radical extremist organization then proceeded to use a straw man argument, that encompassed the Tea Party to make your point.
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  • Posted by khalling 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    maph-never heard of it. but I will also say at this point as a hetero- I don't like it that I have been re-named as a cis without my consent
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Posting links on a forum isn't really what I would consider "hard work." >_>
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  • Posted by MattFranke 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Partially. It says that you are capable of seeing the truth, but are seemingly unwilling to turn yourself over to it. You have some contradictions to work out of your views. But, you are here so there is always hope. May I recommend Objectivism: The Philosophy of Ayn Rand by Leonard Peikoff. They go into great detail how important it is to integrate one's beliefs into a non-contradictory whole. Only then, is reason the master, and not chaos. It is philosophy at its finest. It has helped to clarify many things for me personally; even if, only by putting words to things I already knew without realizing.
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Well, if it's a choice between progressive and conflicted, I'll take conflicted. ^_^
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  • Posted by Rocky_Road 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Why would a self proclaimed "Libertarian", work so darn hard to smear the Tea Party?

    Something doesn't add up, here....
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    NOM: National Organization for Marriage, an anti-LGBT organization whose primary purpose is to oppose marriage equality for the LGBT community and who was one of the primary organizations behind Proposition 8 in California, though recently they've also begun participating in other anti-LGBT legislation that has nothing to do with marriage.
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I generally try to avoid labels, since once you've labeled yourself as something, you then have to carry all the political baggage of that label.

    Though at the same time, it's probably not possible to avoid labels entirely, since a label is ultimately a convenient way to categorize people with similar opinions, and forming opinions is something everyone does in their journey through life.

    Personally, I've actually thought a lot about how I would describe myself and my views, and I've decided that the best label to describe my philosophical viewpoint would probably be Utilitarianism (that is, I believe you can know whether something is good or not by whether or not it works), whereas politically I generally refer to myself as a Left-Leaning Libertarian. I could also be described as ardently anti-Communist and highly suspicious of Socialism, yet at the same time I do believe that social justice issues are incredibly important, and I consider myself an advocate for civil rights. I could probably be described as a feminist in some ways, though there are many feminists (mostly second wave radicals from the 70s) who say things I don't agree with at all.

    Most of my views on economics and business come primarily from the "Rich Dad, Poor Dad" series of books by Robert Kiyosaki, as well as "How to Win Friends and Influence People," by Dale Carnegie, and also a few books written by Donald Trump. I love Ayn Rand's fiction, and I believe her novels reveal many important flaws in communist/socialist ideology, though her non-fiction work generally feels half-baked, and I believe that although her philosophy makes many poignant and accurate observations, there are just as many deep, fundamental flaws and oversights underlying its reasoning.

    During the 2012 election, the presidential candidates who I found most appealing and who I agreed with the most were Ron Paul and Gary Johnson.

    Does that answer your question?
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  • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    He's implying he's against gays... (which equals conservative, which equals gulchers, in Maph's mind.)
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  • Posted by MattFranke 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I know that I don't fit into any one category, so I wouldn't expect it of anyone else, unless it was of their own choosing. My statement is in regard to LS' analysis of Maphs leanings, even if he himself seems unaware of how he comes across.
    I hope Maphesdus is just in the early stages of breaking his respective conditioning, as you and I once were. I will give him the benefit of the doubt for a while, to see if he truly seeks to live by reason; if so, I might choose to respect him for that when that actually might be the case. At the moment, I must withhold, said respect. Nothing personal.
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  • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 6 months ago in reply to this comment.
    "Relatively conservative" means squat to us... and I don't think you're "aware" to begin with.
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