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What do you disagree with Ayn Rand on?

Posted by $ qhrjk 3 months, 2 weeks ago to Ask the Gulch
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Hello,

How do I phrase this... I was curious if anyone has some criticisms about Objectivism on here. What do you disagree with? What would you change? Would you articulate something differently?

Nothing's black and white, I guess.
I'm not asking this out of spite or anything of the matter; I'm just a student who wants to hear different perspectives.

Thanks!


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    Posted by $ allosaur 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    Guess you could call it carte blanche abortion.
    Me dino is for it if a lady's life is in danger.
    I believe in a higher power too. Don't give a flip who doesn't like it.
    No one is perfect. Not even an awesome intellect as was Ayn Rand's
    BTW, I'm here to learn and have fun-~~not to pass someone's muster.
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    • Posted by $ Suzanne43 3 months, 2 weeks ago
      Well said my favorite dinosaur!!! I don't agree with my hero, Ayn Rand on everything either. Isn't that what a thinking person should do instead of being a robot.
      I, too, believe in a higher power...I'm a Christian. I have been unbelievably criticized for my beliefs by some in the Gulch who also said that the Gulch was no place for me and therefore, I should leave. Well, thanks to a lot of Gulchers who supported me, I'm still here, I respect your opinions, so please respect mine. As Ronald Reagan said, "The person who agrees with you 80% of the time is a friend and as ally not a 20% traitor."
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      • Posted by $ allosaur 3 months, 2 weeks ago
        Well said yourself. I'm a Christian too.
        Me dino found out about Ayn Rand by a brother who made Christmas presents of all three Atlas Shrugged DVDs.
        Oh--oh, yeah. He''s also a Christian, by the way.
        Bet there's some practicing Jews who like Ayn Rand too.
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        • Posted by ycandrea 3 months, 2 weeks ago
          Ditto with everything you both said. I am a Christian and I do not like carte blanche abortion. I have been under fire here in the Gulch and I have been asked to leave. I am also a true thinker and I own my mind and I analyze everything down to the root to get to the truth of things. I have always been like that. I have read Atlas Shrugged and many, many other Ayn Rand books. I love her! But I do not agree with everything she says because somethings do not pass muster.
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        • Posted by $ Suzanne43 3 months, 1 week ago
          Yes, the practicing Jewish people do like Ayn Rand.
          I wish that there were more of them.
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          • Posted by $ allosaur 3 months, 1 week ago
            While writing my above post, me dino almost placed "--Jews" direct behind "Bet there's some--" but I paused and thought "No! No! No!" and inserted "practicing."
            Why is me dino thinking of a lot of Jew voters? (Notice the absence of a modifier). Now I'm thinking of Barbara Striesand. Rather not. Me dino go bye bye now.
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  • Posted by Pecuniology 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    "Nothing's black and white, I guess."

    Without black (wrong) and white (right), gray (compromise) is impossible. See Ayn Rand's "'Extremism,' or the Art of Smearing" in Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal for details. If the choice is between eating wholesome food, tainted food, or poison, there is no shame in being an extremist and accepting only the wholesome food. When compromising with liars, thieves, or violent attackers, it is only the liars, thieves, and attackers who benefit.

    --- --- ---

    Objectivism is based on self-evident axioms of reality, identity, and reason. There is nothing to quibble with here. If any of these did not exist, then your question and my answer could not exist. However, some of Ayn Rand's later applications of Objectivism to specific issues were flawed.

    smoking

    Her most obvious error was her defense of cigarette smoking. Imagining oneself to be a latter-day Prometheus by holding fire in one's finger tips is one thing, but sucking tar and nicotine into one's lungs is another thing altogether. Maybe she could have achieved the same goal by advocating candle making or cooking on gas stoves rather than electric stoves.

    government

    Ayn Rand's description of government in "The Nature of Government" conflates self-defense with revenge; she does not draw a clear distinction between them, leaving the reader to wonder which she is discussing at times. Her insistence on a government monopoly on the initiation of violence ignores the power of an armed populace to hold tyranny at bay, not only through the direct threat of popular armed resistance, but much more through the cultivating of a culture that supports independent thought, action, and responsibility. Unless the military consisted predominantly of foreign mercenaries, its soldiers and officers would have grown up within such a culture and be more likely to resist orders from tyrants, whether democratically elected or installed through a coup or an invasion, perhaps to the point of taking preemptive action against government rulers.

    In spite of her later position, one of the greatest heroes in Atlas Shrugged is a vigilante pirate. Her justifications for Ragnar Danneskjöld are much more convincing than her protestations in "The Nature of Government."

    intellectual property

    Many objectivists embrace Rand's position in "Patents and Copyrights," but it is founded on an analysis of human rights rather than on the underlying metaphysical reality of the nature of information. Ultimately, the argument is grounded on convenience, rather than on rights.

    Specifically, anything that can be encoded as a string of 1s and 0s and stored on a hard drive is a large binary number; a number that is unusually valuable, granted, but a number, nonetheless. To claim ownership of a specific string of 1s and 0s is to claim ownership of a number. It does not matter if that number is 6, 42, or some massively large number; it is a number. Granted, it might have taken a herculean effort to discover the utility of that specific number, but the Labor Theory of Value was debunked in the 1870s.

    Economic value—i.e., price—is determined by the combination of scarcity of supply and degree of demand. If there is so much of a good that everyone can have as much as he wants without negatively impacting anyone else's consumption of that good, then the market price is zero.

    Copyrights and patents require the existence of coercive government to enforce the artificial monopolies on quasi-infinitely available information goods. They are different from trademarks that can exist in a state of nature among civilized persons, who recognize each others' brand markings; this is why one can sell bound paper copies of Shakespeare's works without paying royalties to Shakespeare's heirs, but not claim them as one's own creation. Rather than cling to outdated rationales for patents and copyrights, one conforms more closer with objective reality by acknowledging the contradictions inherent within those rationales and designing more robust business models.

    Take, for example, the operators of this website. They have created artificial scarcity by restricting access to certain features, and they charge a modest fee for access to those features. That is a cleverer solution than slapping up a paywall that makes the user choose upfront whether to subscribe, and it is much less annoying than slapping banner ads all over the interface.

    polygyny

    This is not a major concern, but just a nagging observation.

    Ayn Rand demonstrated through her own behavior that she was not fundamentally opposed to adultery. She also made clear in several places that women seek men, up to whom they can look for inspiration (and, presumably, protection). The corollary of this is the widely recognized tendency for men to marry Cinderellas. So far, so good.

    If women marry up, and adultery is not de facto immoral, then why not take that last logical step and support man-sharing? Perhaps John Galt would have settled for no one other than Dagny Taggart, but the next man down the totem pole might have been OK with two or three of the next heroines in the hierarchy, who preferred to share the second man, rather than settle for a monogamous relationship with the third man in line.

    This is not to suggest that polygyny be mandated by some formula; only that it be recognized as an explicit corollary of the adulterous Cinderella.

    (With regard to how to deal with the excess of men at the bottom of society, we probably would have to seek our answer in the works of Robert Heinlein, rather than in the works of Ayn Rand.)
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    • Posted by Pecuniology 3 months, 2 weeks ago
      ugh!!! The typos! They write themselves.

      The last sentence in the penultimate paragraph under intellectual property should read:

      "...one conforms more closely with objective reality..."
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  • Posted by cranedragon 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    This seems to be an Objectivist, rather than an Ayn Rand position [as this question has now been refined] but -- I fundamentally oppose the position that abortion is solely a question of the mother's rights and that the child, admittedly totally dependent upon the mother's body for safety and sustenance, has no rights and no place in any discussion of the right moral response. If the mother's health is truly in danger, then she has the right to defend herself. If not, then we are weighing the rights of two human beings, one of whom is totally innocent and without any ability to defend himself or herself against a person in power choosing to end the life of the innocent.

    I would posit that all of us recognize people who are so essential to our happiness that we would risk our lives to protect theirs, even if we knew that the risk was so high that our own death was a virtual certainty. I have always put my children's lives in that category. The risk to my own life would have to be enormous and virtually certain for me to entertain a choice that would destroy my own child, however young.

    Of course, there are hard questions. What about rape? What about the molested girl? It is axiomatic that hard choices make bad law. But, hard choices -- and the face of the traumatized victim looking at us -- is insufficient reason to ignore the face that we don't see.

    So, the Ayn Rand/Objectivist position that abortion should, nay must, be available at all times and for any reason has always struck me as utterly lacking in any consideration of the absent voice in the discussion.
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  • Posted by mia767ca 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    I had this discussion on psycho-epistemology of pilots with Ayn during the NBI days in NYC...she was not very confident in their dedication to their profession...

    years later I had luncheons in L.A. on layovers (I was a pilot for American Airlines) and discussed this with Nathaniel Branden...he said that Ayn was concerned with many critical professions that did not practice professionalism and that their psycho-epistemology was suspect...

    I got to know Ayn and Nat by attending all NBI sessions while I was in college during the 60s...her side comments were very enlightening...she was not treated well by the academia at all...to include the Austrian School of Economics and many Conservatives (William Buckley in particular)…

    later I was an instructor pilot for the Air Force and trained military students from every culture around the world and in the U.S....plus I was an FAA-designee instructor for American Airlines...along with being in the I.G. (inspector general) and Stan/Eval (standization/evalution) in the Air Force...

    professionalism was all over the map...from terrible and to highly qualified...I came to understand her reservations...I have seen it all...I have had student pilots try every which way to kill themselves and me while learning to fly due to their lack of attention to detail and the rules of reality...they got away with it with me onboard...and use to kid some of them that they were so far behind the airplane procedurely, that if it crashed they wouldn't get hurt...lol...they finally got it and paid better attention to details...

    people try to make life more difficult that it really is...and lose perspective...like when forming concepts from percepts...learning to ignore the tons of nonsense and prioritize the essentials that will keep you alive...
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  • Posted by $ brightwriter 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    I agree with Ayn Rand about most of her writings, but I also believe in Christianity. The wish to help others less fortunate than themselves is set aside by Rand and urged, though not mandated, by Christian doctrine.

    My own experience is perhaps relevant. I was put in jail for a month due to a contempt-of-court action after a bad divorce: I had to get life insurance to guarantee alimony and child support and due to illnesses could not get it. An unsympathetic Maine Supreme Court had me locked up. So there I was, having committed no crime, mingling with other minimum-security men often locked up for alcohol or drug misadventures, and I told the interested that glutamine 1 gram three times daily reduces the physical craving for alcohol and pineapple reduces the urge to smoke nicotine (both true). I also told a guard who had a migraine problem that turkey, magnesium, and oxygen help (also true). When I lost my balance in the gym and nearly fell, my colleagues were frightened on my behalf and ran to my rescue (I had a stroke years earlier).

    I didn't tell my colleagues there about my attempt to help the most despised people in our society (see http://harshman.name/brightwriter/Lan... at the time, but I sent the jail library a copy of that book and the others I wrote as soon as I got out.

    I had an easy enough month there that I am pretty sure I had divine help, due to my having been badly treated by the government and having tried to help the despised downtrodden. Ayn Rand seems to have missed that possibility.
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  • Posted by $ AMeador1 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    I don't believe there is anything I have come across in my studies of Objectivism that I disagree with. Too many people, in my opinion, have a flawed understanding of too many of its concepts. It is the application of it that is difficult.

    Ayn Rand even made a point of this. We all have different experiences and very differing levels of knowledge - even on the same topics. Remaining open to the idea that we may have different opinions on the same topic due to those differences is vital. And having real conversations - with depth - is the only way to reconcile those differences and figure out what is correct and what is not and to correct those parts in our minds once we do so. The point is, even among Objectivists, you will find differing opinions on a subject. Knowledge is not grey - it is simply a matter of finding the errors and correcting them, or filling in gaps where they exist. The broadness of people's experiences make this difficult and time consuming to do - especially if not founded in Objectivist rationality to begin with - as there will surely be more to correct.

    Anyway - the most specific two examples I can think of is Rand's error in judgement about her consensual affair with Nathaniel Branden and her stance on abortion. In the first case - I think she made a value judgement error that resulted in her husband turning to alcohol. I think this arrangement was more complicated and damaging than she had anticipated - and surely would have done otherwise if she had the power to reverse time. Second, Objectivism is based in reality and reason - and supports rational science. And clearly, not taking up force against others - unless they are imposing force on another. An unborn baby - just because it is called a fetus - is still a human being. Moving from one side of mom's flesh to the other - does not convert it from non-human to human. It always was a human. A = A. Science shows that we are always moving the age earlier and earlier that a baby can live outside of the mother. It is not rational to assume the pre-born baby is forcing the mother. But, allowing the mother, to kill the pre-born baby is totally antithetical to Objectivism and I think it be a blatant travesty that she and Leonard Peikoff hold this stance. I understand the mothers right to HER own body - but the baby inside of her is not HER body. This logic could apply to her OBGYN when reaching in to remove placenta after birth - he/she is inside her - therefore she could shoot him/her at that moment? I think it is very simple - the baby inside/outside of the mother is a separate human life and should be protected from force just as equally. Life is the ultimate basis of Objectivism. Self. The sovereign individual. That does not give the right for someone dependent on another to be executed by their caretaker. No more than people on Welfare, which I disagree with strongly as an Objectivist, should be able to be killed by those whom pay taxes. The only exception for the mother and unborn baby is when there is true serious medical risk for the mother - but that is VERY small at this point in modern medicine and the options available.
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  • Posted by $ WilliamShipley 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    I don't claim to be an objectivist, but I find myself agreeing with them more often than not.

    One of the core philosophical positions she espouses is the rejection of the initiation of force. This is, of course, an admirable and desirable position to take.

    Nevertheless, it has happened throughout history. Pretty much every piece of land is owned by someone as the result of it being taken away from someone else by force at some point in the past. Sometimes the distant past.

    Antarctica is probably an exception.

    Her argument that we we own the land of the U.S., not because we took it from the Indians but because we were the first to put it to effective use ignores the hundreds of years of Indian culture such as Cahokia in southern Illinois which was a farming and trade center which had a population as high as 40,000 at its peak.

    Of course other tribes took it from them in the meantime.

    I live in Southern California and I'm sure that if you follow the deed of my house back far enough you will find I own it because the U.S. took it from Mexico.
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    • Posted by lrshultis 3 months ago
      Do you wish to not have been born? Your life depends upon the conditions of the past. If slavery had not been a widespread condition in the past, very few of us would exist. The timing for the genome mixing in conceptions would be changed, assuming that your parents would have been born and have even met. There are no ready made souls which a deity inserts in some random body to give one a self such as in you and me. We are self made selves of bodies that grow due to the random mixing of the genome of a particular sperm and ovum at an exact moment in history. It was just a matter of one particular sperm out of millions penetrating the ovum and the production of the DNA of the future person. That is how no person is exactly like any other person. It has a large amount of randomness to the process of conception and growth of a future human person.

      Had there been a different outcome with the land of the Earth, most of us would most likely not exist. It is somewhat like the exaggeration in time traveler stories where someone changes some small thing in the past and with the affecting of the future to a large extent. Large past affects will cause large effects such as whether one is born or not.

      I know what you are saying about those pilots that you instructed. In my case back in the mid 60's at about the time that Rand gave her Objectivist Ethics lecture at the University of Wisconsin - Madison, I graded math papers for the United States Armed Forces Institute. There were students who were learning arithmetic who would, for some reason that I could not understand, just resubmit the same paper over and over without even trying to correct mistakes. They could not concentrate long enough to care whether they had learned something new.
      It seems like you had more success in the pilots and not too many were able to remove themselves from the gene pool.
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      • Posted by $ 25n56il4 3 months ago
        I have a comment on this. If slavery was so bad, try being an American Indian. Our government hasn't kept one Treaty they ever made with the Indians. They are criticized for being alcoholics! Think about that! You don't want to walk in their moccasins!
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  • Posted by LibertyBelle 3 months, 1 week ago
    I understand she didn't like Gilbert & Sullivan, but I am a big G&S fan, I don't intend ever to change that.
    I think that it would be wrong to abort a fetus after it gets brain waves (which I guess would be within about the first 3 months). They go by brain activity to know when life ends, don't they? So shouldn't that be the standard about when it begins, at least as a conscious being?
    I fully agree with the necessity and appropriateness of divorce, in some cases. But I don't agree with doing a menage a trois; I think if you don't love your spouse, you should just get a divorce. (If in a country where this is legally impossible, maybe that would be different, at least if appropriate notice were given to the spouse. But I think it should be one person or the other, not trying to have both).
    I'm not trying to interfere in other people's personal business; I mean that if I were married, that other stuff is something I simply would not tolerate; I'd rather just get a divorce.
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  • Posted by $ Radio_Randy 3 months, 1 week ago
    The only thing (in Atlas Shrugged) that I immediately disagree with (and I may be mistaken with my understanding) was her stance on charity.

    In the movie, John Galt made a much more convincing argument in stating that they (the strikers) were not against charity IF it were on their terms...he didn't simply shut himself off to giving.

    In that particular case, I would have to agree with the movie's opinion, as that is the way I see it.
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  • Posted by PURB 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    I've found difficulty with Rand's insistence that consciousness presupposes existence. Galt declares: "A consciousness conscious of nothing but itself is a contradiction in terms: before it COULD IDENTIFY ITSELF as consciousness, it had to be conscious of something." (Emphasis added.) Yet elsewhere she writes: "The hallmark of a mystic is the savagely stubborn refusal to accept the fact that consciousness, like any other existent, possesses identity, that it is a faculty of a specific nature, functioning through specific means." This second quote (from ITOE) seems to imply that consciousness, "like any other existent," exists INDEPENDENT of whether or not anyone has identified it.
    Further, while this is not "Objectivism," I dislike Rand's assigning motivation, often highly unfavorable, even evil, to theorists with whose ideas she disagrees. There is no way she could have known or should have declared that "Kant is the most evil man in mankind's history."
    But as someone else on this thread declared, I learned a great deal more from her, more with which I agree than disagree. And to paraphrase her own words elsewhere still: Hers was "so great an achievement that her errors are irrelevant by comparison. You will find my tribute to her in that fact that I've collected and sold her rare, signed and manuscript works since I met her when I was 16.
    Do contact me if you're interested in acquiring rare, signed, and/or manuscript Ayn Rand. Pen Ultimate Rare Books
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  • Posted by stevieg88 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    If I recall correctly, Ms Rand was highly dismissive of Libertarians, at one point calling them "Hippies of the right wing".
    I disagree.
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    • Posted by $ AMeador1 3 months, 2 weeks ago
      I think it was the people in the Libertarian movement she was primarily talking about. I have seen the same thing. Too many people that don't really know what they think, politically or otherwise, get angry at their Dem or Repub parties and 'Libertarian' sounds good. Literally - the name itself. Much like many Dems think they are Progressives - yet are not - but they like the implication of the name. As such, and from my personal experience as well, too many people who call themselves Libertarian are all over the spectrum and don't really know were they themselves really stand or what Libertarian stands for - as it is defined. I don't give the Libertarian movement much political credibility at the moment because of this. "They" are simply too divided in what they "think" and will not get anywhere for some time - if ever. They will have more impact on swinging elections from Dem to Rep and vice verse - but not to themselves. Maybe that will change over time - but I think it will take a long time.
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  • Posted by Owlsrayne 3 months, 1 week ago
    I believe in the concepts that Ayn Rand writes in Atlas Shrugged. But, I don't think that she foresaw the political rift that is happening in the US and the sham impeachment inquiry that is crippling the Congress. Also, the uptick of Civil War talk on the internet Social Media, etc.
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  • Posted by $ Stormi 3 months, 1 week ago
    As a female, raised on objectivism before I knew its name, I find it pretty sound. It works, it is logical, it is what should be. I also have an issue with late term abortions, which did not exist in her her day. At some point, that baby is a person with Constitutional rights to think and b, the mother was responsible for not being careful with birth control, live with the consequences or give the child up. I admit to an amount of spiritualisty, but somehow, I feel whatever God led us to objectivism and hopes we live by it and stop calling him for help for every little thing. Extreme religion and psychology lead to dependence on others, when we all should try to be strong individuals. Rand was hard on FLW, felt he did not live up to the lead in "Fountainhead", maybe that was her putting more expectation on en than women, as she seemed harder on them, while not so much on women.
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  • Posted by Eyecu2 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    My biggest issue with Ayn Rand's positions is on religion. I am a Christian and have many times articulated my argument on Religion vrs Atheism with Pascal's Wager.
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    • Posted by lrshultis 3 months ago
      Pascal's Wager is "the argument that it is in one's own best interest to behave as if God exists, since the possibility of eternal punishment in hell outweighs any advantage in believing otherwise."

      It is similar to the law of economics that one should consider what is seen and also what is not seen, i.e., what is the cost to a life if one spends ones life as a theist spending a lifetime in fear of a nasty threatening deity and discards the cost of being an atheist in terms of the value of ones life?
      What is tossed out of that wager is what happens if the atheist is right and the theist is wrong. Since ones life is what is important, spending a life believing in a non-existent god would have been a wasted lifetime. All that the theist has to offer is a made up threat by those who would try to control humans promising pain and suffering for eternity if one does not bow to them.
      Rand's position on religion was that belief by faith in the absence of evidence for something is wrong. If there is evidence from which to infer the existence of a god, then believe by reason, The fact that others believe in a god is not sufficient to infer the existence of God.
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      • Posted by Eyecu2 3 months ago
        Which is where I part with Ms. Rand, I am a Christian.

        If you explore Pascal's Wager there are 4 possibilities.
        1 there is a God and you believe = Infinite win
        2 there is a God and you don't believe = Infinite loss
        3 there is no God and you believe = Small comfort in your mistaken belief
        4 there is no God and you don't believe = zero sum no win no loss

        Personally I think that Pascal was correct and that it is foolish not to believe. Then again I believed before I became aware of Pascal's Wager and had voiced the same concept independently before I became aware of it. Heck back then I thought that my position was orginal.
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        • Posted by lrshultis 3 months ago
          The problem with the wager is that it does not deal with ones life. To believe that the threats of some men who wrote the Bible without any proof that one does not just die, period, is the waste of a life lived. I realize that Christians believe that God, with power to create existence, had spoken to some possibly disturbed men and unable to come out of hiding to speak to those sinners who will not just believe. I am 79 and have never found any evidence of a god and thus am not a theist. No one has ever been able to do more than wave their hand around and pointing out what exists and saying that proves God.
          Just what is being wagered. It appears to be some ghost in the machine, a soul, which is eternal and was implanted by a god in a human body at conception.
          Your number 1 assumes that God is good despite the lack of goodness other than that created by human activity. It also does not indicate what infinite win means.
          Your number 2 assumes that God is a child wishing to be loved and coddled and wishing to torture the one who will not believe without reason for eternity with no more reason than my sister who wanted to hear heavenly music for eternity. Eternity never ends.
          Your number 3 disregards having lived a falsehood for a lifetime.
          Your number 4 disregards the fact that an honest live might be lived, which would be the greatest reward.
          The wager is a sham to get a childish mind to become a theist.
          In fact the wager in no way supports religion other than the religious belief that the wager proves something. You need some evidence and then have a rational belief by reason. Just saying so will not do.
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          • Posted by Eyecu2 3 months ago
            Recently there was a meme here about how people from opposite sides of a position that are convinced that they are correct shouldn't discuss their positions with those on the other side. As they will only disagree and never change the mind of the person on the opposite side.

            I think that you can agree that neither of us will influence the other. Therefore I will stop here and wish you the best.
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          • Posted by $ 2 months, 4 weeks ago
            I like this rebuttal. Pascal's Wager also seems to disregard how many different faiths there are. Should I be muslim, christian, jewish, hindu, etc. all at once... just in case one of them is right? It's literally impossible.
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          • Posted by Lucky 3 months ago
            Correct. Pascal's Wager is fallacious.

            It is the same as what Climate Alarmists call the Precautionary Principle. By this if an event is not impossible, and if it occurs would be a calamity, then any cost is justified to stop it happening.

            The alarmists tell us what to do, of course the cost is enormous, and there are the usual rake-offs. The climate alarmists solutions do not guarantee that their threats of extinction/ catastrophe will not occur (in fact their solutions only waste money). Nor will expressed belief in gods guarantee eternal life.

            Anyway, what is this belief thing we are supposed to have or not? You may say you have a belief is order to gain some advantage but you are just claiming, call it lying, perhaps rationalizing, (lying to yourself), it does not specify what is in your thoughts.
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  • Posted by $ exceller 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    Nothing is black and white in nature and human life.

    The Universe and humans are shades of gray. It is not a binary status.

    It is the proportion of black and white in every situation that defines the outcome and makes for villains or angels.
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  • Posted by $ Commander 3 months, 2 weeks ago
    There are conditions of life that are metaphorically "black" and "white". Comfort and discomfort are absolutes of a living organism. To live or die are absolutes. Ice cream or banana to meet this end is gray-dient.

    The Objectivist's Ethics is a simplicity beyond the complexities of other Rand authorships. What am I?, and What is this experience? are metaphysical realities of which we cannot avoid consequence of relationships or choices. If these types of self-evident simplicities are not used as fundamentals before delving into the practicum of objective behavior a lot of confusion ensues. Example: The US constitution has no preamble (such as The Declaration Of Independence; Rights of Life, Liberty, Pursuit of Happiness) to set the tone of "Why" the ensuing articles are to be constructs of guidance. And thus, this attempt at a Representative Republic has been relegated to a structure of a Corporation. The "Rights" stated were assumed, and never printed into the Constitution. Ergo....Objectively, The Constitution is invalid to govern the behavior of a living being
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    • Posted by lrshultis 3 months ago
      "We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence (sic), promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of ..."

      I am not sure what you need for a preamble for a constitution establishing a republic?
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      • Posted by $ Commander 2 months, 3 weeks ago
        Considering qhrjk and I have had private interaction regarding the above, you've not had privilege. All the terms in the preamble you've quoted are ambiguous assumptions. The assumption that all humans have had objective training, in reason, that these expressions are understood from a valid metaphysical, value based, perspective. I'll refer you to The Objectivist's Ethics again.
        We have the Right to our lives. We have the Right to our Freedom. We have the Right to pursue Happiness. When we elect, from our Freedom, to interact with mutual Rights amongst each other as humans, we agree to earned Liberties as promotions and restraints upon our behaviors. I am free to pursue equitable or inequitable participation throughout my life. At the simplest I am free to seek "comfort" and avoid "discomfort". This is something all living things experience. As complexity of an organism increases sensations are perceived through an emotional "state". Humans, being of the higher complexity on the planet, need reason to sort perceptions and emotions.
        And our Mortality is the key to a value structure for governance of our lives. I've been wrestling with these concepts for over forty years. "Why are Humans the only life form that do not conform to the Natural Order of all other life on the planet?" A good question?
        To jump ahead to The US Constitution. Despite the intentions, as ambiguous as they are, there was never an objective statement of Unalienable Rights as an interpretive overtone. The District of Columbia formed...a corporate entity. When we were enrolled into this corporation through the Social Security Administration we agree to abide by the regulations and laws of the corporation. If "The Corporation" "decides", through the mechanism of Democracy and "It's" "Representatives" to avoid or undermine equitable relations, we, as corporate Citizens, are obligated to comply. And this raises fundamental conflicts between mob rule, whim, and objective pursuit of equitable lives.

        This is not an all-inclusive iteration of what I'm working on. Boilerplate at best. The target for release of authorship is 2021. The title: Reaching UP (Unlimited Potential) An expression of what we are as humans and a value statement that is necessary to identify and resolve conflicts....from the street.
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