jlc

I have not gotten around to doing that yet. Thanks for the reminder. Please nudge me again...a lot of stuff is happening right now and I might need another ping.

Jan

What a bizarre article. I agree with CircuitGuy - if a child wants to have an identity outside of some arbitrary pigeonhole...that is just fine.

I should not have to argue on this list that it is OK to sidestep societies dictates and create your own definitions.

Jan

I read Deadly Cold and enjoyed it.

Jan

The expanded view of the map is almost useless, but the normalized version is interesting. I would like to have looked at that map more closely, but it kept gif-pulsing at me like a time lapse of a hemorrhoid.

Jan

Yes. The Replicator was not thought out in all of its permutations. There was an episode where Worf's son steals some small item and gets in trouble...How can you steal something when there is replicator technology? "Sure, you can have one, kid! Here: Everybody have one; have ten!"

The Replicator is excellent, however as a symbol of post affluent technology. It is a nice icon to push to let one pose questions having to do with a world where everyone is affluent and no one has to work.

Jan

I had not read that before, woodlema. Thank you.

This underscores the theme of needing precise definitions before we can craft governing documents or even have a worthwhile discussion.

Jan

The only WWII Germans I have personally spoken with did not need to be converted - the Nazi's represented their beliefs. Without the Nazi's, they would have not carried out ill deeds against Jews and other segments of society, but they thought that the Nazi's were factually correct.

Jan

The article is frightening and true, and you have raised the stakes to a new height.

Jan

"...the Orwelllian twists on American principles have my head spinning."

It is as if I am reading a new version of the book 1984. Don't they see this?

Jan

Interesting Mike Marotta. I recall that it was said of Julius Caesar that he was, "Every woman's husband; every man's wife."

A real "pater patriae", eh?

Jan

One of the origins of this thread was that, while reading nsnelson's thread, I recalled hearing/reading that there was a 'tacit understanding' that "man/men" in the Declaration and Constitution meant 'white males'. I had a hard time finding any real solid data to back up this recollection (LOTS of opinions!). As you point out, the sources I did find were specifically relating to voting...but it is of note that the functional effect of the documents was in line with that more narrow definition.

Jan

I think JoleneMartens is correct. It is crucial to not break the image. The pattern that I see is an increasing doublethink that changes, for example, 'rights' to mean 'endowments'. If the facade were to be destroyed, there would be too great a chance of a major outcry and a possible reaction that would undo all of the gains that socialism has made.

The only way that the image of the US could be maintained to its own citizens, and the POTUS remain longer in place than his proper term, would be if a series of 9/11 type incidents happened right at election time. Even then, I think it would just reset the elections a few months into the future - which makes that scenario one that would not be worth artificially generating.

Jan

1+ for a funny, funny dino.

Jan

That is what it means now, blarman...but in the course of researching for this thread, I have found out to the contrary.

For your convenience, I will re-quote some interesting sources that I have used elsewhere on this thread:

I have found the following statement (history.org) in an analysis of voting procedures in the Colonies from ~1600 to shortly after our independence:

"Typically, white, male property owners twenty-one or older could vote. Some colonists not only accepted these restrictions but also opposed broadening the franchise. Duke University professor Alexander Keyssar wrote in The Right to Vote: The Contested History of Democracy in the United States:

"At its birth, the United States was not a democratic nation—far from it. The very word "democracy" had pejorative overtones, summoning up images of disorder, government by the unfit, even mob rule. In practice, moreover, relatively few of the nation's inhabitants were able to participate in elections: among the excluded were most African Americans, Native Americans, women, men who had not attained their majority, and white males who did not own land.""

John Adams wrote in 1776:

"Depend upon it, Sir, it is dangerous to open so fruitful a source of controversy and altercation as would be opened by attempting to alter the qualifications of voters; there will be no end to it. New claims will arise; women will demand the vote; lads from 12 to 21 will think their rights not enough attended to; and every man who has not a farthing, will demand an equal voice with any other, in all acts of state. It tends to confound and destroy all distinctions, and prostrate all ranks to one common level."

Jan

Yes. While I am willing to study Mechanical Engineering on mine own...I have serious doubts about my making much headway in that discipline without explicit instruction.

So easily, this hope is fulfilled!

Jan

I live in Los Angeles, so I find it handy to speak some Spanish. I would enjoy living in a Spanish speaking country for some months...I think that I could become fluent; Spanish is a beautiful language. I lived in Spain for 3 years as a child and I feel comfortable with many aspects of the Latino culture.

I do doubt that Peru would be better than the US for a Gulch, though...say, Texas.

Jan, not comfy with 'machismo' however

"...latent paranoia..."

Love it. Have it.

Ha!

Jan

I have had some particular threads deleted of my comments - this was accidental and was rectified by the IT management of the site after I reported it.

Jan

Explain, please.

Jan

This discussion deserves a separate thread.

Jan, interested but not currently of strong opinion

If I had the chance, my big Thank You would be a punch in the snoot for the galoot. If you get a chance to blindside him, smack him one for me!

Jan

Double ouch. Hurts even to think about it.

Jan

Interesting. It would be a good question to ask: What line or phrase of the Declaration is the personal favorite. I know that several of the lines can give me the chills when I read them.

Jan

I do not think so. I think that the word meant mankind as differentiated from nobility or kings. Certainly, women and blacks were not considered sufficiently part of mankind to be eligible to vote.

Jan

Not something that is currently believed...

Jan, agrees with you