Been there and they always do that.

I agree that debt should be avoided like the plague.

That is to say, Fountainhead is only relevant if you are willing to acknowledge that all it takes to become an employee is a willingness to endure mediocrity, while it takes various degrees of exceptiinalism to put your capital and reputation at risk to attempt to start a business, not to mention enduring and overcoming all the challenges that come with trying to break with the herd. In that cases I would say that Fountain reinforces what I said but from a different angle.

The clip is just a recommendation to see a film. Fountainhead is not about producers vs takers. That is Atlas Shrugged. Fountainhead is about the war between mediocrity and exceptiinalism. So not really relevant here.

Thanks for sending the clip, but I don't see how it relates to your claim Ayn Rand sees only business owners as producers.
BTW, I did not downvote your comment.

I guess I should have been more specific. Credit Cards, Mortgages, Student Loans. These ultimately retard economic growth and can cause occasional crashes. These are what I meant by debt spending, not the ND. Oddly enough, Bonds can produce long term growth even though they are a form of debt spending.

Yeah, increased jobs increases spending. Whoever is collecting interest on a debt such as a mortgage is making money also.
I'm not talking about the idiotic national debt. That will never be paid off.

spending stimulates an economy, somewhat, unless it is debt spending, but it takes profit reinvestment in new and expanded business to truly stimulate an economy through increased jobs which produces increased spending at a higher order of magnitude.

Spending stimulates the economy.

lol, I guess the appropriate response is Who is John Galt? I don't believe that I have it backwards at all. The protagonist/producers of Atlas Shrugged are predominantly business owners. John Galt is a creative/inventive mind-producer as is the protagonist in Fountainhead. An uncompromising, nonconformist architect/builder. You gotta see the Gary Cooper film. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swOxK...

" It only sees business owners as producers. I think that is also how Ayn Rand sees it"
You have it backwards. In Fountainhead the heroic producer was out of a job or working a menial job to make ends meet most of the book. The wealthy business owners were total sellouts, troubled that they weren't producers.

"spending it does not enrich the community. reinvesting it in new or expanded business"
Yes. This is how I understand it too. Spending is needed when there's unused productive capacity. Wealth comes from investing in new factors of production.

Socialism is like never leaving the family nest. Not trusting themselves to be able to survive on their own, either in opinions nor actual deeds. Thus, the group think of socialism, never having to be concerned to think outside the accepeted group speak. How many times has anyone had a real discussion with a leftie that actually produced anything except more blathering of the leftist ideology?

spending it does not enrich the community. reinvesting it in new or expanded business is what creates jobs = enriching a community

If only the tax code agreed with us on that. It only sees business owners as producers. I think that is also how Ayn Rand sees it, if her protagonists are any indication.

" you are an employee, you are NOT a producer"
Employees are the producers, the doers.

I agree with the rest of your post, but fundamentally I think employees who are doing the work as produces.

"The capitalists must reinvest their profits in the community. "
Do you agree they must either spend it or invest it? Even if they attempt to "save" it, the banks lend out that money or if they buy precious metals they drive the price up. I don't understand how what we choose to do can be right or wrong.

lol. thank you

Sorry but I am done with you.

"The best way to have access to high quality Healthcare or increase the standard of living is for a govt. to allow laissez fare capitalism to enrich the community. Period"

There is ONLY one way that laissez faire capitalism can enrich a community or nation: The capitalists must reinvest their profits in the community. J Paul Getty understood this when he wrote "How to Be Rich". Not How to get rich, How to BE Rich. But laissez faire means that there is no external compulsion. The capitalists must do so of their own volition. And they used to do so. Many do not do so and there are vast pools of capital that have been siphoned out of the economy thanks to you and me and all of the other consumers doing exactly as we are programmed to do, but these vast pools of capital are NOT being reinvested or taxed. They don't enrich the community. These capitalists have been impoverishing the nation and the communities within the nation because they have been "laissed" to do whatever they wish thanks to trickle down Reaganomics, which has been reinforced since it was instituted and which absolutely FAILS to cause a trickle down, but instead causes a fountain of capital up to the wealthiest corp owners/major stockholders that never re-enters the US economy. THAT is the cause of any stagnation in the nation's economic growth far more than any so called government intervention.

"The best way to have access to high quality Healthcare or increase the standard of living is for a govt. to allow laissez fare capitalism to enrich the community. Period"

There is ONLY one way that laissez faire capitalism can enrich a community or nation: The capitalists must reinvest their profits in the community. J Paul Getty understood this when he wrote "How to Be Rich". Not How to get rich, How to BE Rich. But laissez faire means that there is no external compulsion. The capitalists must do so of their own volition. And they used to do so. Many do not do so and there are vast pools of capital that have been siphoned out of the economy thanks to you and me and all of the other consumers doing exactly as we are programmed to do, but these vast pools of capital are NOT being reinvested or taxed. They don't enrich the community. These capitalists have been impoverishing the nation and the communities within the nation because they have been "laissed" to do whatever they wish thanks to trickle down Reaganomics, which has been reinforced since it was instituted and which absolutely FAILS to cause a trickle down, but instead causes a fountain of capital up to the wealthiest corp owners/major stockholders that never re-enters the US economy. THAT is the cause of any stagnation in the nation's economic growth far more than any so called government intervention.

Not to mention sliding down the slippery slope into the bland crappy socialist world Ayn Rand wrote of in Atlas Shrugged.

Thank you for your reply:)

Here, here, DOB. Thanks for reminding us of what is in the Constitution and examples of what are NOT rights. Redefining rights to include whatever someone thinks is fair takes down a slippery slope to bankruptcy.

Wrong, the DOW or precisely the DOW Jones industrial average is a weighted average of 30 industrial stocks.
Economic growth is the increase in the inflation-adjusted market value of the goods and services produced by an economy over time. It is conventionally measured as the percent rate of increase in real gross domestic product, or real GDP, usually in per capita terms.
When you say corps I must assume you mean Top Management vs Rank and file. The income disparity is obscene, I would agree with that. The FED 's increase of the money supply many have argued and I agree has caused an asset bubble and part of the strong increase in the value of the DJIA.
"But the question is why does one child have more right to health and education than another?" More Right to health and Education
These are not rights. Just like anything of value it is created. By your way of thinking every child should have a swimming pool in his backyard because some other kids do.
Go to Venezuala
Chavez and Maduro promised to equalize everything to be elected and the result is people starving to death.