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How Many Bricklayers Did Galt Invite to the Gulch?

Posted by Hiraghm 10 years, 8 months ago to Culture
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Galt went around inviting famous artists, noted business leaders to the Guch, but once there, who built their houses? Who paved their streets, dug their sewer lines?

This isn't a class warfare argument; the building of a house, for example, not only takes a skilled architect, but also skilled craftsmen and industrious laborers.

If the criterion for admission is a belief in "trading value for value", surely Galt should and would have invited "ordinary" workers to the Gulch as well as luminaries like Wyatt and Danagger?

Such people exist lower down on the ladder; people who believe in trading value for value, but lack the creative ability to invent a new motor or miraculous metal. People who didn't inherit an already successful railroad or copper mines, but would be able to get a day's worth of coal or copper dug in a day's worth of hours for a day's worth of pay. Maybe they lack the ambition to go through the headache of running a company when they get more satisfaction from digging coal out of the ground. Maybe they lack the self discipline necessary to see their visions to reality, but are still able and still believe in trading value for value.

What Utopians always underestimate in their rhetoric (no disparagement of Ms Rand intended) is the example America set before them. People's abilities and worth are not necessarily evidenced by their position in life. All the creative brilliance in the world will not get a brick wall built. A brick wall built without knowledge and skill won't stand, but the most creative and brilliantly designed wall will never exist without someone to lay it up brick by brick. Someone whose creative skill may be shrouded by prejudice toward his position in life.

There may not be a place in the Gulch for someone like me. But that would be Galt's loss.


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  • Posted by kdk741 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    This is an absolute truth. When she had the burger at the diner, before knowing who was cooking it, she admired the competence of the person doing it. Competence is something she referenced in many books. We the Living, by virtue of it being very rare, Anthem in the lack of it again, and Howard Roarke spent a great deal of time as a stonecutter in a quarry in the fountainhead. Surely this was her way of focusing on the important issues and letting us work out the messy details, as were there dedicated bricklayers in The Gulch.
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  • Posted by kdk741 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    John Galt did start the movement, when he left the 21st Century Motor plant run as a communal factory. He saw the evil in that idea, not to work to better yourself and your family, but to provide for others, and their families.
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  • Posted by texastoast61 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I don't believe Galt was "torturing" Dagny. He was merely trying to open her eyes to the reality of what the "moochers" were up to. He wanted Dagny to join the strike and stop sacrificing herself to those who would do her harm. And in the end, he was correct. Galt FELT Dagnys pain. And he tried to alieve it by pointing out the futility of her struggle against a system that wanted more and more at a cost to her.
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  • Posted by texastoast61 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You touch upon something I preach religiously. That the "worker" is much more important to everyday life than any Wall Street trader. I broke it down years ago to two type of people....bean counters and worker bees. Worker bees are just that.. workers. The people who physically get s--t done. The people who make the lights come on. The people who make sure water comes from the tap when you turn it on. People who carry away the trash you generate. People who make sure there is food on the shelf at your market. You can survive without the "trader" (bean counter) but the worker bee is what makes your day to day existence possible.
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  • Posted by DAGwyn 10 years, 8 months ago
    The issue wasn't discussed in the book because it wasn't essential to the story line, which was what happens when enough great minds go on strike. If instead the bricklayers had gone on strike, the nation would have been able to cope.

    Rand appreciated skill at any level, for example the short-order cook at a roadside diner (who turned out to be Hugh Akston).
    One of the Galt's Gulch residents whom Dagny met was a truck driver -- but, he said, he didn't intend to remain one. "Position in life" is rarely predetermined.

    Contrary to your claim, a professional engineer can often build an usable house, but a construction worker rarely can adequately perform engineering functions.
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  • Posted by LaissezFaire 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Also, a character who comes to mind is Eddie Willers. He was no genius or successful businessman or creative architect, but was a loyal employee, and one who gets it. I'm sure he eventually made it to the Gulch.
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  • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Galts. I'm sure if the producers KNEW there was a gulch to go to they'd be the judge of themselves and want to go...but since they didn't even know about it...then it would have to be Galt's judgment to approach and discuss the gulch to see if they, the individual, wanted to go there with him. Who's elses judgement could it have been? Explain your question.
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  • Posted by Luxomni 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Remember, we are looking at this through 21st Century eyes. At the time this was written, people's educations still included actually doing and touching things. On a hillside near my home north of New Hope, PA, stood a pretty small tudor framed brick cottage. I remember it well. It was the student project of a Princeton architecture graduate. Universities used to teach Renaissance Men, now they are just an attempt at a short-cut to the top - a passport to the elite where they will never have to actually touch anything ever.
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  • Posted by Daddymorebucks 10 years, 8 months ago
    In the gulch they only had the labor they needed, not the excess required by a union contract. They pay fair wages set by market forces not central planner government mandated minimum wages. They pay labor as the market dictates and their businesses are rewarded as the market dictates. No government bailout for BIG LABOR as was the case with GM and Chrysler. I live in Michigan and I cannot believe how many people think the government bailed out the company and its stockholders. When in reality the old GM stock is worth zero and the UAW was given stock in the new GM.
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  • Posted by $ stargeezer 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    So is your concern the need of laborers or the supposed need of non-objectivist laborers? Are you seeking access to the valley by people who's values are not theirs?

    Are you seeking a pass into heaven for those who earn hell?
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  • Posted by freedombreeze1 10 years, 8 months ago
    What makes you think laborers were not invited to the Gulch? Of course the Gulch would need bricklayers, carpenters, plumbers, waiters, maids, etc. They would be valued according to their merit. Being free to create, unfettered, a bricklayer may even invent tools to perform his tasks more efficiently. I imagine in a free market, the best ones would be highly valued and paid accordingly. In fact, a bricklayer's career may include all kinds of other tasks but that would embelish his credibility and make him more marketable. It's organized labor in bed with government that has limited the bricklayer's own success and kept him "lower down on the ladder" in his career. "
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  • Posted by $ stargeezer 10 years, 8 months ago
    "Quote; There may not be a place in the Gulch for someone like me. But that would be Galt's loss. "

    That last lines expresses why you fail to understand us. Your point of view is that Galt would owe his existence and the existence of the valley to your always capable hands - what you miss is that nobody has a right to place that burden on any other person.

    For example, BO is certain that nobody will have healthcare without his intervention - the truth is that the vast majority of people were doing just fine before BO and Nancy P screwed things up beyond all possible workability.

    The collectivist in chief keeps trying to fundamentally transform our once great nation into a socialist wet dream, but with each step he takes, more and more discover just what Rand was writing about - and know that the final crash is one day closer.
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  • Posted by Wonky 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I need to actually read the commentary here to make any meaningful comment on an appropriate emoticon. I'm quite sure Hiragm has been sufficiently blasted for the associating Objectivists with Utopians. Is it worth the read, or would it be better to call it a night?
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  • Posted by $ winterwind 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Wonky - ooooh, "point whore" - nice!
    My take on the thread is that iit's a whole bunch of different people coming into it, not believing the awful reality of it, and trying to explain, thinking that the OP had asked, and continues to ask, real questions about which he/she desires real, true answers. Give it the respect it deserves. [is there an emoticon for tonque-in-cheek?]
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  • Posted by Wonky 10 years, 8 months ago
    Holy crap! Is this all it takes to be a point whore?

    How about "I'm just a child and haven't developed any skills yet. Would I be invited to Atlantis?"

    I cannot believe this post got anywhere. Do babies get to go to heaven if they haven't accepted Jesus as their personal savior?



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  • Posted by ohiocrossroads 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I give up. You really don't understand the central premise of the book. The world collapses in the end because Galt and his fellow strikers refused to stop the destruction wreaked by the statists' policies. To try to stop the destruction further would have meant destruction for Galt and the strikers, with destruction following soon after for those who formulated those policies. To refuse to be a victim of injustice any longer is not the same as being a destroyer. It's about withdrawing the sanction of the victim.
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  • Posted by ohiocrossroads 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    That kind of thing is in her books.
    How many times did Howard Roark fail to win commissions in The Fountainhead? He failed in his business, had to close his office and take a job drilling in a quarry.

    In Atlas Shrugged, Rand describes Rearden's struggle to invent his metal as taking 10 years with countless failures along the way, and his own staff holding unsaid the statement "it can't be done".
    But her artistic credo was not to glorify failure by describing it in detail, and passing it off as the normal state of mankind. Who wants to read a story about someone who gave up trying to invent a superior metal alloy? If nothing has been accomplished, why write about it?
    I understand what you're saying about showing her protagonists fail a lot more, but that kind of thing is in her work, too. It is in the background, so maybe we're just arguing about style instead of attitude.
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  • Posted by $ stargeezer 10 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Actually, I think he's trying to justify the perpetuation of a failed labor system that wants to equate a laborer who wants to accomplish nothing more to the man who designing and bringing to reality a city. It doesn't take a village to build a village, it takes a man with a vision and the drive to make it happen.

    I do agree that among the world outside of objectionist reasoning, building the village without the help of scabs would be impossible. The rules, zoning, inspections, permits and all the rest of collectivist society are setup to make it impossible to do anything without those that bind the hands of those who seek to achieve, excel and prosper.

    WE can build it with tested, proven objectivists, just as I did my home. And we'll offer no comfort to those who remain outside.
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