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Families outraged after Illinois fails to pay out $288 million in lottery winnings

Posted by $ nickursis 8 years, 6 months ago to Government
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Now, this is an example of how a government can rewrite the law, do what it wants and openly commit fraud. They still sell tickets and then have no intention of paying.
SOURCE URL: http://news.yahoo.com/families-outraged-illinois-fails-pay-210047539.html


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    Posted by khalling 8 years, 6 months ago
    Illinois is by far the most corrupt state I ever lived in. When Rostenkowski was indicted for mail fraud as a US Representative-you could not find one local news station in Chicago to report on it. The voter fraud was unbearable, but I think it might be worse in St. Louis, where we also lived.
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    • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
      There was the case of the guy in 2014 taking the cell phone video of the voting machine filling in the democrat vote when he pressed the repub button, and did it like 6 or 7 times. Never saw a thing about it afterwards and I have not heard of any federal voter law investigation. Maybe they were not the right race or something...
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    • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 6 months ago
      Simple answer. Buy in non income tax states just in case you do win. Gives you an average 10% increase in prize value.
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      • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
        Not always easy to do, but Oregon has you covered, buy a ticket in Washington, then you get to pay state sales tax, as well as Oregon Income tax, as any income you make, unless military out of state (deployed) is theirs to take, like any good Socialist republic.
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        • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 6 months ago
          You notice I don't live in the Peoples Democratic Republic of Takilma anymore. But Arizona charges and 8% sales tax on winnings while Texas and Florida charge zero. Birth, Life, Taxes, Death only one of them must be endured more than once.
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        • Posted by Technocracy 8 years, 6 months ago
          Move to the other state before you collect. Then tell Oregon to pound sand. Move back after if you like.
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          • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 6 months ago
            Can't do that. Each State in PowerBall for example has it's own in state operator and must be turned in to the state which sold the ticket.

            The only one around that is buy only from non income tax states. Nine of them I seem to remember. Second make sure they have no other special deals which probably leaves Washington State out. third is the public disclosure the winners identify question. Some blast it all over the news, some give you a 30 or 60 or 90 at best head start if memory serves. A few don't say zip to anyone except the State and Federal IRS.

            I'm not sure if social security gets a cut or not....
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          • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
            Options, options. I guess that is why you almost invariably see a delay in winners, as they need to go see lawyers before claiming. Even that probably is just a useless effort. However, I would think Illinois is missing the tax boat by not paying the claims...
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  • Posted by robgambrill 8 years, 6 months ago
    In Missouri, all the funds from the Stupidity Tax go towards education (well supposedly). The game is rigged for the majority of players to lose, and the government gets a slush fund.

    Lots of Laptops, Smartboards, and other high tech junk, but for some reason, test scores continue to drop?
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  • Posted by $ CBJ 8 years, 6 months ago
    How many of these Illinois lottery winners voted for Obama, who carried the state in 2012 by 57% to 40%? Poetic justice for those people - they got what they believe in and voted for, their income has been "redistributed" and their wealth has been "shared".
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  • Posted by $ WilliamShipley 8 years, 6 months ago
    There seems to be a lot of hostility toward the concept of the government running a lottery. Didn't Ayn Rand suggest funding government through a lottery as a form of voluntary taxation?

    Of course the government has to pay when you win.
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    • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
      William, I have no issue withthat, but the obligation is to pay for it, that is what some of the money is there for. The AR concept is good because it lets you decide what gov't is worth to you, it's "value". Although it has a snowballs chance in hell, since they know deep down we have essentially 0 value on it.
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      • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 6 months ago
        The government doesn't pay in most lotteries it's a private corporation that runs it for percentage of the take. When government gets involved as apparently happened in Illinois the greed and criminal activities begin. Illinois? Where else?

        Here's how it works for real. Prize for that week is announced minus the cut of the corporation and minus the cut of the sponsoring government.
        The remainder is held pending decision of the winner(s) then taxes are subtracted and unless people are stupid stupid stupid paid immediately AND anothere amount set aside for tax increases which no one knows until the year of the win is now the former year.

        Typically one half after the first skim goes to the government immediately which then taxes the paid out half as well. Win is 200 million option is 100 million now US and Arizona for example take 46% combined. Winner gets 54 million. On a 100 million win half that etc etc etc.

        The next step is the locust feast and the relatives feast and the friends feast....But if yiou can side step all of that the real problem is not where to invest it's to protect. What for treat that amount of the ready as risk capital? Especially when it means a. all those tax headaches and b. all those commissions on all those good deals - that aren't.

        What's needed is a good system for protection which to me means get it outside the clutches of the Obamacula's as fast as possible. At some point they are going to a. raise taxes and b. ban taking money outside the country. Nothing new about that.

        I cannot begin to understand people who are set for life who then worry about investments. Even inflation is unlikely to reduce it down to their current level of living. As for 'giving back?' What an idiotic statement. What the hell do they call the 3/4 o f the total that already went back?

        As for over 20 years or 30 years THAT takes someone with brass balls and a PhD in Risk Management.
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        • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
          Indeed. I would also want it all up front, and let a tax lawyer finally get a chance to game the system for me. They should have to have the cash set aside, and in Illinois (see below) they are required to pay winnings first by law, so oopss...Even when they tell you it is all covered, it isn't.
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          • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 6 months ago
            Put it in zero interest bearing account. No interest no taxes after the first bite. withdraw the rest as needed for your probable lifespan plus five or ten whatever. Three places to find such a deposit. Your bank, T bills with automatic roll over and a big mother safety deposit box in the same bank. have the bank people count the amount and hand deliver it the safety deposit box and arrange...for a fee...to have them sign off when you make a withdrawal and deposit it to your debit card account. If you touch it the Gestapo will show up citing that $10,000 rule and steal everything. Never put more than $250,000 at a time in that zero interest debit card account and then tell 'em to bark at the moon. They might even have a way of doing that in simpler manner that follows those rules. Remember you have no need to invest anymore. Risk Management 101 Eliminate the Risk Lesson two identify the risk. Friends, Family, Government.....Lawyers. Then by a ticket to Ulan Bator and go on a long safari seeking the burial site of the Ka Khan. Long way of saying disappearing is largely a matter of being out of touch.
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            • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
              Yep, any way around the looters is more of a constitutional requirement than anything else...
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              • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 6 months ago
                Reminds me of the Sec Treas Ruben ripping off the Social Security and Railroad Retirees Trust money to bailout Tesorobonos of which his own company in which he held stock and a partnership position got their 40% of the total bailed for them. I'm wondering who obviously someone in Illinois was in on this little raiding party.
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  • Posted by Technocracy 8 years, 6 months ago
    I am honestly surprised that some enterprising lawyer hasn't tried to make a class action suit out of this.

    Of course it is Illinois, which contains Chicago, so perhaps they are justifiably afraid of consequences.
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    • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
      Nope, there are several lawsuits, but having had the joy of doing one, a) The judges will rule whatever the political machine wants (I had 8 witnesses and 58 pieces of evidence against my neighbor with 300 alpacas on 3 acres and never picking p any manure, and she rule it wasn't a nuisance yet gave us 148K in damages, because they were afraid if they said it was one, there would be 500 more lawsuits for the same thing in the county, since they do not ever address them) or b) They will be delayed to the point the state gets its act together, or rule that the winners will get 10% of their winnings since it is "for the good of the state" or some such crap. Then the lawyers are going to take whats left, anyways. These folks are well and truly screwed.
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      • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 6 months ago
        I just thought of this. The state gives them a credit on state income tax equal to the amount of the prize. however they have to count the value of that credit as income which uses up a bit more and so on. The State ends up not getting the income tax from a few winners for a cancelled debt. The feds get a bit more. meanwhile the State gets to keep all the money for that weeks lottery sales....for the good of the State like you said. But it's an easy way out and what's called an elegant solution which means solving more than one problem with one action. However they make it not subject to inheritance provisions....Elegant in that the state keeps all the money the winner gets to pay more taxes to the feds and otherwise gets screwed. State then runs for office on a balanced budget if they can find enough yoyo's to purchase more tax exemption prizes. Lotteries across the nation convert.....

        Or the non income tax states could start selling tickets through the internet with a guarantee of no disclosure of the winners names and payable minus taxes to any place in the world.
        Now that would be worth the gamble.
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        • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
          Michael, remember, we are talking about the government here! A group of people whos only task is to ensure the contribute to the party in power, hang on for 20 so they can retire at 100% pay, and ensure every living member of their family has a job. All that would interfere in the execution of you plan above, as it would actually mean someone would have to do some work. They would reject it as " a right wing plot to remove the state from it's hard earned income" or some crap. But nice idea...
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          • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 6 months ago
            I'm really in favor one state a really really greedy state in the middle of a bunch of income tax states doing the lottery the way it should be done with non-disclosure, a running start and the whole bit and zero taxes. That would leave just the federal bite. The amount of loss would be paltry compared to increase in sales especially from across the border. The first step would be a state address and state ID. The income tax states surrounding lost their control. The winners become out of state property owners at worst but any real estate agent can fix that. What sits between Illinois Wisconsin, Michigan, and Ohio? with more to the south?

            Right uh huh Greed will win out every time if it's presented that way. The greedy but stupid can go pound sand.

            Never happen. Indiana can't see past the end of it's nose either.
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  • Posted by LibertyBelle 8 years, 6 months ago
    Re: a Lottery. I should think that of course they
    would have to pay: first, the costs of operation
    (printing the tickets, etc.); after that, a certain per-
    centage to the winner of what is left; after that, have whatever is left go to the state government. But of course, they could not know
    in advance what the total would be, because of
    not knowing how many tickets would be sold.
    I voted for the lottery to be brought in in Virginia.
    I thought it would be one way of demonstrating
    that there is a possibility of having voluntary fi-
    nancing of the proper functions of government in
    a free society. And I spent a dollar for a ticket
    once in a while, I think about once a week, and
    maybe an extra one on a special occasion, such as my birthday. But after they said they
    were going to give all the leftover money to the
    public schools, I quit buying lottery tickets, be-
    cause of what I think of the public schools and
    public education.
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    • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
      Well and good. In Oregon, at least it seems there are some checks and balances. I am ok with the idea of voluntary support, but I need to see a cut in offsetting mandatory requirements. In Oregon, it has all been trumpeted as "education etc" but they still bleat they never have enough. We are in real trouble when Commie Bernie gets his free college, and dumps the cost on the states as "you own it",need really big lottery then....
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  • Posted by LibertyBelle 8 years, 6 months ago
    What a state lottery should do is pay out a per-
    centage
    of the take-in. It should state ahead of
    time what percentage it will be. Of course, this will
    not guarantee any specific amount, depending on
    how many tickets are bought. And it would still
    be necessary to have it be monitored, to make
    sure there was no misrepresentation of the am-
    ount of the prize.
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    • Posted by $ 8 years, 6 months ago
      From the oregon Lottery:
      "The law requires that at least 50 percent of the Lottery's total annual sales is paid to players as prizes. The Lottery currently pays out traditional game (Oregon’s Game Megabucks, Powerball, Mega Millions, Scratch-its, Keno, Win for Life, Lucky Lines, and Pick 4,) prizes at a combined rate of 64 percent, which means that overall 64 cents of every dollar played goes back to players in prizes. Video Lottery game prizes pay out at a combined rate of 93 percent."
      So, I would have to assume Illinois was also to have some percentage of their money set aside for prizes.

      Here is what Illinois says:
      http://www.illinoislottery.com/en-us/...
      They claim 61% paid back. So it should be a set aside, and not subject to anything with the state.
      Here is their law:

      (10) The apportionment of the total revenues accruing from the sale of lottery tickets or shares and from all other sources among (i) the payment of prizes to the holders of winning tickets or shares, (ii) the payment of costs incurred in the operation and administration of the lottery, including the expenses of the Department and the costs resulting from any contract or contracts entered into for promotional, advertising or operational services or for the purchase or lease of lottery equipment and materials, and (iii) for monthly transfers to the Common School Fund. The net revenues accruing from the sale of lottery tickets shall be determined by deducting from total revenues the payments required by paragraphs (i) and (ii) of this subsection."

      Basically, they are required to set aside enough to pay the winnings, so the State should have no claim on it, and what the state is doing is, or would seem to be, a violation of Illinois State Law. But when has law stopped any state from doing what it wants> This is a good example of just how bad things have gotten.
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  • Posted by GaryL 8 years, 6 months ago
    Any financial planner, tax attorney or accountant will advise jack pot winners to take the lump sum pay out every time! If a state defaults on it's obligations the payments for lottery winners will be the first to stop!
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