Neither a Borrower Nor a Lender Be, by Robert Gore

Posted by straightlinelogic 8 years, 8 months ago to Economics
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During the last financial crisis and recession, many municipal and corporate bonds were subject to precipitous drops. Even as the crisis unfolded, most investors found it inconceivable that stalwart industrial and financial companies would go bankrupt or require government rescues, but they did. This time the window for selling corporate and municipal bonds is still open, but once the herd realizes that financial turmoil and economic contraction will impair the ability to pay across broad swaths of the bond market, it will snap shut.

This is an excerpt. For the rest of the article please click the link above.
SOURCE URL: http://straightlinelogic.com/2015/08/26/neither-a-borrower-nor-a-lender-be-by-robert-gore/


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  • Posted by richrobinson 8 years, 8 months ago
    I'm really concerned about my home state of Pennsylvania. During the last election cycle for Governor one of the issues was State pensions. Democrat Tom Wolf won and has no plans to change the current system. Sixty six cents of every dollar services the pension system. This is a disaster waiting to happen.
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    • Posted by Technocracy 8 years, 8 months ago
      ALL government pensions are a disaster in process.

      It never occurs to the politicos that you can only control one factor in the process...the contribution. You can have a working process with defined contribution. you cannot have a working process with defined benefit. Or at least not without the benefits being equal to or less than the contributions.
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      • Posted by $ Susanne 8 years, 8 months ago
        The problem with Government Pensions (I'll use CalPers for an example) is it is intended to be self-sufficient, but a looter in office (Pete Wilson, for example) will see it as his personal money pit, bankrupting the system. Part of the draw to public service is knowing that by taking a potentially lousy job with sorely deficient pay, when you pull the plug you will get compensated for basically giving your life for public service.

        I laugh that people think the people working in civil service are fatcat rich, when I could be making easily 10x the money if I did this in private industry. True, there are moochers who milk the system, but for me, it's an opportunity to do something I found I really love, it keeps a nice roof over my head, allows me to have some really fun hobbies, and develop myself so when I do pull the plug, I'll be able to start my own business (and have enough years left to exploit that business to its fullest potential).
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        • Posted by $ jdg 8 years, 8 months ago
          I don't believe the pension system was ever intended to be self-sufficient. California's constitution was changed five years ago to allow a simple majority to enact a budget so that they wouldn't ever have to start the year without one again, and that worked. And the Democrats have a majority they will never lose due to gerrymandering.

          But they continue to "budget by emergency" because it gives them an excuse to propose tax increases every year. I am not willing to believe this is an accident. And one of the most reliable sources of these "emergencies" is that every budget underfunds CalPERS, CalSTRS, and the other pension funds, while simultaneously making (literally) unbelievably optimistic assumptions about how those funds will grow in the years ahead.

          The can will continue to be kicked down the road until California's taxpayers become unwilling or unable to meet each year's pension "obligations" as the payments come due. At which point, I hope, even this Leftist behemoth of a state will finally shrug.
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          • Posted by $ Susanne 8 years, 8 months ago
            Well put and well done.

            The whole impetus of the majority budget was so the politicians in Sacramento would quit playing politics with the budget. It was frustrating back then to see a workable budget get thwarted because some group of assemblyperson's pet porkpie didn't get enough funding. This way, for better or worse, it gets the job done.
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        • Posted by Maritimus 8 years, 8 months ago
          " ... giving your life for public service."
          How is it "giving your life" any more than working for any other business or organization? Working for government means working for the most inefficient organization, in most cases producing more harm than good.
          Your outline of your plans demonstrates, I think, that you are far from "giving your life" to them. From my prospective, you are being overpaid by a mismanaged outfit that has found a way to abuse the taxpayers.
          Why is it not that an entrepreneur who starts a business and employs, say, 50 people, is providing a "public service" (to his customers and his employees and their families) just as much or better than a government employee?
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          • Posted by $ Susanne 8 years, 8 months ago
            Let's see. --thinking-- Yeah, responding to fires or active shooter situations, or repairing the roads and picking up dead animals, or making sure you have water when you turn on the tap or keep your home from filling up with feces and urine because you don't have sewers...

            Sounds like those "overpaid" people don't do a damned thing. Not a one are worth a crap, or deserve even a sub-minimum wage job.

            Then... I realize... -gasp-... you want to make this rather personal... eg:

            "From my prospective, you are being overpaid by a mismanaged outfit that has found a way to abuse the taxpayers."

            as a supposed "overpaid public servant"... I have 2 questions that I will require an answer from you.

            (1) What do I do for a living, specifically, and what are the qualifications for someone that does my job, either for the dotgov or in private industry?

            (2) What do I get paid for the above, VS what does someone on the outside get paid for this job?

            Here's your glove back. Good luck.
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            • Posted by Maritimus 8 years, 8 months ago
              Hello S,
              My comments were not intended personally.

              I do not know the answers to your questions and really do not care.

              I believe that fire fighting (it's done by volunteers), much policing (there are private security and guard organizations), road repair and maintenance (frequently done by contractors) could be done more effectively, efficiently and at less cost, if the competing businesses were allowed to bid. I have my own well and septic system, so I am out of reach there.

              My objections are primarily to two concepts that I find untrue. First, that working for government is "giving life for public service". It is misleading and aims at the emotional side of human nature. Once one starts to think, one sees through it.
              The second is the claim that government employees are underpaid. There is abundant information about substantially higher compensation of government employees over those in private sector, in equivalent jobs. Of course, all those pensions (unfunded!) are significant factor in that. In addition, unions pay for politicians' election campaigns and then collect in the negotiations with the same politicians who will
              want another bribe when the next election cycle comes around.
              Examples: Detroit, Chicago, Illinois, New York City and State etc. etc.
              I have nothing personal against you. How could I? I do not know you.
              Finally:
              1. You did not answer my first question.
              2. I di not say that government employee do not "do a damned thing".
              I detect that you feel offended. I say: A is A.
              -1: "sweet revenge" ;-)
              EDIT: correct a typo
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        • Posted by term2 8 years, 8 months ago
          Government pensions are sick. WAY too generous and they deceive the voters in that the retirement and benefits occur later and are generally unfunded (or the funds are ripped off to service other government services). When the time comes for the system to crash, I wonder if you will really get the pension you think you have in terms of purchasing power. Inflation caused by the spending will rob you of that.
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          • Posted by $ Susanne 8 years, 8 months ago
            I look at as seed money for my business.
            If all I had to live on was said government pension I would be very worried, but I don't. Even so, I consider it just one of my investments, and as such keep a hawk's eye on it.

            My grandfather (a commercial hunter and butcher) bought an annuity that, when he retired, would pay him the whopping sum of $200 a month. Back then, it was enough to live like a prince... by the time he was 75, it wouldn't pay his property taxes.

            Looking at it from the inside out, rather than from the outside in, and seeing the cuts we're being subjected to (this by a well funded and managed system) and looking at getting maybe 50% of our final salary as a thank-you for 30+ years of busting butt and getting wages significantly lower than our privately employed cousins, I could call it many things - but "way too generous" isn't one of them. Sorry.
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            • Posted by term2 8 years, 8 months ago
              fortunately I left California so I wont have to pay it. Unfortunately the people who are working when you retire WILL have to pay it, at least until they dont have any money left.
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  • Posted by Herb7734 8 years, 8 months ago
    Why should the richest nation in the world become a debtor? Why should it be in debt by trillions upon trillions? It's as if a family business was making tons of money, but the folks who ran the family business spent it faster than they could make it. It is totally ridiculous. The profligate spending of the elected royalty in Washington is worse than the Pharos who bankrupted Egypt building their furshlugginer pyramids. Like the pyramids, the people wind up with nothing to show for it except having the fruits of their labor prove to be worthless to them. As to being a lender -- what a joke. We dole out billions at a time of money we don't have to countries that mostly don't appreciate it and in many cases reneg on repayment. No wonder the Ancient Aliens have refused to come back. They think they created a race of silly idiots. (LOL?)
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  • Posted by term2 8 years, 8 months ago
    Efficient borrowing always assumes that what you will do with it brings in more money that it costs to rent the borrowed money. Borrowing for just buying things to enjoy them never fits into that category, so shouldnt be done. Business borrowing could possibily fit into this category, but in my experience you never really know how your business is going to work out
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    • Posted by Maritimus 8 years, 8 months ago
      From personal experience, I can tell you that you cannot start a business without borrowing some part of the initial capital, in most cases the majority of it. It shares the cost of the risk with your lenders too.
      EDIT: correct typo
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      • Posted by term2 8 years, 8 months ago
        I have started a number of businesses, and didnt borrow at all for any of them initially- or later even. It depends completely on the type of business I think. I stay away from businesses that have a lot of initial investment- perhaps because I dont trust the way the country is run today.
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        • Posted by Maritimus 8 years, 8 months ago
          The plan for starting a business with no need for initial capital limits greatly the kind of business it can be. No equipment? No space to inhabit? No payroll until the revenue grows enough to cover it? Very constraining it seem to me.
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          • Posted by term2 8 years, 8 months ago
            I didn't mean no capital at all, but no need for more than a few thousand dollars. I have never liked the idea of starting something in these socialistic times in debt to the tune of hundreds of thousands of dollars. It is limiting to do what I have done, but it's the response to local government crazy restrictions on granting of business licenses and changing tax codes and restrictions. Just slows down business growth.
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            • Posted by Maritimus 8 years, 8 months ago
              The nature of my business was quite different. I started, in 1986, with 9 employees and ended, when I sold it, 20 years later, with 40 employee, in two locations, in two distant states. The revenue in the last year was more then 10 times what it was in the first.
              I would certainly not attempt something like that in the present conditions. The chief then was Reagan and now is O (add any four letter word). Beyond comparison.
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