14

Windows 10? Here are privacy issues you should consider

Posted by $ AJAshinoff 8 years, 9 months ago to Technology
57 comments | Share | Flag

Be concerned. Be very concerned. If you haven't already accepted the "free" upgrade, I'd suggest avoiding it for as long as you can (not that they won't find another way to get the information they want)
SOURCE URL: http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2015/07/29/wind-nos/


Add Comment

FORMATTING HELP

All Comments Hide marked as read Mark all as read

  • Comment hidden by post owner or admin, or due to low comment or member score. View Comment
  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 9 months ago
    When it comes to Microsoft Here are the decades old rules.

    1. Never buy a new release. Wait until it's at least three years old.

    2. When in doubt read rule #1.

    What do you call it when a corporation continually as a matter of doing business sells unfinished products as 'ready to go out of the box? The legal term is fraud.

    What do you call it when a government that allows no unfettered capitalism to exist fails to investigate and prosecute yet accepts campaign donations in the multi mega million bracket?

    Conspiracy works for me.

    So you want to vote for a government that is culpable under RICO?

    When in doubt look at the competition and never hire a politician until they are at least 150 years old.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by ewv 8 years, 9 months ago
      The advice for using a new Windows OS used to be to wait at least about a year, or to wait at least until the first Service Pack accumulating fixes in one package (SP!). The advice for W8 has been to wait indefinitely, not because of bugs, but because of the intentional design.

      This isn't a matter of fraudulently selling unfinished products. A lot of effort goes into testing and debugging, but they are enormously complex systems and it's inevitable that problems will be found.

      It depends on what you are interested in. Once you understand what it is in terms of design changes do you want it at all? At the other extreme, some people begin using beta releases of products because they are interested in getting advances as soon as possible, knowing that the producer has warned that it isn't ready for general use and to expect abnormal problems.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by DrZarkov99 8 years, 9 months ago
    Long time Apple user here. Professionally I've worked with Windows, and DOS before that. I also worked with Unix. Given the bad experiences I had with DOS and Windows, from poor performance, freezes (famous "blue screen of death"), and unending security issues, I chose the Mac when it first came out, and I've never regretted it.

    In a bizarre twist, the most hackable systems on the market are the wireless home security systems. I have a hard-wired system with a battery backup and cell phone callout, biding my time until the new systems become more secure.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by Herb7734 8 years, 9 months ago
    I've got W7. It came with the computer. After reading AJ's missive, I'll hold off on 10 as long as possible. The problem is, I'm not very computer literate. If I need a new computer (bound to happen) I'll either get W10 or I'll have to go to Apple. My son is a top engineer/programmer. For the most part, I refrain from bothering him, but it looks like somewhere down the road, it'll be, "Hello Steve? Listen, I've got a problem."
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by ewv 8 years, 9 months ago
      You can still buy new PCs with W7.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by davidmcnab 8 years, 9 months ago
        Interesting to know. MS in this part of the world have all but banished them off the market. It's Windows 8, or no OS, here.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by freedomforall 8 years, 8 months ago
          I had a some difficulty finding a laptop in my budget with W7 when I bought about 18 mo ago. Bought one with W8 and tried to install Xp and W7, but it was very difficult. Finally took it back for a refund. Bought one a couple months later with W7 and it has been adequate except for the hassle of having to modify the defaults and install/tinker with software to recover the XP/classic interface. MSFT keeps trying to withhold control of the computer I paid for. Reminds me of this:
          http://www.galtsgulchonline.com/posts...
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
          • Posted by ewv 8 years, 8 months ago
            When you change operating system you have to have the proper drivers that work with the hardware.

            W7 changed a lot to obstruct configuration that was routine on XP for those who exploited it, as well preventing some programs from running that still depend on XP drivers. It even abolished ntbackup that ran from tailored shell scripts.

            This part of the video was especially appropriate in a way not intended in the original:

            "We can change the focus to a soft blur, or sharpen it to crystal clarity" -- followed by another fuzzy image.
            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
            • Posted by freedomforall 8 years, 8 months ago
              I think that W8 laptop was my first exposure to uefi and the way that hp implemented it on that machine was obtuse. Neither xp or w7 dvds were recognized at bootup. I was disinclined to acquiesce to usoft's demands (to paraphrase Capn Barbossa.) Yes, xp allowed someone with with knowledge see behind the curtain and make use of knowledge. Since then usoft has been catering to the broader market of people without that knowledge and throwing the customers that made usoft a success under the bus. It's a often repeated act when growth expands a company's reach beyond its grasp.
              2020 seems a good time to try w10, but I may decide to switch to Linux before then.
              Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ TomB666 8 years, 9 months ago
      May I suggest you consider Ubuntu? It is a free, Linux based OS, with an adequate GUI. My only problem with it is that there are not as many users so I have to search online when I have a problem rather then call a friend.

      The latest fully supported version is 14.04 and is available at: http://linux.softpedia.com/get/Linux-...
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by $ jdg 8 years, 9 months ago
        I also like Ubuntu. Most of the apps I use these days are open-source anyway, and I can run my old games under DOSBOX which is also open source.

        But I wish I still had my VAX/VMS system. Now that was stable. None of today's companies make an OS that can go 10 years without rebooting. That seems like a market failure, though maybe the marketplace can still solve it.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by ewv 8 years, 8 months ago
          The current Windows is based on VMS. In the 1990s the windows system was still running on upgraded versions of DOS as the 16 bit OS. NT (for "new technology") was a complete rewrite integrating graphics with the new 32 bit OS based on VMS but without multi-users. NT was released in 1993 as version 3.1 and was marketed in parallel with DOS-based windows through WindowsME until Windows 2000 replaced the old DOS architecture. Windows 2000 was internally NT5.0 and XP was NT5.1. Today's Windows versions are updates of NT and you occasionally see it designated as an NT version internally. The NT file system was NTFS, still used today. The lead architect of NT had previously designed VMS for DEC. But they seemed to have left out the daily stability part.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by $ TomB666 8 years, 8 months ago
          Do you know of a program that will allow old windows (specifically Windows XP) to run under Ubuntu? I have a calendar program and a password program that worked great with XP that I'd like to be able to run with Ubuntu. I know there are equivalent programs for Linux, but the retyping would take all day :-(
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by davidmcnab 8 years, 9 months ago
        +5 to that ^^^

        I have been using Debian Linux (parent to Ubuntu Linux) since 2003, and haven't looked back. It's been great to see Linux evolving to become so much more stable and user-friendly over the years. These days, for over 95% of users, there's really no reason to stay on Windows. Even if there are certain specialised "Windows-only" programs you have to run for work, there are ways of getting them to run within Linux.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by dkp5309 8 years, 9 months ago
    Not so Simple solution - Don't ever buy a Microsoft product or ever use their browser. Same for Google.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by davidmcnab 8 years, 9 months ago
      To paraphrase Benjamin Franklin: Those who are willing to give up privacy for convenience deserve neither privacy nor convenience.

      I switched to Linux over 12 years ago and haven't looked back.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Comment hidden by post owner or admin, or due to low comment or member score. View Comment
      • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 8 years, 9 months ago
        Good choice. I also dumped IE and do not use Chrome but with the one machine that uses MS it''s W7 with Opera and Firefox. That one has no connection with my real life.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by woodlema 8 years, 9 months ago
    Do not use Microsoft.

    Use Linux Mint, Fedora, SUSE, Debian, CentOS, and Libre Office.

    Or use MAC OS...Windows is not now, nor has ever been the ONLY game in town.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ Snezzy 8 years, 9 months ago
      Bought a new box recently, a quad-core 64-bit thing, and it had W 8.1 pre-installed. Biggest problem was getting it to allow the installation of Ubuntu Linux. Seems the BIOS is set up to prevent, by default, the installation of "spyware".

      Windows? We don't need no steenkin' Windows.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ MikeMarotta 8 years, 9 months ago
    Windows 10 automatically shares your links with your Favorite people with all of your "favorite" people -- unless you turn that off. So, for instance, if you are a real estate agent with 500 "friends" you just enabled all of them to know about all of them … and anyone else on your favorites list, such as your family, your lawyer, your doctor…
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ 8 years, 9 months ago
      Yup. There was a time that the default from Microsoft was that everything off unless you enabled it. Now they don't bother to wait for you to be absent minded or foolish they just hope you're blissfully too lazy to bother. They are seriously making a strong case for Linux.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by ewv 8 years, 9 months ago
        There is also the question of whether they have revealed all the changes affecting your privacy and your ability to disable them -- even beyond the problem of their manipulating default settings. Google was caught bypassing security settings in its own browser and routinely scans the content of all gmail for advertising purposes and who knows what else. What else is usoft doing?

        I read a year or so ago, I think from security expert Bruce Schneier, that W10 security would include a facility for usoft to block installation of programs it doesn't approve. usoft recently announced that W10 home edition would no longer give the owner the option of rejecting "updates". Their idea of "security" seems to be their own, not yours.

        The usoft business emphasis is also reportedly changing to the "cloud", in which all your application programs and data are run and stored on their remote servers under their control. Your pc would be no more than an approved appliance mostly operating as an interface to and dependent on their servers.

        Say goodbye to Bill Gates' original conception of personal computing with multiple hardware vendors selling personally owned and controlled computers designed to compatible standards and running the software of your choice available from anywhere, for you to do what you want with in the privacy of your own home.

        The marketeers have evidently determined that a lot of people will go along with the new Big Brother emphasis, just as they put up with mass privacy violation on the internet. It's a good reason to start exploring linux substitutes, but once personal computing is only used by a minority, the growing statism can be expected to squash that, too, starting with controls on who can use the internet for what.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by freedomforall 8 years, 8 months ago
      What do you mean by 'favorite people', Mike? Is this something from W8 or new with W10?
      (I just switched to W7 about 2 yr ago and have extensively modded the interface to keep it "classic" and I do NOT accept updates from MSFT.)
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 8 years, 9 months ago
    Thank you, I was about to download the new windows 10 on my wife's computer cause she doesn't like 8. I will not be doing that now. I'll try to down load windows 7 instead.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by Flootus5 8 years, 9 months ago
    What about Windows 8.1? As we speak I have been buying a new machine that, of course, comes with 8.1. I started with a Lenovo and that turned into a steep learning curve regarding Superfish, adware, malware, spyware, bloatware, you name it.

    As machines go, I had used IBM/Lenovo for a number of years for an employer and it went well. Then I find that since then, the Chinese bought Lenovo and this spring started marketing machines now loaded with all this crap on it. The State Department has actually banned them from government use, because of the spying.

    So back it went to Lenovo and I instead bought a Dell. I have been setting it up over the last couple of days. It has gone much better than the Lenovo, but it still has come with a bunch of adware and added apps that keep popping up etc. Partly because of the learning curve with the Lenovo, this one is in pretty good shape pretty quickly. Antimalware and virus protection has cleaned it up quite well.

    So, how much have they started with all this added crap with 8.1? Any advice on things to disable?
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ blarman 8 years, 8 months ago
      8.1 was better from a user perspective because they added back in the standard desktop interface. That being said, I'll stick with Windows 7 for as long as possible. I just hate the obsession with tiles Microsoft has.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by ewv 8 years, 8 months ago
        8.1 only partially corrected the damage in 8.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by Flootus5 8 years, 8 months ago
          I have read that 8.0 was a flop initially. But why? What is the damage? What is only partially corrected?

          I read they are touting W 10 even though 8.1 substantially fixed W 8, but the damage was done to its PR. And now I have read that w 10 doesn't gain you much over 8.1 except for negative concerns as was raised with this post.

          The main issues I have had with 8.1 is all the adware and webbars they packaged with it. Lenovo's release was particularly bad with the Superfish malware and the embedded certificate issue. It is all this crap that seems stupid from a customer satisfaction perspective.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
          • Posted by ewv 8 years, 8 months ago
            W8 was a better operating system internally but tried to force a radically new and more restrictive user interface on users, trying to make everyone interface with a computer the way they might on a touch screen wrist watch. usoft stubbornly stuck by it, extending the flop well beyond "initially". Eventually W8.1 partially restored the previous interface, while still arrogantly pushing the disaster as superior -- they don't want to let go. W10 is still pushing it to a lesser degree, partially through defaults, but is better in this respect than 8.1. That is in addition to the privacy problems raised in this thread.

            Third party malware packaged by Lenovo is separate issue.
            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
            • Posted by $ blarman 8 years, 8 months ago
              Yup.

              Microsoft was late to the party with a mobile interface, so to try and catch up, they think that for some reason every device needs to be "web-enabled". Microsoft has never been the brightest bunch (see "Pirates of Silicon Valley), because they fail to recognize that people use a tablet or phone in a completely different manner than they use a desktop. Trying to force everyone to use the same interface on both types of devices actually hampers productivity, and the learning curve for the tiles on a desktop is prohibitive for most users - not to mention the admins like me who have been sick of Microsoft's ever-changing admin consoles since Windows 2000...

              Microsoft just needs to allow for two different interfaces: one for mobile devices (where the tiles work fine) and another for desktops/laptops which uses standard icons/menus. Its just that because they've been a monopoly used to pushing out whatever they want for 20 years they think that nothing has changed despite the fact that they're getting absolutely killed in the mobile world.
              Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
              • Posted by ewv 8 years, 8 months ago
                usoft has a lot of very bright people, but they don't always show the best judgment. My reaction to usoft's user interface was that I am interested in serious computing, not a touch screen wrist watch and don't want my computer restricted to emulating it. If wanted a touch screen wrist watch I would buy it.
                Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
                • Posted by $ blarman 8 years, 8 months ago
                  They have some bright people, but the ones who stay are the ones who are willing to do things Microsoft's way. My best friend's father moved to Redmond to work for Microsoft after HP (read Carly) downsized him. He left after a year because of the corporate culture there. I knew another guy (married my wife's best friend) who said the same thing after he left: that if you aren't willing to play the internal politics and do what they tell you, you're better off somewhere else.
                  Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
                  • Posted by ewv 8 years, 8 months ago
                    Is it different for senior software engineers and designers?
                    Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
                    • Posted by $ blarman 8 years, 8 months ago
                      Not according to them. They also said that Microsoft pretty much demanded that they become your new life and that it was especially hard on married folks (one had only grown children, the other small children). Add to that the fact that you can't find affordable housing within a 45 minute drive - even on Microsoft salaries Redmond is insanely expensive - and the long hours at work...

                      Then there were Allchin's revelations about the political infighting and how unless your project had Ballmer's personal okay that your funding would get cut, the unwillingness of the various business units to work together on product testing and interoperability...

                      We'll just say I've always taken a somewhat jaundiced view of Microsoft even though in the world of tech you're pretty much stuck with working with at least some of their products. I'm really hoping that Android does to Windows what Windows did to Novell so many years ago and becomes a viable competitor. I'd also love to see Apple get more in the mix there (they are making inroads but their boutique approach doesn't really engender popular appeal). I'm all for competition and Microsoft has been without it for so long that they have really languished. I'd love to see the market force them back into actually paying attention to customers' demands rather than just slapping a new look and feel on things and calling it a new OS.
                      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
                      • Posted by ewv 8 years, 8 months ago
                        usoft puts a lot of effort into improving the internals of the OS, hidden behind the arrogance of 'look and feel' and privacy violating maneuvers. But they (or more precisely we) could use some more competition to usoft.
                        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
                        • Posted by $ blarman 8 years, 8 months ago
                          Agreed. Each manufacturer has to best guess what the market wants, and those who best fulfill those needs get the most business and force competitors to adjust. Microsoft has been so long without real competition that they aren't used to adjusting to the market. When manufacturers make the terms instead of the customers they serve, it creates an artificial market.
                          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
                          • Posted by ewv 8 years, 8 months ago
                            They haven't had to contend much with competition for a PC OS, but they are very use to contending with the rest of the market -- like smart phones -- and have generally been doing very poorly.
                            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
                            • Posted by $ blarman 8 years, 8 months ago
                              Spot on. It's pretty hard to overcome a 2-3 year lag in the tech market - especially when the products you are putting out have little dev support and are relatively expensive when compared with the competition. And that's just here in the US. In second- and third-world nations, Android rules with over 90% market share because their stuff is cheap and can run even on old phones.

                              I just watched a cool little segment about entrepreneurs in South America. Both farmers and merchants were using mobile phones both in price discovery (farmers would take their goods to the markets with the best prices, merchants would search for opportunities) and in payments. Due to the number of highway robbers, electronic payments now mean that there is nothing to steal because noone carries cash except very small amounts for food, etc.
                              Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by NealS 8 years, 9 months ago
    I got my notice to install it just a few days ago. I'm reluctant and will postpone for a while until I get more information.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by coaldigger 8 years, 9 months ago
    A hacker can get anything that is on your computer because he has no regard for your right to privacy. A company asks to use your information as payment for the "free" service they are providing. You may or may not chose to read the contract but you are entering into a contract where you are exchanging things that each party values. Your contract with the government is that it exists to protect your rights and when they violate that contract they are worse than the hacker that did not commit the additional deception of entering into a contract it had no intention of honoring. I prefer Microsoft. I just switched to Windows 10 and it is pretty good. I had some difficulty on day one making it work for me as well as previous OS's that I had years of experience with but now 2 days later I am comfortable with it.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by $ 8 years, 9 months ago
      The issue isn't what a hacker can/can't do, its the assumption from MS that its okay to have a variety of data collection tools turned on when you purchase/receive the OS.

      I've been in IT for 20+ years, I have been MCSE certified, and my company was a Microsoft System Builder and registered solution provider..the assumption thats okay to collect data without your knowing consent (who really reads the license agreements?) is as arrogant as is its obnoxiously invasive.

      While its not okay to have those tools there to begin with, had they deployed the OS with those tools turned off by default would have made things more palatable.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by coaldigger 8 years, 9 months ago
        but that's what I am saying. There is no moral code that validates your assumption. It is not in their contract. Perhaps we can't tolerate the future with no moral code, depending only on laws enacted by a government that is a primary violator.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by ewv 8 years, 9 months ago
      We hear people argue that advertising surveillance is only a substitute for not charging, but there is much more to it. They engage in the same surveillance, selling of personal information, and turning it over government even when you do pay for a product or service. They do what they can get away with.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  

FORMATTING HELP

  • Comment hidden. Undo