We WILL find out how it works

Posted by Boborobdos 10 years, 5 months ago to Government
555 comments | Share | Best of... | Flag

Vermont decided to take it a step further by setting up their very own single payer system.

The slogan of the program: Everybody in, nobody out.

For details: http://www.occupydemocrats.com/vermont-m...


All Comments


Previous comments...   You are currently on page 3.
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by Hiraghm 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Now now...
    "think" is the one thing you don't do.

    And thanks for ruining it for me by being first to call khalling "silly". sheesh.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by Hiraghm 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    As far as their skills as doctors is concerned... no.
    Where's your proof that most, if not all could make "way" more in other venues?
    Some doctors take low reward jobs for the same reason people in other professions do: they lack the skills to command a higher price.

    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Silly is what I think of people who don't have a point and insist that ad hominem is a proper debate tactic.

    Our "capitalistic" system is constrained nae, just about obliterated, by the crony capitalism that keeps the 1% settled firmly in control.

    At least welfare dollars are in circulation. I have no problem with property earned. Property gained through financial fiat and other schemes like corporate welfare are crushing America.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    An excellent example is "Time Enough for Love" by Heinlein who also wrote "Stranger in a Strange Land" which along with "Atlas Shrugged" is part of the basis of the Church of All Worlds with Oberon Zell and Morning Glory.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Hmmmmm, looks to me like you don't have much of an opinion of doctors in Catholic hospitals, Shriners hospitals, and the military. Most, if not all, could make way more in other venues.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by plusaf 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    And that's EXACTLY why _I_ can't support or be a member of any right- or left-wing organization OR a Democrat or Republican party!

    Universal health care is based, in part, on the assumption that ANY kind of free market or individual choice must be completely managed and provided by a government or central planning and delivery agency.

    And as for homosexual marriage, opposition, at root, is always based on some religious doctrine and it pisses me off that the states' legislatures haven't woken up to the idea that "marriage" should be in the realm of the churches and the LEGAL rights to "life partnership" should be specified for anyone and everyone who wishes to live together and, if they wish, have sex.

    Sci-fi novels have solved those issues for decades by describing "contracts," freely entered into by any two (or more) individuals, where the aspects of divorce, inheritance and ALL the other crap is spelled out in the contract.

    If you don't like the contract, find another partner or a better lawyer to draft the document!

    Oh, and those contracts... in many stories, they're NOT "for life." Many have specified durations "with option to renew or terminate."

    And in those stories, virtually all of the issues y'all are ragging about don't exist.

    Go figure.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by plusaf 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Bridges and ferries are part of the "discussion." Folks that like the sea promote the joys of sailing and fresh air and ferries.

    And don't seem to have concern for folks who don't give a rat's patoot about that but just want to "get there quickly and easily," which kind of lends itself to highways and bridges.

    I like it when utilities and infrastructure "carry their own weight," too. I-540 on the northwest side of Raleigh was done with the promise of electronic toll collection (and tolls!) but not too many people use it. I did some math and estimated that the per-mile tolls are 3-5x what any "average toll" tends to be. I wonder what would happen if DOTs got "transparent" about numbers like that.

    btw, how do you find out if a doctor (or surgeon) is "really" good or "just in it for the money"?

    I think there are dozens of niches that Consumer Reports could and should be involved in that would help answer questions like that... :)

    Merry Christmas, too!
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by plusaf 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Thank you! My surgery was 12.18 and, per the surgeon, describing the outcome to my wife, "Textbook." I was off painkillers by the 21st and things look fine. One funny thing... I gained ten pounds from the day before surgery to my first home weigh-in on 12.20! With nothing put into my body but lots of saline, some pain killers and anti-nausea drugs and a few other routine shots. I've dropped a pound or two per day since then... almost back to pre-op weight. Strange. But progressing very well. Can't do the walking exercise that the bariatric folks insist on until my right knee's torn meniscus is repaired. With luck, that may be scheduled soon...
    Happy Holidays
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by Hiraghm 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    "might" be OK?
    "Not" do any more harm?

    I've merely given remedies which have kept me alive for half a century, and have yet to fail.

    But, of course you would reject one caring for his own troubles; one must rely on "experts" for the simplest of remedies. The individual is too incompetent, too ignorant, too weak to treat even the trivial malady of his own.
    He must go to experts to be drugged, prodded, carved upon. To lance a as boil is beyond the "average man" as brain surgery. So requires the progressive philosophy.

    Insurance companies do not *allow* prices to go up. they cause them to go up. By covering tests that are unnecessary, by covering medicines and treatments that could as well be performed by the individual, by his family or not at all.

    When a hospital charges an insured person $12,000 for the same operation that they only charge $5000 for when the person is uninsured... it's a pretty clear indicator of what the problem is.

    And, remember... Obamacare is about health *insurance*... not health *care*.

    Doctors who are in it just for the money are no different from bakers who are in it just for the money, or steel manufacturers who are in it just for the money, or retailers who are in it just for the money.

    There are few people who follow careers of their choosing "just" for for the money.
    A doctor may not be willing to sacrifice his happiness and comfort to cure the ill, but that doesn't mean he's in it just for the money. He could become a banker and gain money.

    A doctor who isn't interested in the money is a doctor whose competence I question.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Nope, no priestly molestation for me.

    Your home brew medicine might be OK and not do any more harm, then again...

    The practice of medicine has gone from a chicken if the patient could afford it to corporate demands of what the traffic will bare.

    Insurance companies have absolutely zero interest in curbing medical costs because their percentage stays the same no matter how much or little it costs. But when costs go up they get more at the same percentage so they allow prices to go up.

    Doctors who are in it just for the money IMO are worthless.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    And if your brutal god didn't create gays there wouldn't be discussion about same sex marriage.

    Hiraghm, you can "what if" all day.

    At the end of the day America is better with universal health care and same sex marriage.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by Hiraghm 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You monomaniacal obsession with Christianity is unhealthy. Did a priest molest you when you were a little girl?

    You insist upon putting words in my mouth, so to speak, yet call me a liar for drawing conclusions as to your character (or lack thereof) from your own words.

    Treatment for most ailments does not require a physician; have a headache? Bayer Aspirin will do. Cut your finger? Johnson's salve and a band-aid. Sinus headache? A bowl of boiling water and a towel. Ear ache? A cotton ball soaked in heated Vick's Vapo-Rub. A black eye? A raw piece of beef. Tummy ache? A peppermint candy. An abscessed tooth? A straight pin, some rubbing alcohol, plenty of mouthwash, a mirror and steady nerves.

    Most ailments afflicting most people can be treated by the people themselves, or their family. It's only in recent days when health insurance has begun covering everything from cancer to condoms that people feel *dependent* upon the medical profession for every boo-boo in their lives.

    While prayer certainly wouldn't hurt, it's not mandatory.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Ah, the old christian scientist approach.

    ROFL...

    Yes, Hiraghm, you pray for relief.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Wasn't referring t myself, Hiraghm. But I'll bet you knew that but had to get a slice in rather than address the real issue of living by the sword rather than in peace.

    Christians have killed a lot of folks over the years. If killing is christian then I don't want any part of it and in fact will oppose it. Fortunately I'm pretty sure you don't represent all of christanity. There are still guys out there like Bishop Spong.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Silly girl, why do you try to tell folks what I want? I don't want a pure "majority rule." If things were that way we would still have slavery in the South, and religious nuts would be preventing same sex marriage and assisted suicide.

    We have an excellent system with our three branches of government.

    And through those three branches we get things, laws (also can be called social contracts) that generally are what is best for America.

    Want proof? Look at how "trickle down" has failed.
    Reply | Permalink  
    • khalling replied 10 years, 4 months ago
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by Hiraghm 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    They can borrow, sell what they have, steal... or die.

    Tell me, if the surgery didn't exist... how would they treat their diabetes?
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Comment hidden due to member score or comment score too low. View Comment
  • Posted by Hiraghm 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Old age.
    Ask me in 20 years.

    Treatment for most ailments does not require a physician.
    Reply | Permalink  
  • Posted by khalling 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I understand law and contracts. there are few "social contracts" required for a free society. You want more. You want majority rules. Our nation was not founded on those concepts. That is reality not the truth as you wish it to be.
    Reply | Permalink  

  • Comment hidden. Undo