What is the Objectivist Position on this Philosophical Quandry?

Posted by $ prof611 10 years, 3 months ago to Philosophy
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Here's a scenario based on a variation of Pacal's Wager [ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal%27s_... ]:

An atheist lies on his deathbed. Suddenly, he calls for a priest, so he can "confess" and obtain absolution.

It seems to me that this behavior is completely logical. The man reasons as follows: If, by even an infinitessimal chance, his philosophy is mistaken, and there is a "god", he will then be able to go to "heaven". If his philosophy is correct, then he has lost nothing by "confessing".

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  • Posted by Robbie53024 10 years, 3 months ago
    What have I asserted without proof? I've asked you questions and used logic and reasoning. I haven't even asserted that faith is the same, that was you.
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  • Posted by frodo_b 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I said belief in a supernatural being. I never said anything about religion. Even the oppressors who disavowed religion still believed in a supernatural being -- the State.

    Well, bless your heart.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Alexander the Great used religion? Attila the Hun? Or how about more recent examples: Mao, Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Idi Amin, or Castro for just a few examples. For every religious oppressor, I can find an oppressor that disavowed religion.

    You count on your AK to protect you, but if I have a .50 cal who will win? You also assume that you will have others to back you up. What if I've already corrupted them and they support me for protection and to receive my benevolence?

    You use whatever moral code you want, that does not shackle me to the same.
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  • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    When did I lament my posts rating... God are you new here??
    When did I ever say because I said so??? Stop painting me with this brush. I KNOW what I LIVE...my existence and daily events tells me so... real events.
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  • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    What do you know about my time?? Don't pretend to know my inclinations either. I've cut off friends for not listening to logic, it gets tiring, and it's exhausting. You're trying to find a way to convince me that faith is based on something real.... look it up in the dictionary for Christ's sake! Now you want me to convince you that I feel love and it is real in attempting to prove that faith is real.. it's lunacy! I've been with the same man for 33 years, we have two sons and a grandson....do you believe my real love yet?? Jesus! You're comparing fantasy with reality .... life with hocus pocus....
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    Posted by Robbie53024 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Prove that they are real things. You don't get to assert things without substantiation.
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  • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Faith is not based in reality... it's based on a hope..it IS a hope. Love and freedom are real things. Sometimes people who don't think and only feel like to believe they experiencing love be cause they want to so badly and ignore the truth that what they're feeling is just the big wish that they are in love... they just want it so badly it feels real.. until reality smacks them in the face and they have to deal with facts. Freedom is related to existence... Faith is not.
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  • Posted by frodo_b 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    My moral code won't protect me, but my ak-47 will. You try to be the baddest ass on a block populated by objectivists and you’ll be lucky if you’re only tarred and feathered.

    Your original premise was that atheism, and somehow by extension objectivism, would ultimately lead to tyranny. To prove that, you tell me to look at history. Yet when I do look all I see is case after case of people using a belief in some sort of supernatural being to wage their oppression.

    I understand that your morality is to be the ruler. I also understand that there are other people out there with a similar morality. That has nothing to do with atheism. That amoral subset of the population will use whatever -ism is currently popular to accrue power. **As history shows.**

    You stated “that Objectivism does not provide the answer to the ‘Baddest Ass on the Block’ phenomenon” but then argue your point from a different morality — you’re own. If you subscribed to an objectivist morality then you wouldn’t be attempting to be the baddest ass on the block to begin with.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Another cop out. You choose to disengage when you see that you cannot use logic and reason to support your position. I have (or please point out the flaws in logic/reason). You don't get to argue "because I say so," or "I don't need to convince you." As you lamented a week or so ago, you have the 3rd most posts, so it's not like you don't have the time or inclination to continue.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Same issue. Please bottle up some of that freedom for me. Please measure the mass of that freedom, as well as the length, width, and depth of it. Is freedom real? Prove it.

    You claim, "it's not the same thing," which is the common refuge of those who don't want to accept that faith is as real as love or freedom or other such concepts. If freedom and love can be real, why can't faith? Don't hide behind "it's not the same thing." Why?
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 10 years, 3 months ago
    Just because you say so? That's not logical, rational or reasonable.

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  • Posted by LetsShrug 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Love and faith are not the same thing. Love is based on logic and reality... it is my own proof. I want a new unicorn ride... this one sucked. Nice try.
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    • Robbie53024 replied 10 years, 3 months ago
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    So, will you please bottle up some of that love for me? Please measure the mass of that love for me. How wide, long, and deep is that love? Is your love real? Prove it.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 10 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Not at all. I'm merely saying that my morality is to be the ruler. And once I have sufficient force (and toadies) so that I can rule, I will. I don't give a whit what moral code you live under. Nor will your moral code protect you from my oppression. I have thousands of years of history to prove me right. What do you have?
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