The piper must be payed...

Posted by  $  blarman 2 months, 2 weeks ago to Economics
33 comments | Share | Flag

Growing debt has been a problem in other nations. I'm not sure why people think the US is immune to its effects.
SOURCE URL: https://www.theblaze.com/news/2018/09/23/experts-growing-global-and-household-debt-leading-to-economic-downturn-worse-than-10-years-ago


Add Comment

FORMATTING HELP

All Comments Hide marked as read Mark all as read

  • Posted by  $  Olduglycarl 2 months, 2 weeks ago
    IMPORTANT, READ: http://cafr1.com/, ( http://cafr1.com/TheWay.html ) Solution. The data table link: ( http://cafr1.com/STATES/007-Total-Wea... ), shows the assets the government owns, ie, stocks/ownership and loans to big corporations public and private...in many cases...in the trillions.
    There is no debt!...it's all an illusion.

    [Do we have any accountants here at the Gulch that can give us some understanding of the tables?]

    I am beginning to take this seriously...it seems probable.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by  $  2 months, 2 weeks ago
      Hmmm... Don't I recall reading something somewhere that says that the government isn't supposed to own property outside of Washington, D.C.?
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by  $  Olduglycarl 2 months, 2 weeks ago
        This isn't property, it's ownership via stocks in public and private corporations inwhich it receives dividends, (the big banks as well)...The Federal, State and local governments have been engaged in this practice since the 1950s, (a near total take over of our corporations)...they hold Trillions and have more than enough for unfunded liabilities and infrastructure concerns.
        Any of that money used is counted as Debt!

        This guy has a plan that would make this transparent and eliminate all taxation because governments have more than enough income, without taxation, to take care of what they are charged to take care of.

        As I stated: I am beginning to take this seriously. Take a look and tell me what you think. Maybe it's worth a separate post here at the gulch.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by Herb7734 2 months, 2 weeks ago
    We are a nation of spoiled children.They want things whether or not they can pay for them. They have never had to suffer deprivation. Whatever they desired was theirs for the taking and as a result debt climbs to astronomical proportions. As long as you had a job, and today, that is pretty easy to have, you can obtain all the goodies your heart desires, and if the piper requires payment there are many remedies that will get you off scot-free so you can start to build your debt all over again.And, the way our tax structure works, the loss generated by you will allow an actual savings to where you owe the money. As the comedian says, "What a country."
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by LibertyBelle 2 months, 2 weeks ago
    I already went to the hospital the other day and canceled some appointments for the next month and November. (No serious illness, but things I had been advised to take care of). There were just too many bills and too much debt, and I wanted to get stuff paid off first.--I think that's the best idea these days.
    ---And I wish Trump would abandon this nonsense of tariffs on foreign goods, like Canada. It's just taxing the American people.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by Eyecu2 2 months, 2 weeks ago
    I have an idea that could help with the student loan debt problem.

    Often business’ “require” degrees for entry level jobs; yet, they don’t pay enough for the person in the position to make the payments for their student loans, this happens at all levels. Government jobs are the worst offenders here. To be a school teacher, you must have at least a Bachelors yet the average yearly teacher’s salary is 58,000 with first year’s teachers obviously making less.
    So now that I have laid out the obvious and stated what everyone knows yet those in power choose to ignore let me offer a simple solution.

    I propose a governmental law requiring all entities, business and government to make the payments on their employee’s student loans. With a caveat, if the job is posted as requiring a degree or even preferring a degree then the law would be in effect. If, however the position does not warrant a degree then the law would not be in effect. For example, if I were to take a position as a fry cook. Obviously, no degree is warranted in that position therefore my student loans are my problem. Whereas if I were to take a position in anything that required any degree whether my specific degree or some other then the law would be in effect.
    This would have the effect of making businesses reevaluate their job postings and post the jobs accordingly. Additionally, it would provide the relief that many recent graduates need to protect their credit. Yes, the employers would likely offer lower salaries at first for entry level jobs requiring degrees but then over time, as people began to realize that trash degrees will not offer employment or at least not loan repayment employment, people would adjust accordingly.

    In this plan obviously people with the highly coveted degrees such as Gender Equality in Racial Studies would be snatched up immediately and the poor engineers would be on the sidewalk begging for fry cook jobs….Oh wait that would be in Obama’s America.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by LibertyBelle 2 months, 2 weeks ago
      As an advocate of laissez-faire, I cannot go along with such a government plan telling private employers what they must do. I do advocate a nation-wide boycott of colleges.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by Eyecu2 2 months, 2 weeks ago
        While I would support your suggestion and also prefer a more laissez-faire approach to government. Your suggestion does not address the current student loan debt issue.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
        • Posted by LibertyBelle 2 months, 2 weeks ago
          I have principles. I go by them.
          Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
          • Posted by Eyecu2 2 months, 2 weeks ago
            Be that as it may by not addressing the issue at hand. You're not talking about the same thing. Not saying that you're wrong, just saying your comparing apples and oranges.
            Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
            • Posted by  $  2 months, 2 weeks ago
              Actually, laissez-faire is the approach. It means hands off and let people accept and deal with their own problems. That's a stark contrast to the government intervention you are suggesting.
              Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
              • Posted by Eyecu2 2 months, 2 weeks ago
                I well understand what laissez-faire means and I greatly approve of less government is better government. In fact the less the better but you still are avoiding the issue at hand.
                Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
                • Posted by  $  2 months, 2 weeks ago
                  Your repeated assertion that inaction is unacceptable (that something must be done or one is "avoiding the issue") is a false dilemma however many times you wish to repeat it. There is a distinct difference between "avoiding the issue" and refusing to accept responsibility for someone else's issue.
                  Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
                  • Posted by Eyecu2 2 months, 2 weeks ago
                    The title of the thread is, "The Piper must be paid..." and your choice of inaction would do nothing more than allow another bubble to burst as happened with the housing bubble in 08. But if you want another economic downturn I accept that you have a plan. Otherwise I stand by my position that you are avoiding the issue.
                    Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by  $  2 months, 2 weeks ago
      I'd propose a very different idea: bring back and emphasize the trades. The problem is that even entry-level jobs now are requiring a worthless bachelor's degree, while the degrees themselves are a joke. Most basic college classes are a rehash of things one should have learned in high school - English, Math, History, etc. - but didn't (for a variety of reasons). But government and academia have been pushing that coveted university degree for several decades now and so people think it is "necessary".

      A century ago, the only people who went to university were those studying law, medicine, or a few other specific specialties. Thus the prices (for the education) were still reasonable and only for the few. Everyone else spent time as an apprentice on the job, learning from those who knew the trade. After showing sufficient skill they literally worked themselves up to the level of a journeyman, indicating that they had enough experience to do the job properly. Those who showed exemplary work and expertise (usually through time and effort) were awarded the coveted title of Master. The apprentices paid for their time on the job with a lower wage. The journeyman would earn a full typical wage while the Master would command a premium wage.

      I work in computers, and the fact is that there is no computer class in college worth a darn - and I have both an undergrad and masters with computer skill emphasis. In most of those, because I held a full time job (40 hours a week) in the field, I knew more about the subject matter than those teaching the classes (and they knew it)! Computers are one area where trades make a tremendous amount of sense. I also work with a lot of accountants, and would argue strongly that basic accounting should be a trade as well, with the Master equivalent being the CPA. And I can go on and on.

      The other problem with the higher education system are the government subsidies. Talk about a problem that makes itself worse! Government keeps giving more handouts and the costs of education keep getting higher. The problem is that demand is artificially inflated (by government and popular opinion) and artificially propped up (by government subsidies). If society were to back off and convert a majority of jobs to tradecraft professions, you could bring the costs of education back down, get people in the workforce faster, and eliminate many of these worthless degree programs.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by Eyecu2 2 months, 2 weeks ago
        I agree with what you have said. I too have my degrees in Computers, my MS in MIS hasn't in any way repaid the investment. I worked in the field for 15 years but never seemed to move beyond "Entry" level jobs though my skills progressed and I trained many above me. Often my higher ups would know nothing more than buzz words and be paid as much as 10 times my salary. Maybe it's my fault as I chose to work in the IT field within education, building and running systems within the higher education environment. I also worked as an Adjunct Professor. I have since left the IT field and am now a high school math teacher.

        As to no computer class worth a darn I almost completely agree though I would argue that some of my grad level database design courses were worth while. Though they could easily have been handled by a motivated Freshman.

        My suggestion would hopefully in time eliminate those worthless degrees and bring things back into balance with only those who actually need to go to college going. Doctors, Lawyers, Teachers and a few other professions, due to the fact that no one would be willing to pay for the others.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by GaryL 2 months, 2 weeks ago
    I could be very wrong here but I do think it is all a bunch of hype! Based solely on my own personal financial conditions I don't pay any attention to these economist gurus. We maintain no debt in our household short of minor monthly utility bills and our only worries come from my state pension and 401 investments that certainly could take a big hit.
    I keep thinking the very day the USA defaults on it's/our debts then the rest of the world will be in a very bad place because the entire global economy revolves around the US dollar. Kind of like saying I can't lose what I never had so the effects will be felt by those with great wealth.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by  $  2 months, 2 weeks ago
      I applaud you for your fiscal responsibility! Now if only the rest of America didn't average something around $16,000 each (https://www.nasdaq.com/article/househ...) ...

      We won't know until it all comes tumbling down, but one thing is fact: the US continues to rack up debt it has shown no intention of paying for. Eventually, those bills come due. The only way to pay for them is either through massive inflation, or default - neither of which is particularly good for any economy - let alone the individual consumer or their investment portfolio. Oh, I suppose there is "austerity", but you'd have to throw every Democrat in jail before you could even vote on it. They would rather see a civil war (and may want to see one anyway).

      We've seen this play out before in Argentina, Greece (who was fortunate to have the EU bail them out not just once but twice), and several other nations (Italy, Portugal, Spain, Ireland) are getting very close. To think that the US can keep going the way it is and not face any negative consequences is to deny the evidence, imho.
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by GaryL 2 months, 2 weeks ago
        You just laid out the very reason why the liberals are so intent on erasing the second amendment. This Civil War they would like to see is one they should think long and hard about because the guns will be trained in their direction.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
  • Posted by  $  mshupe 2 months, 2 weeks ago
    This article is very weak, citing debt statistics isn't very challenging. Finding an economist predicting a looming recession is like finding a penny in a wishing well.
    Reply | Mark as read | Best of... | Permalink  
    • Posted by  $  2 months, 2 weeks ago
      So in your opinion, the economy is doing great and our debt - both individual and institutional - aren't things to be worried about?
      Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  
      • Posted by  $  mshupe 2 months, 2 weeks ago
        Yes, when economists are obsessed with the flawed GDP metric, the efficacy of government stimulus, quantitative easing, and the Fed, and ignore wealth creation, there is always cause for concern. My point is this article only makes a vague reference to exploding global debt as the catalyst for him impending recession. Right now there is no recession on the horizon, however the catalyst for one won't be known until after the fact.
        Reply | Mark as read | Parent | Best of... | Permalink  

FORMATTING HELP

  • Comment hidden. Undo