Why we should Talk about IQ and Race (For Compassion, not Racism)
Posted by CaptainKirk 5 years, 9 months ago to Politics
Stefan Molyneux made this point in his podcast on what is happening is South Africa.
Where the government is LYING and saying the Whites that own the farms, came here and BRUTALLY KILLED the blacks, and stole their land.
The truth is that they came when the land was basically barren, and could not be farmed. The built irrigation, and made the property productive.
Every farmer feeds about 2,000 people for a year. When they are done killing and chasing these people away, the farms will be taken over. And
they will NOT get the same results... And MILLIONS will starve. It has already started.
So, back to the point. If you can accept that the Black people in South Africa have an AVERAGE IQ around 75... You start to realize the problem.
The US Army will not take you if you are below 83! Because you make more mistakes, and have a tough time following directions, especially making
a judgement call...
This is NOT to insult these people. Nobody should call Japanese people SHORT using Norwegian standards of height.
The challenge we face is that we have to understand what to do here...
We have to find a way to make those people with lower IQs useful in society, and to root out the causes of this (I believe it is probably Environmental,
because if you have to be physically strong/fast to survive, and IQ does not help, but may hurt your chances of surviving... Nature adjusts for that).
But if we CANNOT Talk about it without being called Racist... It's just wrong.
Also, a side note. Whites are now a Minority in South Africa (Mentioned on the podcast), and they are NOT IMPLEMENTING ANY rules to make sure Whites get jobs ahead of the Majority? In fact, the same rules that are the opposite are still in effect. To the detriment of many companies.
I am curious where we stand on a Society and how they handle 10% of the population that cannot effectively work a real job because of IQ Deficiency?
(ie, it is NOT their fault... What do we do?)
Thanks
Where the government is LYING and saying the Whites that own the farms, came here and BRUTALLY KILLED the blacks, and stole their land.
The truth is that they came when the land was basically barren, and could not be farmed. The built irrigation, and made the property productive.
Every farmer feeds about 2,000 people for a year. When they are done killing and chasing these people away, the farms will be taken over. And
they will NOT get the same results... And MILLIONS will starve. It has already started.
So, back to the point. If you can accept that the Black people in South Africa have an AVERAGE IQ around 75... You start to realize the problem.
The US Army will not take you if you are below 83! Because you make more mistakes, and have a tough time following directions, especially making
a judgement call...
This is NOT to insult these people. Nobody should call Japanese people SHORT using Norwegian standards of height.
The challenge we face is that we have to understand what to do here...
We have to find a way to make those people with lower IQs useful in society, and to root out the causes of this (I believe it is probably Environmental,
because if you have to be physically strong/fast to survive, and IQ does not help, but may hurt your chances of surviving... Nature adjusts for that).
But if we CANNOT Talk about it without being called Racist... It's just wrong.
Also, a side note. Whites are now a Minority in South Africa (Mentioned on the podcast), and they are NOT IMPLEMENTING ANY rules to make sure Whites get jobs ahead of the Majority? In fact, the same rules that are the opposite are still in effect. To the detriment of many companies.
I am curious where we stand on a Society and how they handle 10% of the population that cannot effectively work a real job because of IQ Deficiency?
(ie, it is NOT their fault... What do we do?)
Thanks
BECAUSE You cannot be successfully trained and reliably counted on to perform.
And his point in his lectures is. In America, this is 10% of the population. So 36 Million people. And what should we do.
My first thought, of course, was sterilization, because if we give them assistance, then we are going to have them getting married to eachother...
And we are going to get two 80 IQ people making a 60...
Also, research is done, tracking IQs across countries. MANY countries, like Somalia have very little diversity, and I believe the last quoted number was 76.
==
One Dilemma on 100 IQ. Which was considered average... Is that populations change. You can have more people with a higher IQ than years ago.
Finally, ONE reason I believe in IQ, is because it tests pattern recognition. And if you had to describe low to high intelligence, the simplest description is the complexity of its ability to recognize patterns. And to use those patterns to predict. I was literally thinking of doing my masters on this concept in computers.
Now, IQ has ONLY that meaning. I know LOSERS who have high IQs... I know amazing people who are probably 95 IQ, but have so much grit, and personality that they are outstanding in what they do. Change the game on them, and they take quite a while to re-figure the new game out, but play it too...
But Jordan Peterson even has a chart showing that the average IQ of people who succeed in complicated Careers, like Doctors, Lawyers, Accountants, Computer Programmers... All require IQs above 100 to really be successful. And they can test those and correlate them.
If it was, the University System would have been drained of the High IQ people it was seeking back then.
I don't believe it is an accident... Most laws are not...
I would not be surprised at all to find differences in average IQ from one race to another. The liberals would have a fit with findings like that for sure
This very same thing played out after the Russian Revolution, BTW. The Ukraine was completely depopulated of its hard-working farmers, who were shipped off to gulags and murdered. The politically-connected were then given the land, but these self-important and politically-connected elites didn't have a clue how to grow crops, so they produced a pittance of what the experienced farmers could. I don't expect South Africa to have any better outcome than Russia did. My bet is that within 20 years we'll see more riots and instability in South Africa - only this time it will be their own faults. It won't stop them from blaming, though.
IQ is generally linked to the ability to Delay Gratification.
If you know that you have 12 jars of food, and 9 months to live off of them until spring... You'd have to have a very low IQ to eat all 9 jars in the first month!
But NATURE Fixes that Pretty Quick...
So, yes, you could make a lot of money setting up a Legit company. But you can make better money quicker by being as corrupt as everyone else.
Now, there are MANY High IQ Corrupt people out there. But among other High IQ people, they get caught a bit faster.
This lack of Delayed Gratification and this Culture of LOOTING is to blame. But you have to be pretty smart to realize if you stop looting, then EVERYONE will do better. And its a REALLY hard sell to someone who CANNOT hold a job because they are freaking idiots (technical IQ term).
Oh, and you say you don't need a decent IQ to build a road.. The logistics planning on getting the materials there in time so everyone isn't standing around waiting is a HUGE task in building these roads. Also, 10% of the budget is to make temporary roads, and label all the Alternate routes, etc.
This level of planning in an 80 IQ person is like PhD work...
IQ Doesn't determine your value, but it shows strong tendencies towards when you will become a bad fit (we used to call it the Peter Principal, that you get promoted until you fail). But I want to do a future whole piece on IQ and what Randians have said, etc.
You can teach people with low IQ a wide variety of jobs in which they will perform to expectations. Now they might be the ones pouring the concrete instead of designing the dam and they might be the ones running the asphalt machine or steamroller instead of placing a turnpike, but it doesn't mean that just because they are less intelligent that they are automatically going to be looters. Those statements are overly broad generalizations.
I will agree with you that those with lower IQ's are more likely to be taken advantage of than those with a higher IQ. IQ is largely an abstract measurement of how well people correlate things and put together relationships of many kinds, not just causal relationships. It is not, however, not a causal factor. I would argue that those with a low IQ are more likely to be convinced by cultural norms and emotional considerations rather than intellectual considerations. It is one of the reasons the mob mentality is so dangerous - one reasonably intelligent person can manipulate a mob of people into voting to give up their rights or violating the rights of others. And South Africa isn't the only place where this is a problem.
Here in America we are suffering from an IQ problem, honestly. I don't think it can be fixed in our current paradigm of bigger government, government schools and what we are subjecting our kids to. Good luck, everybody...
Generally speaking - and we are speaking of a broad population: it takes all kinds, as they say -- the refugees tended to be the middle class. It cost thousands of US dollars to escape. Many of them had automobiles, some of which were destroyed by the Turkish army at the border. Generally speaking, refugees tend to be those with insight, foresight, and social capital. The huddled starving masses are just part of the mix.
As for their IQs, again, the entire question of what such tests actually measure is putative. As best they are measures of cultural acuity. Some intelligence tests are (they claim) free of cultural bias but those are administered by trained professionals in individual sessions. I doubt that this was done by Stefan Molyneux.
As for America here and now, surely, we can amuse ourselves with the fact that half of all Americans are below average intelligence. Chortle as we may, the truth is that the general intelliigence level seems to be rising over time. It is called The Flynn Effect. We can debate that.
Perhaps you know the Cyril Kornbluth story, "The Marching Morons." Our society does seem to be getting dumber through automation, but that easy claim begs the question: whence automation? The truth is that over half of all Americans are above average intelligence and we have the space age, the atomic age, the information age, and the anti-aging genetics revolution to prove it.
The Gulch appeals to many glass-half-empty kind of persons -- except for the engineers who will insist that a half-empty glass is just twice as big as it needs to be.
IQ is a fairly useless concept anyway as MM has said, but there is such a thing as intelligence as well as sense and competence tho' finding good measures of these is tricky.
The problem is with the new religion of victim worship. To get special preferential treatment requires membership - real or fake - of certain groups called victims. Being white, male and normal disqualifies. Otherwise, being loud and stupid are good starting points. Nominally, it is being disadvantaged that gives membership. ( Well yes I think that being stupid should qualify for some protection - free of voting obligation at least.) This new religion is a product of christianity and marxism taking as its key concept that of altruism.
Those (loud and stupid) who cannot argue they are victims can divide all the rest as either victims or racists. Then they want to impose what they call restitution by taking from the racists and giving to victims, there are of course big rake-off commissions to the distributors. (Sounds like climate change action?).
US names for these are liberal and progressive, better names are- the governing class, the chattering classes. Among their policies are open borders for so-called refugees / asylum seekers many of whom are genuine, intelligent, even productive. Most are not. But the elites want to take them all. My view is that I can take a variety of skin and hair colors, religions (Buddhists, Hindus, LDS, even Lutherans), IQ, funny clothes, and even the wearing of shrouds (it is only women I understand). But I do object to those who want to chop-off my head. For this, I am designated as a racist. Some like thinkers note that some of the so-called victims are very good at qualifying for government benefits. Does this qualify them as intelligent?
I'd prefer to select on attitude and ability.
The meaning of the gratuitous comment about engineers escapes me.
IQ is really hard to raise, but it is quite easy to drop. Nourishment is one way, this was found out to be another.
BTW, I just learned that Fasting may significantly reduce the risk of Alzheimer's Disease!
See Ayn Rand's essay on "Racism."
See Joan Blumenthal's review of The Tyranny of Testing by Banesh Hoffman (Objectivist Newsletter March 1964.
Those are not ground-breaking, frontline theoretical propositions. They were established fact 50 years ago. Anyone who claims to admire the work of Ayn Rand and who does not know those works has some reading to do.
IQ is a dodgy concept.
Race as a description is useless for decision making.
Capt.K is correct in describing what is happening in S.Africa. The old apartheid was real bad, the new regime started out as wish-washy but is getting worse. Now, different skin color but same - same. White farmers are being murdered.
An odd fact, the first inhabitants of the far south were white - the Boer - narrow minded, independent, hard workers. The blacks arrived later from the center of the continent. They had the Kalahari to cross, extreme heat and dryness, a harsh barrier.
Capt.K asks good questions- What should we (or they) do?
If it were me- discrimination for or against, no, but maybe rules for children. Help the poor to get work by having no minimum wage rules, reduce prices by eliminating gov sanctioned restraints on trade.
to find a way to make those people with lower IQs useful
Whether or not IQ is valid I reckon a bigger issue is attitude. There is no medication for this but changes in education should help.
I will read them.
But it seems like a conversation we cannot have in the open... And that was the impetus for putting it out there...