That may be Dob, a far a trusting leaders goes, I am not sure there has been much to trust since George Washington left, everyone has had an agenda, almost always "for the public good" and almost always either being for a rich group of sponsors, or a special interest group of voters. I have had to realize our system hs been corrupt for a very, very long time, it just changes with time as to who it is corrupt for. Nowadays it is so blatant, obvious and specific that it seems 10x worse, but I think maybe that is just because they no longer feel the need to hide. Each person must establish their own criteria for valid data, that is why people tend to argue, is they do not appreciate the fact each person has their own "qualifiers" for good data. We agree on basics, and so our interests tend to go together, but we may differ on the details. Respecting each others opinions and qualifiers is what leads to good discussion and debate. Seems that may be what politicians are missing, see my post on the teacher arrested for daring to question the schools boards looting habits...

Here just long enough to change the climate.LOL
Nickursis you and I from the same age group, we grew up transitioning from trusting our leaders to recognizing that they are for the most part privileged looters that constantly have lied for their own devious purposes. They have distorted facts, discredited witness, intimidated innocent folks all in the name of national security. With an intended side effect to silence witnesses. Note that many folks as they get older, start to feel less threatened
They start to share what they experienced . You have to ask yourself. why would they at that stage
In life make up some fake story that has a mental stability stigma.
The problem that I have with the dancing lights or Orbs are that they could be electrical phenomenon or reflections from glass , atmospheric variations and Digital cameras tendencies Especially when infrared .
It is cool stuff but eyewitness events are more compelling, particularly the incidents with law enforcement , and military.

Indeed and it is only arrogance to not consider all possibilities, with an eye to the quality and honesty of the facts presented, We have been around so little we really have no idea what is around us.

Like my dad used to tell me. There is always somebody bigger and stronger ,smarter and faster or older.
If the purported age of the universe is 13 billion years and it is represented as a 24 hr clock. We humans got hear about 11:59.57 pm.or for about 3 seconds.

Indeed, although there are enough enigmas in the world today just to question that idea, possibly previous civilizations...

Indeed, doomed from the get go but it has fed conspiracy theories for 40 years...

Hynek was chosen to lead the study specifically because he was already on record stating that UFOs did not exist, except in delusional minds. When you set out to follow your confirmation bias, the results are inevitable. The Air Force wanted to get out of the game of chasing UFO sightings, even though the Bluebook team was a very small group with a very limited budget. All of the data collection was performed as an extra duty, costing nothing, but the higher-ups didn't like the image.

chad suggests, " maybe we are it"
What a depressing thought!
We have all these problems and there is no authority to get advice from.

On the other hand, inspiring as it is up to us to improve.
What are the available tools and characteristics that would help or hinder?
Use of the mind v. acting on impulse?
Allowing individuals to achieve v. requiring equality?
Using Rand and Mrs Thatcher as guides or Marx, Mao, Clintons?

Or, there may be a very advanced society of many species, that is treating us as low order intelligence, given that we have a propensity to kill each other, and what we do not understand. Maybe a Prime Directive?

Doc, I think that with the proliferation of easy photography, the numbers increased to match, and there are a lot of unexplained observations. The OHare airport one is a particular item, since it was seen by a few dozen airline workers and the pictures the flight crew took never surfaced. There is such a spectrum of mis and dis information, it has become difficult to get to just a factual set of data. Even the Air Force seemed very compromised, in that Dr. Hynek later seemed to disavow a lot of BlueBooks statements,.

Yep, the question is sort of why the infrared sees them so well, but that may just be a function of the way daylight works.

I'm not convinced it's not satellites. There are many times I've laid out at night in the pitch black looking up into a clear night sky and saw multiples of these lights moving in that fashion with the naked eye. Low earth orbit satellites are quite similar to these patterns.

Just another mystery of the universe. The more we know, the less we know.

I was one of the last members of the Air Force teams that investigated UFO sightings and provided the information to Bluebook. Most of the cases I collected data on were in the "drunk redneck" category, but there were a couple that couldn't be explained away, with credible observers in different locations, and at least one home movie of an odd-shaped light source that changed orientation and moved non-linearly. We had the original film roll, so doctoring the image was ruled out. Video was rare in the late '60s, so I never saw any.

For all the investigating, from 1949 to 1969, none of the 5-8% of sightings that passed muster could identify what people were seeing, hence the term "unidentified" flying object is still appropriate.

Some of the behavior patterns we noticed were similar to the movement of fish or birds, suggesting these might be an undiscovered terrestrial species of flying animal, but then it crosses over into cryptozoology.

Too little information to make a judgement. Interesting, could be an atmospheric anomaly that is a temperature difference. It is possible that there is a more advanced civilization on another planet able to travel the vast differences of the cosmos who are curious about other planets, species and people. Of course some civilization would be the first and most advanced and maybe we are it!

That's right...but I think that green plant life is what is needed and as you state...all of the supporting systems it needs that are not present in that environment.
I also think that we'd need a robot to tend to and nurture the whole project. It likely would take a long time to create an atmosphere we could breath.
We'd also have to consider how much of that atmosphere is lost to space, lost to it's attraction to oncoming particles from the sun.
I would imagine that the same process, like that of earth, when our atmospheric contents reach out to oncoming cme's etc. would happen on mars also.

Well I guess that answers that..although I am not so sure Cacti or anything would work yet, you need a bacteria environment to support plants, nematodes and such who convert N2.

I don't think there is enough water vapor on mars to create clouds like earth. Just dust clouds, sand storms etc. Also the magnetic fields/ionosphere are different.

All these scientists want to add carbon to mars but mars has all the carbon it needs...what it does need is green plant life.
We should introduce some moss or something that could withstand the dry environment/ and temperature swings...maybe Cactus?

Did you try this one?

https://youtu.be/XaiJWKSdKdw

Well, yes, the possibility cannot be discounted, although (this may seem weird) what if something along the lines of Men in Black movies existed and ships could cloak and come and go as they wish? There are many videos recorded in space of objects navigating and coming up and going into the atmosphere, so many that you have to wonder if we are just being kept out of everytghing because we are the lower form of intelligent life on the place, so we are protected "for our own good", making them Liberal Aliens?

Interesting, I have seen some of the Thunderbolts projects videos. It seems that this could all fit in with Graham Summers Idea, if an ancient cultural remnants were trying to send a message to the future...

So, then that idea coincides with Venus, but seems to not work on Mars, unless it has a function of water vapor or CO2 density?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpBnJ...
Oops itchy trigger finger.
https://youtu.be/pZ4_mGIXvSM
In this interview David Debyne discusses geoengineering in a gentler manner than I would. He also
Covers the cosmic rays in good detail.

Was reading a paper Ben at SO posted: Talked about how over night temps have risen by one degree from 1898 to 2010 I think. Well, why would that happen, what would cause overnight temps to be higher than some illustrious "Norm"?...can you say: Cloud Cover?

Magnetic shields have been weakening for over 100 years, noticeably, leaving us at the mercy of "Cosmic Radiation"...which as we know now...causes clouds.

How long now have we gotten used to the onslaught of clouds showing up at the end of each day. How many clear nights have we had...not many recently...seems to be a rarity.

And...we haven't even broached the subject of possible "Geoengineering".

They have the model for global warming.
The directions state: lie and scare people
Then fudge the data, lie some more,
Attack dissenters and lie some more.
Use charts and graphs that just show statistics that are favorable. Ignore long term temp fluctuations. Totally ignore the sun. Change problem to climate change because that is what is coming but it will be colder and more difficult to support the human population, so lie some more
About why we are having record cold temps. Blame it on green house gases.