Executive Suite - Climactic scene

Posted by $ splumb 6 years, 3 months ago to Movies
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I wonder if she saw this movie, and if so, what she thought of it.

SOURCE URL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcEOsGvT0qA


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  • Posted by $ Solver 6 years, 3 months ago
    I like it! Quality products employes are truly proud to create.

    "...That's what you want Walt, isn't it - what you've always wanted? Merchandise that will sell because it has beauty and function and value - not because the buyers like your scotch or think that you're a good egg. The kind of stuff that you, Jesse, will feel in your guts when you know it's coming off your production line. A kind of product that you will be able to budget to the nearest hundredth of a cent, Shaw, because it will be scientifically and efficiently designed. And something you will be proud to have your name on..."

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  • Posted by $ Temlakos 6 years, 3 months ago
    I watched it all. I am very much afraid that all the Tredway Companies of America have taken the Avery Bullard route, and the Loren Shaws have taken command. And so they are turning out their KF Lines of cheap imitations, not quality products.
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    • Posted by $ Susanne 6 years, 3 months ago
      Worse than that, they farm them out to other countries, where there is essentially no quality control, they speak an unfamiliar language, and their entire philosophy is, compared to ours, convoluted... those who have a stake in the company are thousands of miles away, and then they cut the quality further to get contracts for certain big-box stores, the names of which are well known.

      People want the latest flashiest junk RIGHT NOW and want to get it for NOTHING and are willing to settle for something far below factory seconds because then they can say "Look at my cool new _________ (fill in the blank)". While their trash cans are filling with the junk they're replacing it with they purchased less than a year before... and they look at something like the KF line junk in the movie, and think that's high quality, because their expectations are *so* low.

      Most of the equipment in my shop, I got used... not because it was necessarily cheaper, but because it was built (in America) to be durable, accurate, and not be disposable. Actually, just got a Rockwell Scroll Saw that dates from *maybe* the early 50's (if not before)... and you can *feel* the quality, see the precision that went into it, and other than having to oil it, is literally maintenance free. (Yes... Oil it. Who would have thought of that??!!) I could have paid 3x as much for a Chicom knockoff, NIB, at Home Despot or Blowes... and when you look at them (mostly all former brands that screamed "quality") and they're not worth a tinkers you-know-what out of the box...

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      • Posted by DeadRight 6 years, 3 months ago
        Electric Motor bearings that need to be oiled seem to last longer than modern bearings that "seem" to be no maintenance. I have opened so many "oil-less" motors only to find them unrepairable because the bearings are stamped in place and not removable. Even worse they are often sintered not ball. Junk.
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        • Posted by $ Solver 6 years, 3 months ago
          One learns not to buy from companies that sell junk? If enough people won't buy from them, they......can become public money bailout candidates in the name of the greater good.
          (did reality just change?)
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    • Posted by airfredd22 6 years, 2 months ago
      Re: Temlakos,

      Sadly you are 100% correct. I seem spend half my time writing letters and talking to supervisors asking them to flag the tape of our conversations and send it "upstairs" to the executives. unfortunately most employees are simply afraid to rock the boat. I'm lucky if I get a response to 1 out of 10 of these complaints.

      I recently entered a supermarket primarily catering to the Mexican buyers here in Reno. The company, "Marketon" had just instituted a "no bags may be carried into the store" policy. I was asked to remove a small sports bag and leave it at the customer service desk. I found this to be insulting to me as a customer. I spoke to the manager later and told her that I sympathize with the shoplifting problem, but that was their problem and did not give them the right to insult their customers. while she was polite and apologetic about the situation, she also told me that it was orders from the home office. I told her that i understood but would not patronize their store again unless I received a positive response from the executives to whom I would direct a letter.

      That day I faxed a letter to the company president and 2 days later I received a call apologizing for the incident and the assurance that the sign would be removed and the employees would be informed of the change in that particular policy. True to their word, when I entered the store later that day, everything had changed and the manager when noticing me approached with a smile and thanked me for following through. She too was embarrased by that temporary policy.

      I must commend Marketo for their quick and positive response to this matter.

      that's how a company should be run.

      Fred Speckmann
      commonsenseforamericans@yahoo.com
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  • Posted by $ johnrobert2 6 years, 3 months ago
    I remember seeing this part, though not the entire movie. Always thought it exemplified the best of the American spirit until we had to start competing against predatory pricing by offshore manufacturers. Then we had to contend with inflating prices and wages, forcing the American consumer to buy shoddy goods which were designed for obsolescence/disintegration. Until the driving force becomes quality workmanship at a reasonable cost, the future won't resemble that scene.
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    • Posted by airfredd22 6 years, 2 months ago
      Re: johnrobert2,

      You are correct, until the American consumer wakes up and stops buying these shoddy goods, we will continue to deterioate as a nation.

      A nation needs to have pride in all things including manufacturing just as William Holden stated in his speech.

      I once received a list of items that were still manufactured in the U.S. that most people believed to be obsolete. Americans need to start buying American made products again whenever possible. Ironically these items were at a competitive price made buy well run companies. we need to make a little effort and we can change the attitude of the many shoddy companies. Write to them and let them know why you will no longer buy their products unless they start paying attention to their customers. an example of well run company producing quality products is Stanley tools who take people off the street to test their new products and most of all they listen to their customers.

      Here is a link to an article on how Stanley Tools tests their products and a partial article is also below.

      http://www.stanleytools.com/default.asp?...

      "The product development cycle for a tool at Stanley often begins with the end user and the Stanley® FatMax® line is no exception. The Stanley Discovery Team interacts with end users in an environment that is both comfortable and familiar for them, the job site, to acquire information about how a professional would make the best tool in the industry. Stanley takes that knowledge and shares it with designers and engineers who develop early prototypes and test models. These models are then tested on job sites with professionals, modified according to their suggestions and then tested again. Once the tool meets the needs of the pro, Stanley finalizes the design and develops the product."

      don't you wish that the very intelligent but without commonsense web application designer would do the same?

      Fred Speckmann
      commonsenseforamericans@yahoo.com
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      • Posted by strugatsky 6 years, 2 months ago
        You are saying that Americans need to buy American products; I see it differently - Americans need to produce products in such a way (quality, cost, etc. ) that people will want to buy them. $15/hr for hamburger flippers and almost $100/hr for union labor for 5 people doing a job that should have been done by one? Really?
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    • Posted by $ Susanne 6 years, 3 months ago
      They've become accustomed to "cheap bling" rather than "quality goods" and since they're willing to buy crap, the manufacturers are more than happy to sell them crap. For more than what they paid for quality.

      Take Home Vacuums. We just replaced our old (Electrolux B.V. made) Eureka (which BTW is now my shop portable...), looked at everything from the New Eurekas to Hoover to, well, you name it. Every one was substandard at best. So we bought a Miele. Sure, they're not cheap, and it doesn't have a lot of useless bling (that doesn't work anyway) - but by god, it's built like a tank. Has what you need to get the job done. And it works. Those are what we *used* to get from Hoover et.al... but no more.
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  • Posted by strugatsky 6 years, 3 months ago
    So, at first impression, as intended, this is a powerful speech for the benefit of pride of what one is doing, future growth, ideals backed by effort and the proper path of the society. Great! But, let’s analyze it a bit and we may see a different picture. A picture that is well hidden, intentionally and cunningly. Let me start with the tipping point – when the speech focuses on “we”, the collective. Keep in mind that it was done in Hollywood, at the time when progressivism and socialism were ripening there. But Hollywood could not, at that time, come out of the closet and openly advocate its ideals. And, of course, the best and most effective propaganda is of the subtle type, the one that everybody falls for.

    The antagonists in the movie are shown as “two-dimensional,” unreal characters. Black and white good or black and white bad. Interested in squeezing the most profit today and damn tomorrow or idealistic, inspiring, future oriented giants. That is just not real life. Subtly, the capitalists seek to destroy the profit motive by stripping it of all good, while promoting ideals without regard to reality. Of course, much of what’s said in the speech is proper and true, but it is being used to degrade the capitalist, who is portrayed as an inhuman machine. Or, look at it from the other direction – did communal ideals ever provide the society with productive industries and a high standard of living? America, at the time that movie was made, enjoyed by far the highest standard of living in the world and productivity greater then the rest of the world combined. Now, look at what the idealistic collectivism has achieved.
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    • Posted by airfredd22 6 years, 2 months ago
      Re: strugatsky,

      While I agree with your intellectual and logical analysis, I must disagree with your conclusion.

      I think what you may have missed is the emotional commitment of the Holden character to produce quality products and that will never happen without the commitment of the individual leader of the company. Holdens focus is on quality, he understood that profits follow quality.

      Fred Speckmann
      commonsenseforamericans@yahoo.com
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      • Posted by strugatsky 6 years, 2 months ago
        No capitalist, owner of an enterprise, with much investment, assuming the person has not gone cuckoo, will willfully destroy his investment in order to get nebulous short-term profits. That is in fact what happens under socialism when ownership, if it exists at all, is temporary at best. The progressive / liberal propaganda machine is very good at twisting the truth and blaming others for the problems it has itself created. In the movie, the typical socialist problems became capitalist problems; the socialist dis-ownership of investment (and, therefore shabby quality, as exemplified by all socialist products) is portrayed as a capitalism problem. These people are masters at twisting reality.
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        • Posted by airfredd22 6 years, 2 months ago
          Re: strugatsky,

          Despite your articulate arguments, I must strongly disagree with you even more. todays businessmen in fact have taken on more and more the attitude as precented in the movie. Short term gains seems to be all the executives think about these days. The next quarterly report is the longest horizon any of them understand and that is because many companies are run by beancounters instead of men with vision. It has been the primary reason of the destruction of our industries that were once the envy of the world.

          I don't see where any of that has any relationship to socialism or communism. Those two designations belong squarely to the present administration who only seem to want to tax every business and every citizen more and more in order to buy votes. That vote buying scheme has now been achieved as just about half of America no longer pays taxes but receives money transferred from the doers to the leeches.

          Fred Speckmann
          commonsenseforamericans@yahoo.com
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          • Posted by strugatsky 6 years, 2 months ago
            Back to my original point - we do not have capitalism in this country anymore. We have a socialist system. The survival and success methods under socialism are short term results (five year plans, or shorter). Long term equity is out the window because we do not have real owners anymore. We have stock owners, who trade stocks and allegiances at will and due to ever-changing regulations and taxes, no one knows what will happen tomorrow, so why plan for it and sacrifice today? These are all typical features of socialism - the same as the economy of the Soviet Union. We are repeating the Soviet system, except that instead of the KGB we are employing the IRS. Then we blame the failures on the greedy capitalists; the Soviets did exactly the same thing, just called them the subversive elements and counter-revolutionaries. But the root of the evil is socialism.
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            • Posted by airfredd22 6 years, 2 months ago
              It looks like we only differ on a few points. you mention 5 year plans of the old Soviet Union, I only wish that businesses today planned for at least 5 years.

              As to the governments way of doing business, I couldn't agree more that it has taken on all the trappings of socialism. However, I still see a small difference between socialism in the government and similar characteristics in business today. At least for the moment business is still in it for a profit, a disguided one to be sure, but the government wants total control over everything.

              Fred
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              • Posted by strugatsky 6 years, 2 months ago
                Yes, we do agree on the basics - just a slightly different perspective - you see socialism as coming, while I, having lived under socialism, see it as already here. BTW, socialism does not preclude corporations from making profits - the Soviet enterprises were required to make a profit (they didn't always achieve that goal, but that was a requirement) and, of course, companies under the Nazi rule made profits and did so openly. The profits, of course, were limited, as "excessive" profits were forbidden, just as in today's USA.
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                • Posted by CarolSeer2014 6 years, 2 months ago
                  I think the best economic definition of socialism is government control of the means of production and distribution of goods and services, however that comes about. Thus, not only are our choices as individuals limited, but they are limited to only those choices that government thinks you ought to have. Who died and made government the determinator of the greater good, as if the greater good had legitimacy at all.
                  And so government makes the decisions, and takes from those who produce and gives it to those who do not--"From those...etc."
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                  • Posted by strugatsky 6 years, 2 months ago
                    Yes, government control of production and distribution is the basic definition of socialism, the macroeconomic view. On the microeconomic level, where the rubber meets the road, it results in wholesale stealing of everything by everyone, legalized in the so-called justice system, generally shabby products due to lack of personal ownership and engagement by the citizens and, eventually, apathy. Thus, "mild and gentle" forms of socialism can only exist temporarily, until the economy disintegrates. Then, someone like Stalin or Hitler will be necessary to make it productive again. Meanwhile, the "people" get drunk on the euphoria of free handouts, without regard that those are simply stolen from others, while there is still something left to steal. With reference to the movie that is the subject of this post, what I observed is the cunning, evil twisting of the truth and the shapping of a propaganda message. This is done masterfully and hardly anyone would notice, but will leave a deposit in one's conscience and eventually lead to where we are now.
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                  • Posted by CarolSeer2014 6 years, 2 months ago
                    Well, Solyndra is the best example of government taking from Big Oil and making grants to Green Energy. After all, the Science is Settled, so government can determine who gets the money. I say, tell that to Copernicus, or Galileo. Actually, I think the pope did tell it to Galileo. I call these scientists, the Drs. Chicken Little. Or how to impose socialism with the help of the educated?
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    • Posted by $ Solver 6 years, 3 months ago
      This was a corporation setting. Someone there has to decide how the business can go on making the most profit year after year. If it was a government setting, you might as well start handing out those little red books.
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  • Posted by $ Susanne 6 years, 3 months ago
    "We'll never again ask a man to do anything that will poison his pride in himself or his work."

    Walling talking about the slopshod crummy KF line of crap they had denigrated into making - I love that. I forgot how much I loved that movie and its ending - thank you!!!
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 6 years, 2 months ago
    The protagonist really feels the need to yell and gesticulate to drive his points home, which is unfortunate.

    There are many themes that seem modern:
    - Balancing appeasing short-term concerns of analysts/shareholders with investment in long-term growth.
    - Motivating people. The modern book Drive: The Surprising Truth About What Motivates Us covers many similar points.
    - Damaging your brand by associating it with low-cost goods, the way Cadillac did in the early 80s. Someone in that meeting should have suggested creating a value brand for the low-cost merchandise.

    I like the theme of the clip, but it turned me off how verbally aggressive the protagonist was. If his ideas are stronger, he shouldn't have to be bombastic.
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  • Posted by Notperfect 6 years, 3 months ago
    When I walk into a small business that I frequent I still see that quality not quantity that rules. Then I talk to some who have worked for some of those large companies that could care less as long as their paycheck was not hindered. Those lost that competitive spirit because there were outside entity's who had only one thing in mind. Bottom line. Now look at some of them. Gone.
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  • Posted by plusaf 6 years, 3 months ago
    Thank you! I just forwarded the video's link to a dozen or so alumni of the last company I worked for, AND to the current CEO of the company, too.

    Wonderful message. At 'our peak,' that's what we were about. Then things went to shit.
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  • Posted by $ blarman 6 years, 3 months ago
    I would bet that something very similar played out in the halls of Hewlett-Packard when Carly Fiorina proposed the merger with Compaq - only there weren't enough left in the boardroom to side with the Hewlett and Packard families to return them to building quality products. It was also the last time in which either the Hewlett or Packard families held stock in the company they had once founded.
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    • Posted by plusaf 6 years, 3 months ago
      See my comment below and guess which CEO I forwarded the link to... yes, Meg Whitman...

      But the problems started a bit before Carly, if you were there to see it in the late '70s...
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      • Posted by $ blarman 6 years, 3 months ago
        Oh, I saw it. My Dad started working there just as Lew Platt took over and began the slow spiral. He worked there for 22 years, during which we saw HP's gradual decent from pioneering tech company to consumer goods manufacturer. All along the way came the undermining of the HP Way - which ironically people began posting at different points around the company!

        You know your company is in trouble when you have to start posting your own motto. It is an indication that upper management itself isn't living or hiring those who adhere to it.
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        • Posted by plusaf 6 years, 3 months ago
          Lots of truth there, B, but just before HP hired me and moved me from NJ to CA in '78, a friend of mine who'd sat across the aisle at our 'previous employer' wrote me about John Young, whom I met personally just a week or two after reaching HP...

          "He's a Numbers Man... beware! On one of the last corporate profit-sharing announcements, Young referred to a forecast of "Next Quarter's Growth..." TO TWO DECIMAL PLACES. Any CEO who forecasts future growth to two decimal places will inevitably create an environment where management does EXACTLY what 'upper management' expects of them...

          "Make the numbers at any cost."

          And I personally believe the downward spiral started there. Lew was a fine gentlemen, rest his soul... but he DID miss the implications of the www on HP's future, although he was a strong advocate for women's and minority rights and advancement, which may have been another way of shifting HP's focus away from innovation and industrial contribution, which tend to affect a company's success even more directly, sometimes.

          Still breaks my heart to see what happened before and after I left in '02. 24 years before the mast and scores of war stories to tell...
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          • Posted by $ blarman 6 years, 3 months ago
            Yup. I think one of the biggest signs was the demise of the DMD - and my father was right in the middle of that. You probably heard of a little thing called the Kittyhawk drive. My dad was the project manager. He saw the signs right before the collapse of DMD and transferred out, but that just got him a couple more years. He got tossed as part of the "old guard" at Carly's first 10K layoff-fest.
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            • Posted by plusaf 6 years, 3 months ago
              I might still have a few of the Kittyhawk Post-Its from that era. I was skeptical of it at the time, as I didn't think HP had any special differentiating technology that could put us in The Lead in that part of the technological world for any worthwhile duration. Some things just don't work out. I had a semi-log graph of disk data capacity versus years, and no one vendor was always in the lead.

              Oh, and another historical footnote... I was hired by HP to be Product Marketing Engineer for Power MOSFETs. We couldn't make them. Their characteristics, as the 'factory' tried over and over to manufacture them... weren't stable enough to be viable in the marketplace. Eventually, I got the reputation as a pariah because 'I'd not written the specs right.' My boss's boss offered me two months to find another position inside or outside HP before he would fire me. I switched to Terminals (DTD) until they moved out of Silicon Valley. That allowed me to be a Priority Hire, since forcing an employee to move wasn't the kind of slavery HP practiced, at least back then... so I found my way into DSD and another twenty or so years' career in minicomputers, where I had some moderate success and contribution.

              Two ironies: First, one of my mentors at RCA invented a Bi-CMOS chip design which essentially obsoleted anything HP could have made as a MOSFET, and second, which really makes me laugh... The manager who would have fired me was in a customer presentation where I was scheduled to also speak.

              The first presenter blew his presentation and literally alienated and pissed off the customer's people in attendance.

              I suggested that I might be able to pull their cherries out of the fire if I were allowed to be the next speaker. Sales management agreed, and I literally turned the meeting (and customer) around.

              The irony? Who was the Sales manager in the room? Yep, the guy who was going to fire me. You can imagine the smile on my face and the thoughts behind it when he came over to shake my hand and thank me. "You're welcome," I replied and caught the next plane home.

              Yep, LOTS of HP memories...
              My wife took the early-out in '00 and I became eligible in '02, and I've been living in my own little Galt's Gulch ever since. Best wishes to your dad.
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  • Posted by Herb7734 6 years, 3 months ago
    What a great memory. A movie about ethics. Inspiration to have pride in your work. I had almost forgotten how uplifting movies can be, when they are not dealing with comic book characters.
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  • Posted by wiggys 6 years, 3 months ago
    people who stand proud of what they have created are shunned by their own industries when they voice their pride in that accomplishment. AR explained that phenomenon very clearly a multitude of times. it is mediocrity that is admired.
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