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School shooting. Is it time for armed security on all campuses?

Posted by LetsShrug 12 years, 4 months ago to News
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The school shooting at an elementary school in CT yesterday is particularly unsettling to me, as I work at an elementary school and most of my day is spent in the Kindergarten classrooms working with 5 and 6 years olds. I am not, however, one of those who are saying that something like this happening is "unfathomable". I'm probably viewed as being a little on the paranoid side among my peers because I always jump to the extreme when anything seems a little off kilter.

For example, a few weeks ago I heard office staff talking on the radio that the overhead system (speakers) weren't working for some reason and I immediately grabbed a few extra radios and passed them out to teachers saying, "keep this on your person until the overhead gets fixed", some looked at me perplexed until I explained, "What if somebody's tampered with our speaker system? If something crazy happens we won't be able to communicate...call me nuts I don't care just take a friggin' radio!" I got different reactions from them. Some were surprised with my train of thought and others were appreciative of my preparedness. The speaker system was quickly fixed and all was well.

Maybe I am being extreme, but when I see kids on the playground, or sitting in a classroom, it has crossed my mind that 'if some lunatic wanted to cause chaos here it could be easily done', but let's face it because it's true...as we have just seen, once again. I was at a Christmas dinner last night with my book club friends (almost all teachers) and eventually the school shooting topic did come up, although we had vowed to avoid it for the evening because it is so upsetting. We didn't talk about it for too long, but we quickly came to the conclusion that there is no real way to make a school "totally secure" from an intruder if someone is so inclined to intrude.

Sure, there are certain "security" measures in place, enforcing them is a priority, keeping the kids safe at all times is paramount (even to the extreme of not letting children 'chase' each other on the playground to avoid injuries...and I could write a book about all the bloody noses and head lumps that result from this practically daily because enforcing the "no chasing" rule on a playground with 90 kindergartners is just as difficult as maintaining a "secure school"...you do your best, but if they're inclined to chase, they're going to chase...they're 5 year olds and that's what they want to do).

I've been thinking about school security a lot this morning, watching the news etc. and the topic of having an armed security officer/cop on every campus has been brought up. (Gun control has also been brought up, but being a gun enthusiast and freedom lover and a believer in having a right to defend myself and my family I do not believe that adding more gun laws to the books will do a damned thing to stop lunacy.) So I'm wondering... is it time to privatize schools and add an armed officer to each campus? Or should some charter schools pop up offering this service on campus, giving parents a choice of sending their children to schools where they think their kids will be as safe as possible?

Sure, some parents would opt to not have their kids attend a school where there is a gun present ANY where on campus, even if it's holstered on a hip of a trained law enforcement officer and that's their choice to do so, but is it time to do this? Would public schools ever offer this? (I'm sure the unions would love it as they could collect union dues from an officer too), but it would work against their current gun control agenda so I'm not so sure really.

What say you?


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  • Posted by khalling 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    good point. they are always carying bags made from 3 world countries and fanny packs to pull those terms out of. I always have to check myself when they stick their hands into those bags. You never know what flyer is going to come out of there you have to throw away
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  • Posted by 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The dems are toting "common sense" and "reasonable" gun law changes so those terms mean different things to different people...but boy they sure do sound good and fair, don't they?
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  • Posted by khalling 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    you're the one in hall all intense over a badge less person. :) there's a bit of the non rule follower in me and so I may have torn off my paper badge just to annoy you. It's not all that reasonable, but rules mostly annoy me. I think the radio deal is a much better answer. because if you started talking into a radio, I would have pulled the badge out of my pocket and tried to slap it back on.
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  • Posted by khalling 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Up at the top of the page to the right you will see an electronic button for "submit post." Click it and it will open a new window that lets you choose your own title for the post, a box to insert the url and a notes section. You can post the url and then in notes tell us something about the link, or the topic you'd like to discuss regarding the link, etc. It's how we get new stuff in here to talk about, debate etc.
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  • Posted by Eudaimonia 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    @Non_mooching_artist, you live very close to this as I do.
    And you're right, it is very surreal.
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  • Posted by Sophist 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Not sure how any of that works. I initially just wanted to put in my 2 cents worth about the shooting and gun control. Personally I always opt for common sense, but it seems that people are reacting and not thinking and that concerns me.
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  • Posted by 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    It was TOTALLY creepy. I could NOT believe it. I have yet to hear what any of the parents said, but I've heard from a couple of people that they heard from friends/family in other States that they saw our school on CNN so they aired something. I mostly just wanted to know who said what so I know where they stand, (just for kicks I guess) but oh well. (And yes, you sign a book and slap on a paper badge...makes everything safe and cozy....like magic.) I'm ALL for vigilance...lol "take a friggin' radio!"
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  • Posted by khalling 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Sophist, excellent post! You should consider re-posting the link with and set up a discussion. very interesting.
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  • Posted by Sophist 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    While freedom of press is a constitutional right, there has to be some limit placed on how long the media can beat a dead horse. Lately every horse they have pursued has ended up soup, and frankly I think there is more motivation in one up man ship of the last gruesome event that motivates these wing nuts.

    The price of safety and security is indeed vigilance. But we are also tasked as parents with teaching them the realities of the world and how to cope when we're not there. I am always impressed by the kid who climbs in the closet and acts like a pair of shoes. I am impressed because to do that the kid must have some guts and some presence of mind and that will almost always be an asset in a difficult situation.

    The mind is a resource of undefined dimension, so I offer this simply as a reference of how we sometimes react and why.

    http://www.committeeforfirstprinciples.o...
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  • Posted by khalling 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    it's kinda creepy that the CNN truck picked your school to hang out at. We always had to sign in AND wear some badge/nametag if we were in the school. Our schools were more vigilant than most because of Columbine and then later 9/11. Our district was smack in the middle between NORAD and a large military base. When the bubble of false security is popped, it really is a good time to reassess procedures and training inside schools and other vulnerable locations. As long as everyone is rational with rule changes, etc. Over time the bubble will slowly develop again. You have to stay vigilant.
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  • Posted by 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Not letting parents come and go as they please (pretty much) will be a sticky wicket although I agree that it would be a good safety measure. Yesterday, when I went to work (I go in earlier than most) I was greeted with a CNN satellite truck parked in front of the school, and there was a camera crew setting up lights and cameras and light reflectors on the edge of the parking lot etc. I was immediately annoyed and when I went into the office I said, "Do they have permission to be here??" And the secretary said, "Yes." I said, "I think there are going to be some angry parents over this." The secretary said that they couldn't refuse them coming, or that they didn't have a choice in it or something like that. (Later when I thought about it it only made me more mad. WHO can't refuse a camera crew showing up at an elementary school? WHO thinks this is an okay idea? Small children don't need an added disturbance to their day after something like this happens.) There was an announcement made about the camera crew not being allowed to film children and that they were only there to talk to parents about their opinions on gun laws. AS IF that's some justifiable reason. Needless to say, I was the only employee alarmed by this (that I'm aware of). Parents actually stopped and talked to them too which is even MORE perplexing to me. I feel like I'm the only one who cares or notices or is bothered by these things. That crew was there ALL DAY... 12 hours in fact. Okay, back to my point... at some point during the day I heard 2 co workers talking about how parents will probably be more willing to sign the sign-in book at the front desk before they go into the school now (apparently there's a few parents who are annoyed by having to do this).. and I almost laughed out loud because just about anybody can sign that book and get into the school. And even if we "KNOW" the parent doesn't mean some wacked out parent some day won't gain access by signing the book only to go in and cause mayhem. A sign in book is making the school feel secure???? So what I've learned from this is that people do not understand what real security means. And that too many people are so vain they'll talk to a news camera about gun issues in front of their kids' school hoping to see their mugs on national t.v. It's no wonder this country is in the toilet.
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  • Posted by Sophist 12 years, 4 months ago
    Two things seem to be predominant in the way these kind of events play out and the way they end. They will almost always take place at a place of least resistance where there are no guns present or allowed so as to enable the shooter and grant them some level of safety. The second is that usually when confronted by a gun they either surrender or more often kill themselves, and this in my mind constitutes a finite level of gun control.

    You cannot usually tell who the crazy person is until they do something crazy, and subjective views of family usually fail to give society the true view of what might or might not be dangerous.

    Do guns belong in schools? Yes, in the hands of competent individuals trained for this kind of events. At the same time access within school grounds should also be restricted. The more trouble it is to get somewhere the less likely people are to go. Criminals and crazies have even less patience and give up quicker. At the same time video and electronic countermeasures should also be employed so that employees can see what is happening outside at a distance and warn security should there be a suspicious lurker.

    In the end to keep anything or anyone safe you must defend it. You defend with knowledge, training, and practice. My daughter has been exposed to 3 incidents where MS13 wanted to shoot up her school. Early on she had a phone and we had a plan. She performed a basic escape and evade, I met her, and took her home. And yes, I was armed.
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  • Posted by Non_mooching_artist 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    It is very surreal. The first funerals were yesterday... I don't know how much more grief those people can go through. I almost feel guilty for being worried about my living children, when so many have lost theirs.
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  • Posted by khalling 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    We can't imagine what those families are going through unless we have been through it ourselves or know those who have gone through it. But often, one doesn't realize the life changing that happens to of course that community but also communities nearby. Colorado has had too many, but we lived not far from Columbine and I know so many people who had children in the school, lived in the neighborhood etc. My daughter was 10 years old then and I remember for years after, including my daughter and friends four years later, 8 years later, HS students would travel to Columbine on the anniversary(it's too nice a word for what it commerates) to lay flowers and stuffies and candy and poems and prayers at the school. I know people who were so traumatized by what happened in their neighborhood they moved or changed school districts so they would not have a daily reminder. For those personally affected there is no way to remove constant reliving of the horror. But the reverberation of emotions in communities nearby is also very real and has lasting consequences. In Colorado, we have had 3 (that I can recall) mass shootings in a decade. Luckily, in one instance, the gunman was stopped by an armed off duty security guard , saving scores of lives. To be honest, people forget that heroism, as they remember Columbine and the Aurora theater massacre. I also think about 9-11, and how everything would have been so different if lawful citizens were allowed to have their concealed weapons on board those planes. I bet no one is talking about that on the floor of the House.
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  • Posted by Non_mooching_artist 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I know I just want my kids in my arms right now. I get these little flutters of anxiety, which I've never really experienced, not so frequently at any rate, too often during the day. I can't let my kids see that though.

    It's an interesting correlation between the places with the strictest gun control laws and violent crimes. NYC, Chicago as you mentioned, DL, and DC, which is near where I spent most of my growing up years. Guns can be found by any criminal, without much effort. No background checks there!
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  • Posted by DragonLady 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I can only imagine your anxiety. Our schools here in Chicago (home of draconian gun control laws) are probably the most unsafe place for kids to be. Anyone who thinks any kind of gun control works should come to my city....the only people who have guns are thugs and gang-bangers. We have some of the strictest gun laws in the nation and yet we are among the most violent cities anywhere. Thanks to the 7th Circuit Court of Appeals, this state of affairs may change soon (in spite of Rahm).
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  • Posted by WWJGD 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Well, that just proves what an unfit parent you are.

    I used to take my daughter to go shoot my guns, and now she's married to a cop. So there you have it: GUNS CAUSE CRIME.

    Exiting sarcasm mode now...
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  • Posted by khalling 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Thinking about you and your family. They are debating this on the floor as I write. They should all just go home and be with their families right now. Most of our elected reps and senators are useless or detrimental to our well being anyway
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  • Posted by Non_mooching_artist 12 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    We have taken our son to the shooting range, and he has handled .22 rifles and several pistols. Our daughter's turn is next. They both understand, though, that guns are not ever toys. My son and daughter both have air-soft guns, and adhere to the same strict rules with them as with "live fire" guns. But we, (my husband and I), take time to teach and talk with our kids. They know they can come to us about anything, and talk to us about it, and they have. I think a parent has to do just that. We need to get in their business when required, and give them space, too, but not detach ourselves.
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  • Posted by Non_mooching_artist 12 years, 4 months ago
    Ok, the response I was trying to make on my phone previously didn't quite work out.

    That being said, this happened in the next town over, and to say I'm shattered right now would be a grievous understatement. A friend was one of the first responders, a friend and neighbor knows children who died there. The two schools my kids attend were in lockdown Friday, and my daughter was terribly frightened. There will be police at each school this entire week, and the schools are operating on a high security protocol. Sending them off this morning made me a bit edgy, to say the least.

    In our middle and high school, there is a "resource officer". This is a town police officer, who gets paid out of our school budget. Actually we had to do away with the middle school officer, but will stop in about once per week. The high school officer is there every day. I think it's a great idea. They also wear their sidearm. The kids like and respect these officers, and as a result are open with them, and feel comfortable that they're there. I do too. I have NO issue whatsoever that he or she is armed. What good is it to have an officer there, unarmed, if something ever should happen?

    This is a conundrum that will not be solved overnight. I just hope a knee jerk reaction doesn't pull us down a road of paranoia and over regulation. The guns used were legally obtained by the coward's mother. It's a hideous shame that her son got ahold of them. Criminals will get them illegally, as usual.
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