The Dangerous Safety of College

Posted by CircuitGuy 3 years, 8 months ago to Education
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I first learned about this problem here, a year or two ago. I thought I knew what college was like because I remember going 20 years ago. A lot has changed.
SOURCE URL: https://nyti.ms/2mxOOxf


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  • Posted by $ SarahMontalbano 3 years, 8 months ago
    This is an incredibly relevant and pressing problem for me, as I'm going to head to college in a year. Wherever I go, there will not be as much inquiry and discussion as I would like to be exposed to. My main goals are to learn and research; but equally important is learning how to think and defend arguments, and that requires dissent.

    "The difference between an exchange of ideas and an exchange of blows is self-evident. The line of demarcation between freedom of speech and freedom of action is established by the ban on the initiation of physical force." - From Capitalism, The Unknown Ideal, in the essay "The Cashing In: The Student Rebellion".
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  • Posted by hvance 3 years, 8 months ago
    For me college should be all about learning the subject matter that is offered and research. Unfortunately college has morphed today by a minority of students into students bent on revolution. They neither understand or will subject themselves to fact and history of past failed experiments or successful ones in government and business. We have to remember that the Russian Revolution of 1917 was accomplished by less than 5% of the population. Nazi Germany was likewise taken over by a small minority of Germans. For me most of the blame lies at the feet of the administration of the schools. A student should be quickly shown the door if she/he acts in a less than a polite manner when people come to speak to them. To disagree is American, to shout a person down is to be shown the door. Any rioting whatsoever should be a permanent dismissal from the school. And by the way I think that tenured teachers should be stopped. A teacher is only worthwhile if they actually teach and not try to overthrow the system. If they want to overthrow the system let them enter into elections.
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    • Posted by $ allosaur 3 years, 8 months ago
      Me dino thinks you're on to something. With the plethora of recording devices we have today, trouble-making students can be easily sorted out, identified and expelled.
      To do that, though, you need the right kind of school administrators. So in many cases, methinks me dino be blowing advisory smoke.
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  • Posted by $ Temlakos 3 years, 8 months ago
    The incident in question reminds me of one that happened at Yale University in, I believe, 1978. William Shockley, who once set up a sperm bank for the intellectually gifted, received an invitation to speak. And after students raised an uproar, the administration withdrew the invitation.

    Similarly, an employee of the Ernest and Julio Gallo winery was scheduled to hold a Wine and Cheese Night at one of the residential colleges (Davenport College, for any Elis reading this). Students disrupted the event, even to taking over the piano and banging out some labor-movement marching songs on it. Then the Dean of Davenport arrived and told the guest to leave. He subsequently told the Yale Daily News, "I supported the demonstrators, and would have joined them had I been a student."

    That's what college was like, even in the Ivy League, as long as forty years ago.
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  • Posted by freedomforall 3 years, 8 months ago
    More merde from the NYT.
    2 to 1 the author hasn't read The Bell Curve.
    Instead of any actual first hand analysis, he spews review comments of other biased liberals to justify the reactivity of the equally ignorant demonstrators (and to irrationally convict Murray of a racial bias that he never exhibited.)
    He chides the students for the way they reacted, but can't set an example to be followed.
    He's a liberal. Can't be bothered with reason, ethics, or rational thinking.
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    • Posted by $ MikeMarotta 3 years, 8 months ago
      I have to disagree on all points. First, it was not Frank Bruni's (the author's) purpose to instruct on how to argue, but to warn his fellow liberals against the illiberal religious hatred that the protestors acted out.

      Whether The Bell Curve is entirely correct or entirely wrong or partially one or the other is irrelevant to this discussion.

      Bruni does set an example by writing about this, openly and rationally. Moreover, he cites other exemplars, such as this:
      "It put me in mind of important remarks that the commentator Van Jones, a prominent Democrat, made just six days beforehand at the University of Chicago, where he upbraided students for insisting on being swaddled in Bubble Wrap.

      “I don’t want you to be safe, ideologically,” he told them. “I don’t want you to be safe, emotionally. I want you to be strong. That’s different. I’m not going to pave the jungle for you. Put on some boots, and learn how to deal with adversity.”

      “You are creating a kind of liberalism that the minute it crosses the street into the real world is not just useless, but obnoxious and dangerous,” he added. “I want you to be offended every single day on this campus. I want you to be deeply aggrieved and offended and upset, and then to learn how to speak back. Because that is what we need from you.”
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    • Posted by mccannon01 3 years, 8 months ago
      Spot on, freedomforall. In fact, I'd lay even better odds the author never read "The Bell Curve" and even better odds none of the protesters did, either. I read it back in '95 (it came out in '94) just as all the hooplah and hysteria were leveled at the book's authors (Charles Murray & Richard J. Herrnstein). They were crucified for being messengers of the data, not its creators. I still have it in my home library. Maybe it's time to re-read it and see if any of their predictions are coming true although 23 years probably isn't a long enough time.
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      • Posted by freedomforall 3 years, 8 months ago
        Reviewers all concentrated on a 10 page section and ignored the 900 pages of scholarly work. Disgraceful politically biased reviews that show more about the reviewers ignorance than the authors' work.
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  • Posted by $ Thoritsu 3 years, 8 months ago
    People want simple rules to live by and defend them violently. Previously it was religion. Muslims may still be behaving this way. Now it is this violent progressive, pretend liberalism.

    People like mobs of like-minded people to lose themselves in and avoid the need to think objectively.
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  • Posted by $ MikeMarotta 3 years, 8 months ago
    20 years ago the nation was in a lull... Business was good, jobs paid well. We did suffer down sizing "right sizing" and phony "quality circles" but those were internal. The USA was not involved in a major overseas action. The liberation of Kuwait and the sanctions and No-Fly Zones imposed on Iraq were non-controversial.

    I did try to debate on behalf of Saddam Hussein, a secular socialist in a world of religious fundamentalists, but hardly anyone answered back. Ho-hum.

    For some reason, post-9/11, once the adrenalin euphoria of revenge wore off and the wars wore on, the protestors came out. They went back in when President Obama continued those same wars. Now, they are out again. It is not so much the policies as the party of the President that they dislike.

    I just bought Tyranny: 20 Lessons from the 20th Century by Timothy Snyder. I heard him interviewed on "All Things Considered." The book is all right - I will review it in a couple of days - but I cannot help but asking if he would have written it if Hillary Clinton had been elected.
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    • Posted by 3 years, 8 months ago
      " They went back in when President Obama continued those same wars. Now, they are out again. It is not so much the policies as the party of the President that they dislike."
      Yes. I see that. It's why I ask what's this all about? It seems to happen in people who are not involved in politics and will not be affected by the political parties. The protesting, often in the form of creative shows with puppetry, stopped when President Obama was elected, even though some of the things we were protesting actually increased. I almost thing it's a good thing that President Trump won the Electoral College. He will be less effective at executing the same things that Clinton would have executed, and people will actually protest.
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