Rand vs Heinlein

Posted by Hiraghm 12 years, 5 months ago to Philosophy
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Rand rather hedonistically, and at least to the best of my understanding, asserted that one's own happiness was the highest morality.

Heinlein suggested a different standard of morality in his address to the Naval Academy.

Can the two different views be reconciled?
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  • Posted by LionelHutz 12 years, 5 months ago
    I don't think they can be reconciled, no. One's going to have to decide which viewpoint is superior.

    For me, I came away with a different thought - one that's not really speaking to your point. I think it is tragic that we have so many young people that volunteer themselves into a system that greatly reduces their freedom in the name of protecting the nation...only to have the leaders of that nation totally NOT RESPECT these people and assign them to tasks that often throw their lives away or make them go through life maimed. There is such a thing as honorable patriotism in my book. These people are literally placing their lives in the hands of government leadership that is not even in power at the time they are graduating, saying "we will fight and perhaps die" for the just cause. And then we have these leaders throw these lives away because they need a political distraction, or because they are trying to manipulate world affairs in manners that have nothing to do with safety of the country. How can patriotism survive in this environment? It won't.
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  • Posted by xthinker88 12 years, 2 months ago
    This is an interesting speech. Heinlein himself was an Annapolis grad. It would be interesting to compare/contrast this speech directly with the one that Ayn Rand gave at West Point a year later.

    "In conclusion, allow me to speak in personal terms. This evening means a great deal to me. I feel deeply honored by the opportunity to address you. I can say — not as a patriotic bromide, but with full knowledge of the necessary metaphysical, epistemological, ethical, political and esthetic roots — that the United States of America is the greatest, the noblest and, in its original founding principles, the only moral country in the history of the world. There is a kind of quiet radiance associated in my mind with the name West Point — because you have preserved the spirit of those original founding principles and you are their symbol. There were contradictions and omissions in those principles, and there may be in yours — but I am speaking of the essentials. There may be individuals in your history who did not live up to your highest standards — as there are in every institution — since no institutions and no social system can guarantee the automatic perfection of all its members; this depends on an individual's free will. I am speaking of your standards. You have preserved three qualities of character which were typical at the time of America's birth, but are virtually nonexistent today: earnestness — dedication — a sense of honor. Honor is self-esteem made visible in action.

    You have chosen to risk your lives for the defense of this country. I will not insult you by saying that you are dedicated to selfless service — it is not a virtue in my morality. In my morality, the defense of one's country means that a man is personally unwilling to live as the conquered slave of any enemy, foreign or domestic. This is an enormous virtue. Some of you may not be consciously aware of it. I want to help you to realize it."

    http://fare.tunes.org/liberty/library/pw...

    Of course it goes without saying that West Point is the greater of the two academies (sorry - a little alumni rivalry thing - Go Army! Beat Navy!).
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  • Posted by 12 years, 5 months ago
    I don't understand the posting system. I click on the title of the thread, and I'm taken to the link I attached, rather than to my comment.
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    • Posted by sdesapio 12 years, 5 months ago
      URLs are optional however, if you add a URL you're telling the posting system that this post is a link to an external URL.

      If you'd rather have traffic directed you your "comment" (your post), leave the URL field blank and instead added to your notes.
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    • Posted by ObjectiveAnalyst 12 years, 5 months ago
      Hello Hiraghm,
      That is how it works when you put the URL in the location specified in your original posting. If you wish to find your own comments, or your own submissions, click on your screen name in the upper right corner when you are signed in and a pull down menu of options appears.
      Respectfully,
      O.A.
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