I'm here primarily to learn. Although I don't post much anymore (I'm sorry!), I have been refining my views through the differing positions presented here. The Gulch is also a lifeline on days like today that seem impossible to get through, and a way to make lifelong friends with people that share my values.

I'll second - or third that.

Well, all I can say is welcome aboard.
You have expressed several of the reasons why many of us stay on and enjoy the Gulch.

Unless you consider yourself an expert on the philosophy of Objectivism, you should not defend it to others. You certainly could correct false premises . Or if you really can't help but use Objectivism as part of your defense, you might want to preface it with, "As I understand it" which leaves room for correction if you're off the mark. Further, if you just can't get away from it, I would strongly advise you to use the Ask The Gulch. You'll get lots of advice, but again I would caution you to to be careful as to whose advice you use. You'll probably get a viable consensus.

Ms, Rand was absolute in her dislike of religion, ranking it right up there with Attila and Hitler. If you use Objectivism as a filler where religion becomes too irrational, you are neither a member of that religion, nor an Objectivist. You are a Mugwump. (Mug on one side of the fence, wump on the other.) However, if that suits you, well, it's still pretty much a free country. If I understand your post, I wouldn't claim Objectivism as a religion, if I were you.

I am here to see how those who liked Rand's works use her ideas to confirm their own ideas and in some cases as a replacement bible as a religion for those with a belief in a closed Objectivism, thus for a new god figure.
Like with the Bible, some take the parts of Objectivism that fit their lives and try to rationalize away the rest. Just goes to show that no two humans have the same mental content and must wing it the best they can but will quickly forget rational thought in small ways when the going gets tough.
Like minded here means liking Rand's work with a hope for it someday bringing a more rational future.

But we've been getting a lot of criticism of Obj. on these blogs. Just trying to minimize it.

I am one of the newbies, at least to this particular Objectivist site (though I've lurked near the Gulch since before the first movie came out). My answer would be ALL OF THE ABOVE. I have found that I enjoy listening to the discourse of those who think as I do (ie. In REASON, where people can have discussions without constantly having to battle the trolls). I have blown off steam, I have both laughed and teared up while pondering the state of our country and world, I have both checked and confirmed my premises, and I have identified questions that require further insight and data collection. Even some of the other Randish sites are one sided to the point of closed ears and minds. I come here for a reality check in the midst of chaos and contradictions, and I come here because I am hungry for adult conversation and thought. Thank You All!!

I am intrigued by the idea of hiding in plain sight as in ALONGSIDE NIGHT, where the people just have as little involvement in the collectivist society as practical, trade amongst themselves, quietly bypassing the income and sales taxation (at least to a degree), and enjoying life at least somewhat free of the bureaucracy.

Very well articulated, and I feel exactly the same way.

I am thinking 4 steps ahead of my typing and not paying attention to what my brain is sending to my fingers....It's not absent minded...it's absent brained.

great people like you keep me here, Herb!! -- j
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If I cut out every friend or relative who disagreed with me, I'd have no friends and damn few relatives.As it is, Those who choose to argue with me usually drop out of the Herbie crowd (such as it is) without any encouragement from me. Besides, I know very few who are activists. I must give off some sort of a "tell" that keeps most of them away.

I have to say I was inspired a bit by Trump's win. Maybe all the people here in the USA arent collectivist idiots after all !! Only half of them.

No sites want critics, unless they are criticizing someone else.

Well -- you're not all bad.
You're willing to learn and that's a great function of this site. One even learns when some issue is not settled one way or another.

We can only do what we can to cause the pendulum to start swinging the other way. We know what a "worker's paradise" is in reality. Some people must learn the hard way.

I come here to listen to(read) what reasonable smart people have to say. On the other hand I also go to Facebook to see what idiots have to say.

I love that one! Chicken fat is yucky stuff.

Edification, sanity retention. Reassurance that there are people that see things as they are, and have no use for servitude, or oppression regardless of source. This Gulch has a higher concentration than is found elsewhere. It seems a bonus too that it is, by its nature, a bad choice for trolls.

In this case, the "ulterior" motive might actually be the primary motive. Happy Thanksgiving!

More important than turkey and all the trimmings including pumpkin pie?
If Grandpa Sherman heard you say that, he'd say, "Vat...are you cucu? You need a psycho guy to look inside your head. You know vat he'd find? CHICKEN FAT!
(I once heard him say something like that to some jerk putting down the USA.
I've been waiting years for the opportunity to put that in writing.)

Isn't it, though?

Thank you.
As you discuss and debate, you grow. Even those times when you think the other person is crazy, it becomes a learning experience. Often when newbies attend the Gulch I find expressions that are so awful that I know they won't be here for long once they "get-it.' Yet they illuminate how way off course people can get when trying to grasp even the simplest of concepts. The concept of Altruism, for example seems to drive people utterly bonkers when I express to them my thoughts on it. I mistakenly posted discussing religion and philosophy. Each time I did I would open a jumbo can of worms which pasted over what could be some interesting thoughts.

Most Objectivists that I knew were in Michigan. As I moved around the country after retirement, I would come across a concept, an idea, or something I re-read by Rand and was frustrated that I didn't have anyone but the BW to share them with. Especially during the last ten years or so. I thought I'd need to duct tape my head to keep it from exploding.