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To Shoot Or Not To Shoot, That Is The--Oops, You're Dead

Posted by $ allosaur 7 years, 6 months ago to News
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Please, check out the "Why do Police shoot unarmed citizens?" video included with the article.
Me dino played a "shoot--don't shoot" game with a video as part of my handgun training at the Department of Corrections Academy in Selma, AL, during March-April, 1982.
The video contained all sorts of situations in which a police officer had to decide whether or not to shoot, and my class of 82-2 was told to point a finger and say "bang" when we each felt threatened.
I have a confession. I'm haunted to this day of a grinning young Hispanic guy, who failed to follow the audio of a police officer's instructions. He quickly reached behind his back and began something into sight. I was about the only trainee in the room who barked a "Bang!" before I read a hand-held sign which stated "I AM DEAF."
Unforgettable! He wasn't the first guy I ever shot a finger at, but up to then it had never been the index one.
Deaf Hispanic Lives Matter!
SOURCE URL: http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/09/30/lawyer-officer-shot-terence-crutcher-unaware-backup/


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  • Posted by Riftsrunner 7 years, 6 months ago
    I remember seeing a Reverend from Arizona who was a major leader in a major protest that could be described as a BLM protest (don't remember if this was before or after Ferguson, MI). So the police invited him (and the local channel's news crew) to a live action 'shoot-don't shoot' demonstration. They instructed him in the basics of police procedures in various situations he would encounter and put him in a shock vest. The reporter was also invited to participate in the same scenarios (albeit without seeing what the Reverend results were) to see what his reactions might be. Needless to say both participants had a different understanding of what it entailed to be a police officer and the split second decisions the need to make.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      You are definitely on to something. Maybe cops should set up a huge video screen with shoot-don't shoot video demos on it at BLM protest demonstrations.
      At least those not into looting or being paid by George Soros may go home.
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  • Posted by KRUEG 7 years, 6 months ago
    When you are faced with the unknown your fight or flight response kicks in. This is not a TV show, this is reality. In real life I for one would shoot, if you are stupid enough to make a threatening move or not follow my instructions, GOOD BYE. Hard hearted? No, just looking out for me and mine. I will have PTSD afterward and always question my decision. In areas of high crime, sorry, but my go to response is that you are a bad guy.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      A bad guy could also be just a stupid guy who failed to adapt and so died a death by Darwin.
      Way back during 1982 I heard a shot outside my apartment in the middle of the night and heard someone run by.
      I realized I left my gun in the glove compartment and went outside to fetch it.
      After looking about to make sure no one was around to jump me, I approached my car.
      Seemingly out of nowhere a cop car screeched to a halt and threw a light on me. No one said a word but I could see a huge for a big German shepherd looking out through a wide open window in the backseat of the cop car.
      So dino at the time in his prime widely raised my arms and opened my hands with parted fingers.
      The cop turned off his spotlight and peeled off. No words had been spoken at all.
      I retrieved my gun and got back inside as my apartment as quickly as I could.
      On the other hand I coulda had a big head, shot off my mouth about my rights, how that cop had no right to shine a light on me and went as far as to add, "Now excuse me while I get my gun out!"
      I'm sure that huge for a big German shepherd would have liked the way I taste.
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  • Posted by mminnick 7 years, 6 months ago
    I have a cousin that was a sheriffs deputy for over 30 years. He had to undergo Life and Death situation training every year. They went through the drill for several days. He was a nervous wreck when he finished. He said just knowing how little time it was between Life and Death for you, your partner or the suspect was frightening. The training made you much more aware of the cues you needed to spot, the actions you needed to take and how you had to respond to various situations.
    I was almost literally the way it is stated in the title of this post "To Shot or Not to Shoot.." In the time it takes to say those workd in you mind, someone could be dead from a bullet .
    Think about it. The police and the suspect have less than a second to make a decision, act and live or die.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      I was once a police beat newspaper reporter during the 70s but never had any desire to be a street cop or a sheriff's deputy.
      The Alabama Department of Corrections Academy and not the pistol qualification of annual training dealt with that "shoot or not shoot" training I described.
      I wore a holstered pistol far more as a semiretired security guard for three different companies.
      The training for each? A joke.
      I was a bank guard here and there several times.
      Imagine a bank guard whose experience is limited to a joke for training.
      It's a reason why I conceal carry in "professionally guarded" gun free zones.
      My favorite armed job was working at a Wachovia data center. Part of a foot patrol was walking among rows and rows of servers in a huge chamber for a room.
      When catching gate duty, I got to see deer, turkeys and even coyotes walking by. One time I exchanged waves with someone who floated past overhead in a hot air balloon.
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  • Posted by $ Radio_Randy 7 years, 6 months ago
    I took the same training scenario and, also, shot the deaf guy.

    To this day, I've never regretted my decision to shoot. It was a "clean" shoot...just in the way a number of highly politicized shootings have been "clean" shoots.

    If a guy points an object at you, holding it like a gun, and repeatedly refuses to follow your commands...what choice do you have?

    I, honestly, believe some of these shootings have been staged by the BLM folks and the Obama administration. Just like a school shooting, decades ago, where a guy opened up with an AK47 clone, just as Congress was looking at a number of anti-gun bills. How coincidental is that? Oh, and I believe the Gun Control Act of 1986 followed that shooting.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      Dang if my dangerous dino imagination ain't just come up with a short story.
      A lonely black guy with an inferiority complex decides to end it all.
      But what a boost to the ego to die suicide by cop in some place like Ferguson.
      Charging the cop, he may proclaim, "They'll be shouting name!"
      Dunno who buys short stories any more.
      Maybe a poem put to music, but I can't read music.
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  • Posted by Owlsrayne 7 years, 6 months ago
    Excellent video. As a Conceal Carry Permit holder here in Az., video like this should be shown in permit training classes. I did participate with the video and realized how difficult the decision process is with-in the second or two in that situation.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      That deaf Hispanic I only said "bang" at still haunts me for some reason, and I never had to shoot anyone.
      Came close a couple of times when I was on a prison guard tower.
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  • Posted by Herb7734 7 years, 6 months ago
    I don't know how many in the Gulch have actually been confronted with the possibility of violent death. It is true that when flight is not an option, then the fight instinct takes over and the senses narrow down to survival which demands quick action. Hamlet had time to think it over, a cop, a soldier, or anyone in that situation, doesn't.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      I had one of those back in the 70s when I was a newspaper reporter for 7 years. My response?
      It took me two weeks to buy my first handgun, an H&K .380 pocket pistol, due to a longer waiting period back then. (Now in Alabama? One hour).
      A short time later I had the .45 Colt the Marines taught me how to shoot. Now I keep a large 9mm with lots of shots ion my glove compartment.
      I've had a gun of some sort ever since that scary day. I have traded 'em in like cars at gun shops.
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      • Posted by Herb7734 7 years, 6 months ago
        I have had guns since '69. Each one is different and requires practice. Due to arthritis and neuropathy in my hands I only use revolvers.
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        • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
          Besides three semiautomatics, the only revolver I have is a 357 hidden in my living-room couch.
          Hey, bad guy--
          Surprise!
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          • Posted by Herb7734 7 years, 6 months ago
            I have a 2" barrel 38 for the BW and a custom 357 that I bought used. Someone had lavished a lot of love on it. It has a shiny patent leather-like black finish with matte black grips and the smoothest action I ever felt.
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            • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
              My S&W 357 has a 4" barrel and a real comfortable rubber grip. It's a couple of months brand new and I've fired it only once at my favorite indoor range.
              At first I fired 38s to get a general feel for the trigger pull both single and double action..
              Firing 357 Magnum rounds was a rush. Yelled "Whoo!" two or three times.
              At home its loaded with 357s, of course.
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              • Posted by Herb7734 7 years, 6 months ago
                Mine's also a 4 incher. Not as much kick as I imagined it would have. Not bad accuracy, although I probably won't be shooting at anything further than 10 feet.
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                • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
                  That's the idea behind my big boom surprise concealed couch gun should I ever have to use it.
                  Certain my ears would whine for a short bit.
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                  • Posted by Herb7734 7 years, 6 months ago
                    I'll have to remember to take out my hearing aid.
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                    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
                      Take out some more life insurance if you want to invade my house.
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                      • Posted by Herb7734 7 years, 6 months ago
                        Ha!
                        Even Colonial Penn Life won't issue life insurance to me. Besides, even if I succeeded in the invasion, establishing a new address is too much trouble for this geezer.
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                        • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
                          LOL! Colonial Penn is my me dino 5 years older than you primary life insurance.
                          I even had it updated a couple of years ago.
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                          • Posted by Herb7734 7 years, 6 months ago
                            Five years older than me? You're 87? Holy crap! Lie down, rest, can I get you a glass of water?
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                            • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
                              Whoa! Whoa! Just realized I got you mixed up with Olduglycarl.
                              He! He! He! Yes, I got you mixed up with Olduglycarl. Ha! Ha! Ha!
                              Yes, it's Olduglycarl I mistook you for. Ho! Ho! Ho!
                              That is to laugh at long and hard throughout this day and up until I go to sleep tonight.
                              Me dino got Herb7734 mixed up with Olduglycarl!
                              Ha! Ha! Ho! Ho! That is so funny!
                              I'm 70 this coming March.
                              So you're 82.
                              So you need that glass of water more than I do.
                              Ah, hahahahaha!
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                              • Posted by Herb7734 7 years, 6 months ago
                                You bet. I'm old and decrepit, practically nothing of my body works except my brain, which is my 2nd favorite organ, as Woody Allen puts it. But, Old Ug, shouldn't mind the error, because if he's younger than you, he should be good. I remember when I was just a kid like him.
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  • Posted by preimert1 7 years, 6 months ago
    I remember reading about a police shooting here in
    LA some years back where LAPD responded to a 911 call about a robbery in progress and when the young latino who had called it in stepped out of the phone booth to greet them, he was immediately shot by a rookie cop. The report sayed that "the officer feared for his life."
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      An armed robbery happened 20 years ago at a credit union where I've been a customer even 5 years longer than that.
      The robbers left just before the police arrived.
      As the police entered, the black bank manager hops out of his office door, swinging a shotgun about.
      Heard that the way the police mowed him down looked like a very noisy scene from The Untouchables TV show of the 60s.
      Folks, when the police arrive due to your 911 call, you best be in plain sight, unarmed and with your hands up. Follow any and all instructions.
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  • Posted by DrZarkov99 7 years, 6 months ago
    Crutcher was a very large man exhibiting classic signs of being under the effects of PCP, which Officer Shelby had been trained to recognize. PCP users can become extremely violent, and often continue violent actions in spite of multiple gunshot wounds, so she had to assume she could be subject to a possibly fatal attack. Crutcher did have a history of PCP addiction, and the drug was found in his truck.

    What hasn't been well reported is the fact that Shelby had been trying to deal with Crutcher as peaceably as possible for some minutes, but he was ignoring her direction and moving toward her and backing away several times. Adrenalin had to be a factor, given she was dealing with a possible threat to her life. The result was no surprise.

    Monday morning quarterbacking journalists and "race baiting poverty pimps" (to use the J.C. Watts description) have no concept of what it's like to be in a position of making a live or die decision under intense pressure.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      The drive-by media, as Rush calls them, does not give a damn about the guilt or innocence of Officer Shelby or what Crutcher's antics put her through before she felt like her own life depended on pulling that trigger.
      Me dino has seen her photo. Yeah, every day she gets up wanting to shoot some black person for being born black because she's a cop. NOT!
      That thinking is not at all logical.
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  • Posted by $ blarman 7 years, 6 months ago
    And this is why as a citizen you don't do stupid things like ignore the police or point things at them! Acknowledge they are there and calmly and slowly talk with them. Don't give them a reason to do something you will both likely regret. They are just as human and mistake prone as you are - they just have greater responsibility.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      Just be polite and let a nervous cop see a pair of empty hands. You don't have to hold them "hands up, don't shoot" over your head unless the cop told me to and then I'd do it. Get on the ground? "Yes, sir. I won't give you any trouble."
      If you're suspected of something, why make things worse? Especially if you know you're innocent! Better to go through the process than to star at your own funeral.
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  • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 7 years, 6 months ago
    I could not shoot in time before I could identify the gun...in one instance it was a draw...both of us would have been dead.
    and then...I shot the guy when he pulled out the phone.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      You vicious killer! Here comes all of paid for by George Soros WLM out of towner punk thugs to burn down and loot the the municipality where you committed your planned out cold-blooded murder with extreme prejudice.



      chirp chirp chirp



      I said, here comes WLM to--RAISE ALL KINDSA HELLLll



      chirp chirp chirp



      WLM? WLM?



      chirp chirp chirp




      Oh, yeah, WLM ain't being paid by George Soros. Never mind.
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  • Posted by $ jdg 7 years, 6 months ago
    Sometimes you have to guess. But I don't consider that that excuses cops who would shoot the deaf guy -- even though in his shoes I would try to take the sign out more slowly.

    Cops are the aggressors too much of the time to be entitled to benefit of the doubt. They're supposed to be giving that benefit, not getting it.
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  • Posted by starznbarz 7 years, 6 months ago
    Been shot at and missed and shot at and hit, missed is better - but not by much. LEOs are held to a higher standard and rightfully so, given the level of training. Ive always considered hesitation to be a potentially deadly sin.
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    • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
      I'm a Pisces but I don't talk about it here or anywhere else.
      Though I'm a dictionary definition mystic that begins with a "C" (Eek! Eek!), I decided to shun astrology as bogus a long time ago.
      Even after I put my three-clawed foot down about that, me dino read somewhere that the configuration of stars aren't even in the right places any more.
      Sorry to learn you got shot.
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      • Posted by starznbarz 7 years, 6 months ago
        Whooda thunk you was a "c" er... what 6 numbers do you feel good about?
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        • Posted by $ 7 years, 6 months ago
          Me dino not into numerology either.
          But I will miss 6 when I reach 70 March next year.
          Who the hell wants to be 70?"
          Like being 6, 16, 26 and even 36.
          After those oh Lordy you're 40 birthday cards, I began to dislike birthdays with any numbers.
          Young dino used to like Route 66.
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yr9nm...
          My mother hated the show's music, and that's even before she became a Catholic church choir leader.
          Me dino was raised a cc but became a cp. (Eek! Eek!)
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