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  • Posted by Wanderer 5 years, 11 months ago
    Yes and, it worked. He's now purging secular teachers and professors from the schools and universities. He is an Islamic supremacist and he is executing his plan (in addition, probably, to his enemies).
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    • Posted by 5 years, 11 months ago
      it was probably another situation like the youth
      up-rising in Iran where we should have pushed it
      to success ... but didn't. -- j
      .
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      • Posted by Wanderer 5 years, 11 months ago
        Actually, two uprisings in Iran. We carefully let them down twice.

        We've supported the overthrow of every secular dictator in the Arab world and refused to support the overthrow of any religious dictators.

        I don't know whether we had any part in what's happened in Turkey but, if we did, obviously we were on Erdogan's side.
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  • Posted by $ allosaur 5 years, 11 months ago
    My married to the internet grown son was the first person to fill my ears about Erdogan staging the coup.
    If that is true, I'm wondering how Erdogan managed to push the right buttons to cause his military's leadership to rise up against him.
    You know you have a power mad dictator when you cannot even crack a joke about him without the thought police knocking at you door.
    Methinks Erdogan is staking out his seat of power for the radical Muslium dream of worldwide caliphate.
    In other words, Erdogan is our enemy. O may like Turkish him but I consider The Him to be the enemy too..
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  • Posted by Government 5 years, 11 months ago
    4chan says it was staged.
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    • Posted by 5 years, 11 months ago
      thanks for the clue -- I hadn't heard of 4chan, but
      looked it up and learned something. . the gulch is
      the only "blog" which I tend to visit, so I don't
      get out much. . thanks again! -- j
      .
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      • Posted by Government 5 years, 11 months ago
        4chan and 8chan are the websites from which the "Anonymous" movement was founded and aere the home to MANY Nazis and Communists. These websites are the notorious part of the internet, where people are openly racist and have the ability to enjoy complete freedom of speech. Although these have degraded in the past year with Donald Trump's presidency run (ever wonder where all the Trump memes and supporters on the internet come from? 4chan and 8cahn view his presidency as the birth of a new National Socialist movement).

        They are excellent sources of information, thouhg, and break news often hours before it is officially reported because the anonymous users (anons) living in those countries often post about it. Also a great place to find secluded but important news, if you can ignore most of the posters.

        http://boards.4chan.org/pol/catalog
        https://8chan.net/pol/catalog.html
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  • Posted by $ jlc 5 years, 11 months ago
    It is not our business to support or overthrow the leaders of a foreign country; we are not the world's police. It is quite possible the Erdogan staged the coup himself, but Occam's Razor says that it is more likely that disaffected officers (perhaps influenced by Gulan's moderate philosophy, but not necessarily directed by him) attempted it on their own.

    Gulen is legitimately present in the US and we should not extradite him unless Turkey can prove criminal involvement. We are not pawns of Turkey.

    Jan
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    • Posted by MinorLiberator 5 years, 11 months ago
      I totally agree about Gulan...but if I were him I'd go into hiding and hope Hillary isn't elected...both she and Obama would throw anyone under the bus...per an earlier comment, IMO it was staged...
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      • Posted by $ jlc 5 years, 11 months ago
        Chang Kai-shek came to prominence in China after Sun Yat-sen's death as a result of being kidnapped and held hostage in a cave by bandits for a couple of weeks. (It did not hurt that he was also Sun Yat-sen's close friend and married to his wife's little sister.) People who were knowledgeable about that situation have suggested that Kai-shek hired the kidnappers.

        So, this sort of thing has happened before and it is certainly not beyond conception that it occurred in Turkey.

        Jan
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    • Posted by 5 years, 11 months ago
      my speculation is facetious -- like "shouldn't we
      repeal newton's first law?" or some such. . the u.s.
      has taken to meddling in other nations' affairs so
      commonly, lately, that it's de rigueur anymore. -- j
      .
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  • Posted by peterchunt 5 years, 11 months ago
    I think he looked toward Venezuela and the attempted coup on Chavez. The failure resulted in Chavez cementing his power, and to this day the majority still can’t rid themselves of this corrupt government which has the support of the armed forces.
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    • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 5 years, 11 months ago
      Autocrats always have the support of their security forces or they don't stay autocrats for long.That includes the civilian types such as FBI, Secret Service, the entire DHS, AND the military. One reason why in any dictatorship you find those agenceis or departments are paid, first, on time, and well.

      Obama tried to circumvent that hard and fast rule but in circle filing the Constitution ran into the one cold hard fact of life in the USA his counterparts in other countries don't have to deal with. Here the military takes the oath to the Constitution and only the Constitution. People, citizens, country, flags, aren't included.

      Now they may not have decided to up hold that oath insofar as preserve, protect, defend the Constitution but they still didn't take an oath to the President.

      Obama in ihis arrogance has decided to diss them anyway. as well as cut their ranks, their pay, their retirement and instead beef up the DHS or to be more accurate the Directorate of Internal Security publicly stating he wanted it equal to or greater than in power as the DoD.

      At some point the military takes the abuse and gives in or they uphold their oath of office and act to bring the country back under the Consitution. To uiphold their oath of office or not uphold it. If they do it's a legal and required counter revolution. If they don't it's over except a new flag, national name, etc. and for them a new oath of office but still second fiddle to DIS.

      Be interesting to watch and try to fathom and divine the reasons for acting or not acting.

      Be interesting to see how Trump will act to take advantage of the situation. He is after all left wing in the sense of government over citizens and solidifying the support of the military would correct the error made by Obeyme.

      Clear signals will be what of "Obama's executive orders are rescinded and who besides Kerry, Lynch, Coney, and the Sec Def are unemployed by days end on Jan 20th.Or something as simple as asking Congress for a 3% instead of a 1 point whatever percent pay increase for DoD.

      Hillary gets in it will be a tossup as she too is big time arrogant and does not like the military and for the same reasons. They hold that axe over her head in the Oath of Office - 'Again it would not be a coup but a counter revolution requiring a returnj to Constitutional Republic status.

      If that step is taken It only takes a conversation with the Pro Tempore, the Speaker, the Chief Justice, and a protective cordon around the White House to keep the SS happy. Congress gets read the riot act and told you can have the country back when you get Constitutional again.

      On the other thand they may decide to keep it for a while. That's the chance you take when you diss the powers that keep you in office. I doubt iyou will find many veterans and active military objecting especially with the race card removed and the paycheck card put in it's place. Personally I have a brand new US Flag and all sail boats come with a place to fly it.

      So Constitutional Republic or Socialist Democracy? Let's see if Trump puts out any signals before the convention ends. Hillary is already in cement for following the footsteps of Lenin and Soros..
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  • Posted by Bethesda-gal 5 years, 11 months ago
    I'm still very confused about what "really" happened. Gulen, Erdogan's former friend, is an Islamic extremist with schools across the U.S. and around the world. So why would Erdogan 'blame' the coup on him if they're both Islamic extremists? Center for Security Policy website has a lot of information on the Gulen movement, I believe under the 'publications' tab.
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  • Posted by Herb7734 5 years, 11 months ago
    When we laid down with dogs, hold it!
    Make that weasels, we should have checked them for fleas. (I love dogs). I understand that the excuse is "the enemy of my enemy is my friend." But is it worth it? It seems to me that we should keep our military so strong that only an idiotic madman would challenge us. That giving our clandestine operatives as much leeway as they need to keep us safe. Make the penalties for harming Americans by anyone so severe that it brings fear to those who would do so. Then, you won't need the weasels.
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  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 5 years, 11 months ago
    Not if you are true to your fascist nature and realize today's unarmed soldier is tomorrows fully armed warrior. One takes care of his security forces takes care of his opponents.

    Obama cut the military whose oath was to the Constitution not to him but beefed up the power of the protective echelon the schutz staffel. If you are what you are it's the prudent thing to do lest the Eagles cross the Potamacan and enter the city.

    All left wing socialist fascist autocrats and their totalitarian philosophy states Erdogan was following his play book. The advantage is he doesn't give two damns and a hiccup about media nor public opinion they can be sent the wall with as much ease and as much disdain.

    Don't see Erdogan. See the future. Under slightly different circumstances Obama would do exactly the same thing.
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  • Posted by MinorLiberator 5 years, 11 months ago
    IMO opinion, yes. Based on what he's done since, day by day. As one article put it: it's the "real" new caliphate, with Erdogan eventually as "sultan". And a few observations from an earlier article: the Turks have a history of successful coups, yet there were no earmarks of a serious coup, e.g., seizing politicians, taking over all the media (the brief takeovers of a few outlets is more evidence of it being staged than real). Erdogan's miraculous reappearance at the airport, the crowds and immediate "press conference"...stinks to me...
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