Are Changes Coming For Rifle And Shotgun Purchases?

Posted by  $  Olduglycarl 1 year, 9 months ago to Legislation
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Ok...what would the "objectivist" say...

I say that any individual that has consistently exhibited poor or criminal behavior, is on psychotropic drugs (under the care of a physiologist) or comes from or associates with pagan barbaric religious groups-(muslims) should not have guns.

But...to give the AMA any of this power or rely upon their say so...NO! after all, these are the creatures that have brought you the "Sickness Symptom Careless System".
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  • Posted by EdGoldstein 1 year, 9 months ago
    There should be no limit on weapon ownership. An armed society is a free society. The problem is weapons training is not required in school. Every American should be as familiar with weapons as they are with driving. The attacker will always find a weapon with which to kill. Only an armed person can protect themselves and others.
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    • Posted by ChuckyBob 1 year, 9 months ago
      Agreed, my Dad grew up around guns in Utah. Then spent some time in both the navy and the army. So, growing up I was tought to respect guns and how to properly handle them. I had to take a hunter's safety course to get a hunting license in the PRC, which was a TOTAL waste of time. I aced the test and could have aced it prior to taking the course. Most kids nowadays only know the misinformation they learn playing Call of Duty.
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    • Posted by wiggys 1 year, 9 months ago
      those who want gun control will not stop at the changes for long guns. changes will come to all guns and it will happen faster than you think since some republicans have stepped on board the confiscation train.
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  • Posted by freedomforall 1 year, 9 months ago
    The AMA is a destructive anti-competitive, anti- patient organization. They have been suppressing all except traditional pharma treatments for 100 years. Seein them support other anti-freedom measures is no surprise.
    We'd all be better off if the AMA was dissolved.
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    • Posted by Wanderer 1 year, 9 months ago
      In a vat of hydrochloric acid...Muhahaha!

      Actually, I changed doctors because my previous one insisted I live within Obamacare's guidelines, tests, therapies, etc. When he asked if I owned any firearms, that was the end of our relationship.
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      • Posted by  $  allosaur 1 year, 9 months ago
        Note to self: Should a doctor ever ask me if I own firearms, walk out immediately and maybe say something profane about fascists or a particular fascist. .
        Don't think I need to worry about my regular doctor, who I see every four months.
        He once referred to the Obama regime as "people who do not know what they are doing."
        One could argue that the lying control freaks know exactly what they are doing but I let it go.
        I go there to keep my Type 2 Diabetes under control.
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        • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
          I would probably answer the question with No i do not own a firearm but I do have a Sherman tank!
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          • Posted by  $  allosaur 1 year, 9 months ago
            You bought that Sherman you previously wrote about here wanting awful fast--and on the Fourth of July too.
            Some eBay dealer in Sherman tanks must reside in your home town.
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            • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
              hahahah...just a pipe dream...but it would make them think a bit...maybe laugh, make them realize how stupid the question was but make them think twice.
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              • Posted by  $  allosaur 1 year, 9 months ago
                I once shot a shot up tank with a rocket launcher in the Marines.
                A trainer told me not to call it a bazooka but it looked like a bazooka to me.
                I also fired a LAWS but I can't remember what the target was.
                It wasn't a tank because I recall there being only one tank I ever put a whammy on.
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                • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
                  Did the same in Fort Carson...it was literally a BLAST...the tank survived but not completely unscathed.
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                  • Posted by  $  allosaur 1 year, 9 months ago
                    I had my biggest blast behind a M60 machine gun.
                    A cart was the target. All I had to do was aim with the tracers to keep the recoiling bursts on target.
                    This was at Camp Lejeune,
                    It was a heck of a lot more fun than Parris Island for this draftee.
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  • Posted by  $  Thoritsu 1 year, 9 months ago
    AMA is a disgusting, power-hungry institution, contributing to the high cost and limited availability of health care in the US. I think, in terms of damage, the AMA is the worst union in the world.

    Of course they want to enter this fray with the position that "we can help you as the concerned, intelligent professionals...Just give us control."
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  • Posted by  $  Flootus5 1 year, 9 months ago
    When I hear the discussion framed using the words "gun violence", I know that it is already rigged against us. I have never seen a gun shoot another gun.

    The same applies to "assault weapon". They are disingenuously confusing the difference between object and the motive. To illustrate the absurd here, someone should report on a case where an intruder was shot by an AR-15 Home Defense rifle who was wielding an assault baseball bat.
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  • Posted by ChuckyBob 1 year, 9 months ago
    I belong to a group that at various times has had their guns taken by state militia, been denied protection by the federal government when state militias murdered, maimed and stole property, and were under military occupation by the largest pre-Civil War US Army outpost. And some folks wonder why I would rather trust in my own guns rather than the government.
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  • Posted by Herb7734 1 year, 9 months ago
    As with any law, motive is a contributing factor. Rushing a wounded man to a hospital by breaking speed laws may be allowed. But, a man could feign sickness when stopped by a police officer. No law is perfect, and no law is enforceable under all conditions. Passing multiple laws governing any action does nothing more than restrict the freedom of the citizenry. If your Utopia is created by making the citizens obey a lengthy list of rules, then it is not a Utopia, but a bar-less jail.
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    • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
      And the problem is laws made by man: Man made laws are highly prejudicial and punish the many; in favor of a few, because of a few or to simply aggrandize the man that made the law.
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      • Posted by Herb7734 1 year, 9 months ago
        What other laws are there, but man made ones?
        A direct line from God? Here are just a few.
        I can possess slaves as long as they come from neighboring nations.
        (I prefer the Canadian type)
        I can sell my daughter into slavery.
        I'm not allowed in the presence of menstruating women.
        (I already told you about the bull burning)
        Touching the skin of a dead pig is an abomination, which screws up my football playing.
        Must I go on?
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        • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
          Didn't the forefathers try to align their thinking with the laws a of nature...take my stuff and I'll kick you butt...so why would you take my stuff and risk it...maybe they were just stupid. I don't see that as a man made law...it's a response to an observation of nature.
          That is not to say that there should not be any rules...we do need to drive together in opposing directions on opposite sides of the road if you want to live and get where your going. Even nature and the physical laws are constructed that way. Just a couple rules to make sure it all runs smoothly and that doesn't mean we need a rule for everything either, unless no one has common sense...do what ever you will and chaos is the result...it 's your choice. Live or Die...to be or not to be.

          Laughing...With out a mind or at least a blooming connection to one does not qualify a message from beyond whether that be the ether or a pagan god...clearly the laws you state came from a demented pagan, barbaric brain...let them eat bacon...they may get sick but I doubt they'll burn in hell because of it...that silly stuff cracks me up.
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          • Posted by Herb7734 1 year, 9 months ago
            It takes a man to recognize nature. I consider my dog to be intelligent. But she doesn't grasp anything that she must deal with. Hot, cold, light, dark are all the same to her. Out of her control. Nothing in nature from quantum physics to the sunrise means anything at all unless there is conscious reason to observe and deal with it.

            Plus, I don't see why I can't have my own Canadian.
            Also, most men I know get their hair trimmed around their temples where it is expressly forbidden. Can you suggest the best way to kill them?
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  • Posted by Animal 1 year, 9 months ago
    "I say that any individual that has consistently exhibited poor or criminal behavior, is on psychotropic drugs (under the care of a physiologist) or comes from or associates with pagan barbaric religious groups-(muslims) should not have guns."

    What about due process? In the first case, if they have been convicted of a felony, then yes, they should lose their 2nd Amendment rights along with some others (like the franchise.) But where is the due process involved in being under the care of (what I presume you meant to say) a psychologist or psychiatrist, or being a member of some arbitrarily-defined religious group?

    Depriving people of Constitutionally defined rights with no due process will not ever end well. What if a proggie Administration decides that NRA membership constitutes membership in a "dangerous extremist group?" Go to the comments section of any article on gun control and you'll see progtards making exactly that argument.
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    • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
      Nothings perfect...but we attempt to solve the problem, assuming perfect conditions like honesty, competence and reasoned responses. None of what we are experiencing and observing is reasonable or makes any sense what so ever.

      But think of it this way...No sane, healthy or conscious individual ever perpetrated crimes and violence that we see today and yes, everyone has their trigger points...but the one's most vulnerable to committing these act are clearly flawed in some profound way and the circumstances I put forth are the ones, I think, we should consider.
      We can do "What If's" all day long but it ain't gona have any effect upon the problem. I don't think there is a perfect answer here.
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      • Posted by Animal 1 year, 9 months ago
        OK, but you didn't answer my question. Let me rephrase it: The Fifth Amendment states in part that no citizen may "...be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law."

        You are proposing depriving a group of people of a fundamental, Constitutionally recognized liberty. What due process is involved?
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        • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
          The local courts obviously and back in the day and I bet there is no president, wouldn't they ask the local community?
          As for islam...especially the newly immigrated, in my mind have not earned these rights yet, must be citizens...no? and I am aware that it's automatic these days...that too is against the constitution is it not?
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          • Posted by Animal 1 year, 9 months ago
            So, you said in part that anyone that "...comes from or associates with pagan barbaric religious groups-(muslims) should not have guns."

            What local court will decide this? And do you really think it would take a higher court more than about ten seconds to overturn such a decision? And can the "local community" somehow override the Constitution in deciding who is and isn't worthy of their rights defined by the Second Amendment?

            I really don't think you've thought this through.
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            • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
              Like I said we're tryng to fix a problem assuming perfect conditions...conditions are nowhere near perfect these days...the only way around all this is for regular citizens to follow these creatures around and as soon as they act up...bam! but even that is not the perfect answer.
              I understand we are trying to stand on principle here but it seems by doing so we will be shot and taken over anyway. I don't see anyway the twain will meet.
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              • Posted by Animal 1 year, 9 months ago
                What problem are we trying to fix? Unless you live in one of Detroit or Chicago's more unstable ghettos, you're more likely to die of a lightning strike than by gunshot. Why are we obsessing over the need to "do something" and in so doing, contemplating tossing away our Constitutionally defined rights and our founding principles?
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                • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
                  Because the problem seems to be escalating...escalation is the plan of these mice to rid the earth of men. Albert Pike planned it all out...just from a dim memory of it, it would seem the worlds kakistocracies are following that plan...take down western value creating societies, create 3 world wars and that would lead to One World Communistic Government. islam was a suggestion to accomplish that plan...they too will be destroyed after mission completed...same ole crap for the past 8000 years.
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                  • Posted by Animal 1 year, 9 months ago
                    You still haven't answered my original question.

                    What
                    About
                    Due
                    Process?

                    You describe above the tactics the political Left are using to try to reduce or eliminate fundamental liberties. Are you suggesting we go along with them in the name of expediency? Are you suggesting we fall into the trap of having to "do something" in response to the shouting of hysterics?

                    In reviewing the thread, you really aren't addressing anything I write; you're just going off on a new tangent with each reply. I'll give you the last word.
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                    • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
                      Due process will not solve the problem cause no one can honestly, reasonably process what is due...the system is ignorant and corrupt.

                      Everything I've written defines the problem and expressed the difficulties of coming to a solution. Due process is not a solution, it's an ideal...and a good one, I agree, but it won't solve the problem of being confronted with creatures that have no principles.
                      So what's your solution, what will you do when you come face to face with it, because it's real and most likely it will at one time or another knock upon our door. I don't have the perfect answer and I can see that Objectivism does not either. No amount of logic or reason will help... We have no Gulch to run to.
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        • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 1 year, 9 months ago
          None there is no due process not any other civil rights since our current President suspended civil rights in general and due process in particular. And that's the answer to your question. Were you asleep when that happened too?
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          • Posted by Animal 1 year, 9 months ago
            No, civil rights have not been suspended. Don't be ridiculous. Infringed, yes, at times ignored, yes, but not suspended.
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            • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 1 year, 9 months ago
              Then why was Rand Paul and others fighting it so hard? And why did it rate an announcement New "Years Eve. on public channels? Let's see the excuse this time is.."it's only technical language and it will never happen here." The right to suspend at any given moment does not mean it will be used instantly or constantly. Quibbling does not make it untrue nor does parsing just as parsing did not make Clinton's balanced budget with a surplus the truth.
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  • Posted by  $  jbrenner 1 year, 9 months ago
    I made a mistake not investing in gun company stocks in 2008. Does anyone think it is too late to do so?
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    • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
      The current climate may wear the value of the stock down over time,,,right now, sales are up, with each ratcheted threat.
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      • Posted by  $  jbrenner 1 year, 9 months ago
        Ruger was up 70% last year. Smith and Wesson was up 80% last year. I think I missed the opportunity, but with the number of terrorist attacks happening everywhere this Ramadan, there may be a nice buying opportunity a few weeks after Ramadan ends on Wednesday. The P/E ratio is not out of line right now.
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        • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
          I think guns are too small for this job...I still want a Sherman tank! laughing
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          • Posted by  $  Thoritsu 1 year, 9 months ago
            What rule actually bars one from owning a Sherman Tank, except for the machine guns? The main gun is not an automatic weapon, by any stretch. Is there a rule from the ATF on caliber?

            After a little research, it looks like you can with an NFA license. Some have sold as cheaply as $40K, but not your Sherman. Wanna go in halvsies with an LLC?
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  • Posted by  $  sjatkins 1 year, 9 months ago
    What is merely "poor" behavior? On what objective scale? What kind of "criminal" when there are 4000 felonies on the law books and over 400,000 regulations with the full power of law?

    Be very careful about taking away inalienable rights.
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    • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
      My ultimate point here is that our courts and people in the business of making these decisions are hamstrung by the lack of reason and anyone that does have reason is thought of as a monster.

      Just posted a piece on moral equivalence...it's highly relative to this discussion.

      No matter the guidelines in time such as these something always presents a problem whether it be principle or protection and how one arrives at the answer...I've come to the concussion...there is no answer that solves the problem in the paradigm.
      Woopie...we all might die... unjustly
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  • Posted by Wanderer 1 year, 9 months ago
    I checked the latest California legal/illegal gun lists and found out almost all of my firearms aren't legal in the state. They either have detachable magazines or hold too many rounds or lack one or more safety features or are too effective (That would be the Judges - California calls them short barreled shotguns which, could be accurate but, it depends on what I put in them, doesn't it.) or, the manufacturer got fed up with California and won't pay what it costs to get the weapons certified to be legal.
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    • Posted by term2 1 year, 9 months ago
      Chances are you will never need to use them, except against the very government that enacts the laws. They need to be UN-registered, kept quietly and hidden from that government. That is actually hard to do, but when the time comes only those guns will be useful.

      As to terrorists, they will have the guns (probably already have them) to do their killing regardless of what our pathetic government does.
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    • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
      If you've had them for a while, how can their subversive laws be retroactive...
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      • Posted by Wanderer 1 year, 9 months ago
        Possession of cocaine was legal until it wasn't. Then everyone had to turn it in.

        That's what's happened in California. Those who own magazines with capacity exceeding 10 rounds must be turned in to authorities. Exactly how they'll enforce this, I don't know. Prohibiting alcohol and drugs didn't work. Prohibiting small inanimate objects, like magazines looks tough. Maybe they'll try to subpoena purchase records from retailers and send brownshirts door to door.
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        • Posted by  $  1 year, 9 months ago
          They do make smaller mag's now...or find someone that can print one...bury your larger one's in the yard...I'm bad...
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          • Posted by Wanderer 1 year, 9 months ago
            Or, move out of California.

            If enough productive people leave the state and enough illegals who don't pay taxes move in and the Federal government quits propping them up we might get to see what an illegal state bankruptcy looks like.
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            • Posted by  $  Suzanne43 1 year, 9 months ago
              Agree, but I don't think that the Federal government is ever going to quit propping them up. That's what the Federal government does. And if the wimpy Republicans, by some miracle win the White House and the Congress, they will continue propping them up, too.
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              • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 1 year, 9 months ago
                I'm trying to fathom what difference in anything that would make ...really. The sigtht of either one of them all over the news and TV on a daily basis is enough to make anyone turn it off for four years.

                I would have to paint over the left side of the screen.
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            • Posted by Animal 1 year, 9 months ago
              Mark Twain was writing about South Carolina when he described it as "too small to make a nation, but too large to be an insane asylum." One could more aptly apply that to California today.
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