A lot of people are having trouble with this math problem that requires some basic algebra

Posted by $ nickursis 9 years, 8 months ago to Culture
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This is interesting and also shows you how basic skills need to be retained for life, and exercised somewhat. The fact we went from 80 percent to 60 shows our glorious education system is not working.


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  • Posted by lrshultis 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Another way of looking at the law of causality is that it says, if you want to put an active nature into it, that nature is consistent. But nature is more a metaphor for stuff just acting with respect to its identity. No consciousness involved for the respect to part.
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  • Posted by mrdenis 9 years, 8 months ago
    A correct answer Should be equipped of all voters .....
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  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Apply the same vervbiage to 'money as free speech' and have it apply to accross the board income or wealth levels. Might also address winner take all vote changing as an effect of what cause?
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  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Are you comparing the two? The whole story is the end user consumption tax replaced all ALL the other taxes and the unfunded entitlement programs. and only was taken out of your check or bank account when you bought something. In the meantime it was available to back loans and investments

    the current system and I know I'm leaving stuff out is national debt is the sum total of all the T Bills of various varieties whee the government is the banker. and various other parking places. One is funded by savings and wealth in excess of current need. and loans for major items such as houses and by spending where a single tax occured. one time. and that with a single deduction variously called the Right To Life Exemption. The major difference was income tax was confiscatory and end user consumtion minus RTLE was voluntary.

    At that point in time the what was it called Fair Tax was computed at 30% to cover current government needs and obligatory payoffs such as military retirement and social security.

    It also relied on a real debt limit. Short of war and natural disaster - no phony declared emergencies - government could not go in debt and whatever could not be funded with current income flow was not done. Be it war, freeways, rapid transit, welfare etc. With the amount of obligated and unfunded programs now on the table it might be as much as fifty percent? I don't really know I'm doing a SWAG. Unless the debt was repudiated which is exactly what they did in 2008 and will do this next time around. So that's going to happen anyway.

    The main difference is control. One the citizens and their spending habits controlled government and in the other Government and it's spending habits controlled everything.

    Actually with income tax you get screwed every day of every year as taxes are embedded any time something is sold, bought, pay checks issued. It' all adds up until the final purchase of some goods or services. Then it comes due if not collected and transmitted along the way. Sales Tax. That's the Commie Mommie's favored VAT Tax. which subtracts value - iyou have to pay more to get the same thing.

    One is based ont the assumption the government owns everything and allows the citizens to earn a taxable portion called wages. The other is based on the assumption the citizens own everything and agree to pay a set percentage mnus the /Right to Life exemption to fund certain government programs.

    Two refinements are the No Funding No Mandate rule where government says all sewer systems must be replaced every 50 years and upgraded every ten but doesn't fund the requirement there fore it's not mandatory. OR funds it and it is mandatory.

    The second refinement is all spenidng bills must have the following ont he cover sheet and adhere to what is found there. Name, Description and Scope,. Constitutional cite that allows such an expenditure, Funding Source and funding limit.

    I guess a third refinement is No earmarks or anything not related to the story ont he cover sheet allowed as Christmas Tree add ons but in any case the whole pig trough is automatically under the No Funding No Mandate provision and the percentage of allowed end user consumption tax. Getting to long and I'm sure I forgot some important parts.

    I liked the citizen controlling by what he/she spends AND the anti pig trough/no funding no mandate provisions. Some of those were retirement funds, personal health insurance funds which added to the RTL exemption and some other odds and ends. Ahh yes the payoff and phase out of current entitlements.

    Inthe end it's all a sales tax anyway but paid for with after taxed (income) and added taxed (sales and VAT) collection methods.

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  • Posted by lrshultis 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The same happens in deciding whether climate is a causative something. Since climate is an averaging of weather in a geological area and in climatology is a type of probabilistic study of an area, it cannot have a causative effect. Only real things can be causes, averages or probabilities or measurements cannot. Thoughts cannot cause effects at a distance. Even thoughts in a mind are not causative since having a particular thought will not necessarily have the same effect in action each time it happens. That does not mean that a thought may not cause an emotion which if not inhibited will produce an action. Inhibition is part of the free will choice that most humans can learn.
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  • Posted by $ 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I see your point, there is not constant result, I would assume the with the human factor it makes it almost impossible to have a predictable state, just a probability.
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  • Posted by lrshultis 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    If you want causality you had better damn well prove causality and not confuse correlation for it. While causality implies correlation, correlation does not imply causality. Most of what people believe to be cause and effect are correlations. You cannot get by with watering causality down to feel good beliefs to make yourself feel like you have discovered something really important. Correlations can point to further work to see if there is a cause and effect action going on. Your money example fails due to the result of large amounts of money not always producing the same effect. It it were causality, the same result would happen or be scaled with the amount of money and not fail in some cases. In politics that does not happen.
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  • Posted by $ 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Wow, you must be used to sales tax. Much easier with a greedy income tax, you get screwed once a year and all you have to do is make up a suitable set of fictions to try to wrestle your money back in the face of their suitable fictions of why you shouldn't.
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  • Posted by $ 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I don't know if it is applicaple in that way. I would say systems within systems is a norm when you get above a certain size. Any grouping of causes and effects would generate a system, as long as they hold true and do not vary. That is what disrupts systems. I think the idea of stability and reputability define it more than size. Interesting concept.
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  • Posted by $ 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    IU would see that as a matter of how finite you want to define a cause and effect. Say we are talking about money in politics. A lot of money can cause a lot of corruption, but a little may cause a little. How much does a politician need to do your will? The cause is the money, the effect is the corruption. It is on a gross scale, but you could then render it down to individual examples, with the original relationship still valid. As a system, the money for play would still be valid, in that many players know the path to their will is to use money, not any of the trappings of society such as voter input, ethics and laws. It seems it is dependent upon your perspective.
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  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Something we didn't have in grade school! I had forgotten that it was sort of drilled into us until it stuck but that made me go look up the others BODMAS etc. I'm really enjoying the gulch today.
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  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 8 months ago
    The correct answer is both are required. One cannot accomplish A without B. Lack of B proves inability to accomplish A and a wrong understanding of A.

    In modern terms. The store clerk is handed a purchase at $21.95 two tens and a five. Sales tax is 7%. The cash register is broken.

    How long does it take to figure out the bill and make change of one dollar fifty cents and one penny.

    1.51.

    Best answer. I'll have to ask my teacher about that when I start Senior Year next fall.

    Not to be Pedantic and really don't want the useless penny but....you know how we nickle dime Nazi's are.

    The second part is - since the cash register is broken except for opening the drawer.....

    write it on a piece of paper.


    Item desciption and price

    $25 minus (21.99 x 1.07 = 23.5293. rounded up to the next highest penny. 23.54) = 1.46

    Easy way?
    21.99 round to 22. 2 x 70 plus 70+ 14 cents = 23.54 change is 1.46

    Two ways That second method used the Mark 1 Mod 1 brain. No waiting until September.

    It struck me we all have those little speed tricks squirreled away. Any additions? for practice I figure the bill at the supermarket. Keeps the brain cells limber.
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  • Posted by $ CBJ 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    To anything Hillary puts out, simply put parens around the whole thing and add a "not" operator to the left.
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  • Posted by Steven-Wells 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Sorry Nick, but "good engineer" and failing this sample problem are mutually exclusive in my experience.

    [snark]
    What is it that you engineered? Pinto gas tanks? Chernobyl control systems? Modern math education curricula?
    [/snark]

    We covered all of what was necessary for solving the proffered problem in freshman high school math class. And it is all symbols, not words.
    Care to engineer something practical with words? A family is driving their car to visit Disneyland and coming home after several days. Their home is right near to the Applebee’s in Goodyear, Arizona, so it’s 350 miles each way. If they expect the gas cost in Arizona and California to average $2.50 per gallon and their vehicle gets 35 miles per gallon, how much will the gas cost for the trip?
    I kept the numbers simple enough (though totally realistic) to not need a calculator to work it out. If you can’t solve that in five minutes or less, don’t make any engineering claims. Answer hint: Ulysses S. Grant.

    How about this one from a story called Escape! in Asimov’s I, Robot book?
    If one and a half chickens lay one and a half eggs in one and a half days, how many eggs do nine chickens lay in nine days?
    I could show (clearly) how to answer that one in under a minute on an old school blackboard or a modern dry-erase white board. Your thoughts about this one? Okay, setting it up the first time is what makes this difficult.
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  • Posted by mccannon01 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Agreed, CBJ! Been coding since T-Rex walked the earth and discovered long ago that liberal use of parenthesis is just plain decent practice.
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Some non-RPN calculators observe operator precedence. I prefer RPN because having the stack is useful. Also there's no ambiguity as to whether it observes precedence or not.
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Some people were talking about whether the very idea of systems is lazy or bad. I do not mean to say that at all. My complaint is whole industries being characterized as systems. I'm fine with a grocery store creating a system to distribute groceries. My problem starts if we talk about our nation's grocery distribution "system".
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  • Posted by lrshultis 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    If it has a different magnitude then it is a different cause. There is no A is not-A for any existent only an A may become non-A, but a time factor which is a change factor or motion factor or etc. which says that a cause is from some something at a particular time and can be different due to the cause being an effect of some other action at some other time. That is the trouble with particulars. Say the particular is John. He is considered to be just John all his life and in memory afterwards. But every instant of his being is different than all others in all his living parts which change constantly and in his mind which is continually being changed by processing sense data both automatically and the percepts from the data consciously. Chemical processes change the physical makeup of John.
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  • Posted by $ 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Well, then lets not get them more confused with the idea that it is all just cause and effect. Even then, causes can have different effects based on magnitude. Then it just seems easier to call it a "system".
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  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    A little refinement. Systems wouldn't be so bad if they were practical and useful and the term itself is not abusive and demeaning AS IS 'process.' Process is what happens to hogs at the slaughterhouse or chickens clucking their last for Tysons. Process is what happens to people unfortunate enough to have to ride on aircraft in the USA.
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