Four Ways Out

Posted by $ Abaco 10 years, 4 months ago to Economics
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I recently was listening to a smart economist. He said there are three ways for the United States (or any country) to get out from a massive pile of debt like ours:
1). Grow the economy.
2). Inflate our way out of it.
3). Assign losses.
4). Default

The fourth is the one I added. What are your thoughts on this? Assigning losses is called "austerity" in the news lately. Nice-sounding word. I expect inflation. I don't expect any growth in real GDP above the growth in population. Default is a last resort...a massive resignation.

I think we'll see further real restrictions, probably in the form of means tests, for Social Security. Sure, you paid into it. Here's a quarter - go call somebody who cares. We'll see inflation. So, I'm predicting mainly 2 and 3.


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  • Posted by $ blarman 10 years, 4 months ago
    I would add a fifth: STOP SPENDING MONEY YOU DON'T HAVE!
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  • Posted by $ jdg 10 years, 4 months ago
    Market interest rates are well above zero for the first time since 0 took office. The interest on the federal debt alone is now going to be over $1T per year. Default in some form is now inevitable (though they'll print the money and pretend they're in compliance).

    Expect another ban on the ownership of gold within the next four years. Probably to include silver this time too.
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  • Posted by mia767ca 10 years, 4 months ago
    i'm curious..."2,3,& 4 sound like govt oriented solutions...is "1" grow the economy, grow it by govt pumping???
    zero corporate tax rate...abolish govt regulation...shutdown the Fed, return to the gold standard...reduce govt spending by 90%...sounds better...
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  • Posted by helidrvr 10 years, 4 months ago
    Option (2) is nothing but a thinly disguised form of Option (4).
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  • Posted by Herb7734 10 years, 4 months ago
    There is a way out, but I doubt if it will be used. It is really quite simple.
    1. Austerity.
    2. Reduce taxes.
    That's it. Austerity means cutting spending except for essentials, like the MILITARY.
    Reduce taxes especially on business, and yes, the rich. Make it profitable to do business in the USA and the great engine created in the 19th and early 20th century will do the rest.
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  • Posted by $ CBJ 10 years, 4 months ago
    None of those four methods will get the U.S. out of its “massive pile of debt” without taking the necessary first step:

    1). Stop borrowing money!

    Without this step, growing the economy will not make the debt go away; inflation will devalue the dollar and lead to even more borrowing, in a continuing vicious circle; “assigning losses” (partial default) will increase perceived risk and make the cost of future borrowing dramatically higher; and default will make further borrowing impossible and leave pure money-printing as the only remaining option.
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  • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 10 years, 4 months ago
    5). Those that created the problem...Should Pay for the problem...wouldn't that be novel.
    OR
    Lets just fire everyone...call it a wash and start all over again...leaving the Big and Central banks a special place in hell.
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  • Posted by $ Thoritsu 10 years, 4 months ago
    1 and 3 should be the starting point. 2 is inevitable, because we are not worth what we say we are.
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  • Posted by DrZarkov99 10 years, 4 months ago
    The flaw in the reasoning is to place these results in a priority order, only using the others as each higher method fails. I would suggest the solution is "all of the above."

    A bigger GDP is certainly the primary desired solution, but pursuing it in isolation only pushes the end game out further. Reducing government waste and duplication should be accompanying private industry revenue generation.

    Inflation should be a lower priority than spending reductions, and should be kept at a level modest enough to inspire lending and bond purchases. High inflation should be prevented.

    A renegotiation of government bond commitments, as Trump has suggested, is a lesser form of "default." That should be considered with caution, but is worth careful assessment so it isn't an act of desperation.
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  • Posted by term2 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I agree. Look at the blowback that Trump got when he talked about the US government needing to restructure its debt. Thats what I like about Trump- he just comes out with the truths that our establishment wants to hide from us.
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  • Posted by $ TomB666 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You are absolutely correct!

    While you and I know the country is bankrupt, no one in a position of power would ever admit to having caused this. Recall how Rand wrote about this in Atlas - the government is still looking for John Galt to bail it out.
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  • Posted by MinorLiberator 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Grow the economy and hope for the best is the only moral way out. Doubt that will be the approach. I'd guess start with 2), but I doubt (not completely) even the idiots in government would let it get to the hyperinflation stage, so eventually some form of 3). And you forget 5): Not a solution, but what will be part of the process: "assigning blame"...
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  • Posted by $ allosaur 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    LOL! And I still am!
    What an interesting point of view! +1
    I surprisingly find myself leaning toward agreement.
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  • Posted by ChuckyBob 10 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Although I agree with what you say, since SS has been rolled into the general fund it we will never be privatized since that would show the true size of the short fall.
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  • Posted by term2 10 years, 4 months ago
    Government debt is not much different from private debt. If you get into serious debt personally, you can make more money and pay it off, you can cut your expenses and pay it off, or you can restructure your debt either partially or completely (bankruptcy).

    The government has additional powers to essentially "steal' money from citizens to pay off the debt they created. The government can "tax" the citizens and just take the money, or they can print more paper money, pay off the debt, and leave the citizens with less wealth than they thought they had.

    The federal government "defaulted" already under president Nixon when he took us off the gold standard back in the 70's. So, the idea of having restructuring is NOT new at all. Foreign countries took a haircut on the dollars they held back then, and since then all of us who hold dollars have taken a haircut through inflation.

    It would be better actually if we just admit that our country is bankrupt, and we move on.
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  • Posted by Lysander 10 years, 4 months ago
    Default! Those who have purchased these debts support the corruption. They should be the ones "assigned" the losses.
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 10 years, 4 months ago
    You have an unstated premise that we will "get out from it". We should define that. I'll call it debt (not counting SS obligations)-to-GDP ratio < 20%. By that definition, I say we'll probably never get out from it.

    Does assigning losses (#3) mean raising taxes and cutting spending? If so, I predict will manage the debt in the form of responding to a series of mini-crises using #2 and #3. They will never do #4 because #2 is an easier option. The economy will keep growing (#1) independently of this. Item #1 is the only one on the list the gov't can't just decide to do because "the economy" is millions of individuals choosing to help one another in exchange for something they want.

    In my estimation Social Security will keep running as it has. By its nature it takes money from people who are working and gives it to those who are old, disabled, or dead (supporting their minor children). Because people think of it as "saving" money for the future but it's really transferring it, there are a lot of histrionics around the ups-and-downs of how much you pay into it or take out of it.

    I would like to see SS privatized, debt reduced, and less leverage in general in the economy. It won't happen, so we plod along managing a series of mini-crises.
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  • Posted by SBilko 10 years, 4 months ago
    Inflating out of it is tantamount to economic destruction. Growing out of it is impossible, because resources are finite. Assigning losses will not work either, because it will slow the economy such that we can't pay off the debt we've already accrued. Default is the only option, and it will also result in economic destruction. We're screwed!
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  • Posted by richrobinson 10 years, 4 months ago
    Trumps plan is to do anything he can to grow the economy. Hillary will most likely rely on the Fed to inflate our way out. It's the main reason I don't want to see Hillary anywhere near the Oval Office.
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  • Posted by edweaver 10 years, 4 months ago
    4 will be the result of too much 2 & 3 in my opinion. Grow the economy it the only way out and I don't see that happening.
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