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  • Posted by j_IR1776wg 12 years, 10 months ago
    As opposed to John Dewey who once said that individual thinking was akin to insanity.
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    • Posted by ObjectiveAnalyst 12 years, 10 months ago
      Hello j_IR1776wg,
      I have tried to read some Dewey, but I can't stay with him. Some of it is quite interesting and not all bad, but his ethics are too collectivist in nature. His assertion that "Society has the right to demand of the individual that he prepare himself to serve the best interests of the group " could be interpreted as a form of collective altruism... He does make it clear the individual is paramount, but his contradictions and exceptions leave me uneasy.
      His influences on present day progressive education are sadly still being suffered.

      Regards,
      O.A.
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      • Posted by LeeCrites 12 years, 10 months ago
        I am all about the "contradictions and exceptions" topic... I was actually going to make a thread about this, which I will. Your comments made me decide to do it today instead of ponder on it for a while longer...
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  • Posted by lmsfinally 12 years, 10 months ago
    Sounds like the direction public education is taking these days and I don't mean the whole Common Core issue. I've taught in 2 separate schools recently that both maintained that my attitude as a "rogue educator" was a detriment. In both schools I was expected to collaborate with others at my content area and decide as a collective on the plans that would take place daily in all of our classrooms EVERY SINGLE DAY! The first 20 times I asked sincerely with my mouth agape if they really expected all of the classrooms at the grade level to really follow the EXACT same plans. Aghast, I managed to make it through the year only to move on to the same situation in a charter school the following year. Teacher autonomy is out. Who cares if the students learn differently or your style is different? Become a mindless drone. Uh...no thank you.
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    • Posted by $ winterwind 12 years, 10 months ago
      Charter schools are just government schools with cosmetic differences. Have you read Teaching as a Subversive Activity?. Oh, rats, the author's name has leaked out of my brain Quick trip to Amazon yields up Neil Postman and Charles Weingartner (Jul 15, 1971)

      You might look into working as an advisor to a homeschooling group - and there are a couple of great schools in Colorado - and I'm sure in other places. They don't advertise much because they're always full. hmmm.
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      • Posted by Rocky_Road 12 years, 10 months ago
        Charter schools in my area are a definite improvement over the public school system.

        This may be due to the fact the our charter schools are not heavily teacher unionized, and the teachers are hired on their innovation, and commitment to actual 'teaching'. Merit is the benchmark, and the results are amazing.
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        • Posted by $ winterwind 12 years, 10 months ago
          See, I'm SUCH a radical educator that I don't believe that there is any such thing as "teaching". There are some people who attempt to forcefully insert something they know into someone else's mind. That sounds like assault, to me.
          Adults, and other students, and a whole host of resources, should be there to work with, offer guidance, give help with problems, etc. Students should have control over their education as much as is possible - how, when and what a student learns is HER decision, not ours.

          I like the idea of merit being the measuring stick - but how is it determined, and by whom? Saying that a teacher did a good job because a student got a high score on some stupid standardized test is a racket that benefits the education power structure and the testing company.
          I am always interested in government-funded schools that people say are good - especially in the evaluation of teachers process. For example, are the students part of the evaluation process? If not, why not? Parents? Tell me more, please.
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          • Posted by Rocky_Road 12 years, 10 months ago
            When did "teaching" leave the equation?

            Or, better, when did the teachers decide that the student was adult enough to "have control over their education as much as is possible - how, when and what a student learns is HER decision, not ours."

            The 3 R's, and school uniforms, would do more than anything else I have heard about.

            P.S. Tests evaluate progress...that's why kids hate them. The No Child Left Behind program failed because the teachers were given the tests before hand...and that was the irresistible opportunity to 'cheat'.
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            • Posted by $ winterwind 12 years, 10 months ago
              please include "as much as is possible" in your question. and of course the 3 R's: reasoning, research, and responsibility.

              The teacher decides that the student gets control when it is obviously and overtly true. For example, if a student read nothing but science fiction, I would judge that he was not ready to have 100% of the choice of his reading matter, and I'd offer him 4 or 5 choices [all appropriate to his reading level, some far from SF and some closer] and say "You can read your choice 1 week, and select one of mine the next week."

              I taught this way for more than 20 years. My students included 1 who was first in his class in Math at Stanford, an AFA graduate, a Fulbright scholar, a musician making a living....and like that.

              Tests do not evaluate progress on anything but how well you take tests. When was the last time YOU took one?

              Re NCLB, who's doing the cheating? Do you mean the teacher who is told that his job depends on how well his students do on this test - yes, this one right here? It did fail in part because the teachers "taught to the test". The solution to that is not to give a different test, differently, it's to "teach to life", if you will. Make sure the students, instead of reciting a list of the American presidents in chronological order, can find out - as an example, which one thing 3 Presidents did which is the same as [give example] that Reagan did. And that they can tell you why they think so. THAT'S a test not many adults can pass, and I used to give it to 13-year-olds - who passed! And I have another 157 zillion examples - some failures, and some successes.

              Don't assume that one style, method, manner, content, etc, etc is the right one for every student. Do we make that assumption about adults? I see AS as being about INDIVIDUALS, not kids all dressed alike reciting the multiplication table in unison.
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