Anarcho-Capitalists Against Ayn Rand

Posted by richrobinson 10 years, 11 months ago to The Gulch: General
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Mises has disappointed me before so I was hesistant to post this but I wanted to get other input.


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  • Posted by $ jbrenner 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Fair enough, as a female back then, she would not have had the right to vote. Given that, she would have likely been the Susan B. Anthony of that time had she been then and there.
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  • Posted by $ jbrenner 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I used the term "America's founders" intentionally to be gender neutral. The biggest change that AR would have insisted on was the inclusion of property in the Declaration of Independence. I am sure that she would have been as confident in her stance as any of America's founders. It would have been fun to see.
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  • Posted by khalling 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    if you steal my intellectual property- it is the same as breaking into my home. If you make knockoff NIKES, you have stolen my design and brand name. It takes lots of investment in money and time to develop a brand name and shoe designs. The protections of these ideas are assets. They can change ownership. They have value as long as they are protected. If they are not, they will have only nominal value. Prosecuting thieves is an act of self defense
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  • Posted by Maphesdus 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I'm sorry, but saying that Anarchy is not the absence of government is illogical. If we're going to debate ideas and concepts, then we need to establish precise and consistent definitions. Otherwise we'll just become mired in intellectual confusion. If you want to advocate a society that still has some form of government, then you need to use some other word besides "anarchy" to describe that society.
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  • Posted by 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Great point. That led to the Missouri Compromise. Hard to believe we kicked that can down the road for so long. As a human and moral issue I would have expected it to be resolved sooner than it was.
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  • Posted by Maphesdus 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The question is never whether the ends justify the means, but whether this particular end justifies these particular means.
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  • Posted by Maphesdus 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Yeah, people tend to forget that women didn't get the right to vote until the 1920's...
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  • Posted by Maphesdus 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I think you mean Founding Mother. ;)

    And my guess is she probably would have found some way to insist that the Articles of Confederation and the Constitution (even with the Bill of Rights) were both wrong, given that the very last page of Atlas Shrugged depicts Judge Narragansett rewriting the Constitution and crossing out the alleged "contradictions" in its statements (though Ayn Rand never specified what exactly those contradictions were).
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  • Posted by Maphesdus 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Except that the so-called "Confederate States of America" was PART of the United States of America. It was not a separate nation.
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  • Posted by Maphesdus 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Right, Anarcho-Capitalism is impractical. But Anarcho-Capitalism is the inevitable conclusion of Ayn Rand's philosophy when her premises are followed to their logical ends. There's a reason why people like self-described anarchist Stefan Molyneux are such big fans of Ayn Rand.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    People keep saying "Founders". Is this another PC adjustment to the language?

    Growing up, it was always "Founding Fathers".
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  • Posted by 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I am not sure you can paint the Tea Party with one brush. Many small organizations are considered to be aligned with the Tea party but have very different issues that they concentrate on.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You'll have to define "fundamentalist Republicanism".

    If, in capitalizing "Republicanism" you refer to the progressive political party, then you don't know what you're talking about.

    As for the cartoon, as corporations are more heavily regulated than everyone else, I can see the need to deregulate them so that they can generate wealth and provide employment, especially since they know their business far better than professional bureaucrats.

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  • Posted by Wanderer 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Rich;

    Note the total absence of discussion in the Constitution of the potential exit from the Federation of any member. Slave colonies didn't think they were binding themselves irrevocably to the public opinion of the North. Neither did northerners state it explicitly.

    The Founders were bright men. They saw and foresaw many things. I believe, for that reason, many southerners came to see this as duplicity. Delegates from antislave colonies anticipated the day when the issue would divide the nation and purposely failed to address it. I can imagine delegates from the antislave colonies quietly conniving to bind the slave colonies to a union in which the population of abolitionists was growing much faster than were the proslavery populations of the south. In fact, I think this is exactly how most southerners then and now see the issue.
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  • Posted by 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    My understanding is that the Founders also thought that slavery would eventually become unnecessary. I believe it was already on the decline. They could not have foreseen the massive increase in the need for cotton. I wonder if they could have written a plan that phased it out in 50 years? Would slave States have agreed? Anything resulting in States choosing not to join would most likely have been left out. Tough issue.
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  • Posted by 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I think you are splitting hairs Maph. Ayn Rand was a strong advocate for Capitalism. What stood out most for me in this article is that the ideas of the Anarcho Capitalist seem impractical.
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  • Posted by Wanderer 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Rich;

    Insisting on abolition at that time would have resulted in several nations, rather than one nation. Not to say the result would have been the unions of free colonies and slave colonies, it might have resulted in 13 separate nations, attempting to go their own ways, that certainly would have included slavery's propagation. Though the Constitution left room for slavery, in the minds of the abolitionists it left no room for exit. It bound the slave states to the public opinion of the antislave states.

    Though an imperfect solution, I think the Founders' unwritten tactic, binding themselves together while allowing slave states to think there was a means of unbinding themselves, was their means of eliminating slavery.

    Would Ayn Rand have recognized this and gone along with it? I don't know, because it required the public appearance of thoughtlessness or intellectual dishonesty. Would she have accepted the Constitution as it functioned, a plot to destroy slavery, without the public acknowledgment of that fact?
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  • Posted by Maphesdus 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I suppose if you want to interpret the non-aggression principle as a general guideline rather than an absolute unbreakable rule, then that would be perfectly fine. The problem is that Ayn Rand said it should be an absolute unbreakable rule, without any exceptions whatsoever. When we recognize that she was wrong on that point, the rest of her philosophy starts to crumble. Hence why Libertarianism is superior to Objectivism as a political ideology. A Libertarian can discard or reject the non-aggression principle without violating the fundamental tenants of his ideology. An Objectivist cannot.
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  • Posted by 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I think that was her point. Stealing is force. Weather or not their is a physical confrontation is irrelevant.
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  • Posted by 10 years, 11 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I think the internet is seen as a perfect way to track everything about a person. Irrelevant if not monitored but perfect for big brother.
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