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We are divided by 180°

Posted by $ Olduglycarl 9 years, 8 months ago to Culture
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I was just thinking about the voting in Wisconsin last night. I don't think in my life time I have ever witnessed such a divide, a true dichotomy where the twain shall never meet.

We have on the one hand of choices: Maximum Freedom and Maximum Responsibility and on the other hand of choices we have: No Freedom and No Responsibility.
Can you wrap your head around that?

Don't know about you but I am ashamed, embarrassed, and disappointed in Mankind. It would seem that a good percentage of us have either devolved or never evolved at all.

For ever, we all have brought to the table historical reasons for the results we see on a daily basis.
How do you feel about that? Do conscious humans have a chance here? Will those that have the slightest chance of waking up...awaken?
What more can we do?

THOUGHTS


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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 7 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I have stopped giving. There are so many people who beg for money from me, but do not want to fix their own problem. I am supposed to work so they dont have to.

    There are so many, and its so hard to pick and choose among them and find the ones who really need a little honest help, that I dont have the time or energy to investigate.

    With 1 our of 7 people getting freebie food stamps or EBT, they already got more out of me that I would have given willingly.
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  • Posted by scojohnson 9 years, 7 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Eh - they are about to get a smack down. They think the primaries are some kind of a Constitutional requirement. Ultimately, the party conventions nominate their contender, the primary process is just a focus group largely paid-for by taxpayers.

    Trump, for example, assumed he could win on name recognition and bombastic statements that would keep him in the media, but has completely missed the boat (or didn't even know it was at the dock and boarding passengers) for delegate selections in each state to attend the convention. Now he suddenly learned that if he doesn't get 1237 delegates for the first ballot in Cleveland, he's out of the running. Apparently, his inexperienced campaign staff didn't even know there were precinct, district, and state meetings to select those delegates... And he has no one I'm told on the convention rules committee that will determine the rules for the convention. At this point, it's non-doable if he doesn't get the 1237. Here's a great example, California is coming up - and will likely be the deciding factor. California, unlike others, awards delegates evenly at 3 delegates per district, without regard to population or Republican registration. So San Francisco districts (which probably have 6 Republicans in the entire city) are worth 3 delegates per district, just like Placer County, Orange County, or San Diego (at 65%-75% (Right-Wing) Republican). The Donald's strategy has been massive rallies in big venues in urban areas... if he did San Francisco, LA, and San Diego he might get 20 delegates (out of 159). There are probably 25 million people in the urban cities, and those are absurdly left-leaning, but the remaining 20 million live in the more suburban, rural, and agricultural areas and are overwhelmingly Republican - so much that the state looks like a 'red state' on a map with a couple of tiny blue dots on it. There are 53 districts, with something like 800 miles of distance end-to-end across, 45 million people, and the Trump campaign in its entirety nation-wide has something like less than 100 people in it. Cruz has thousands of grass roots supporters here in contrast and has been endorsed by every state, county, and local Republican party official. He controls the convention delegation. If Trump wins the popular vote, he may get most of the delegates for the first ballot, but all 159 are going to go for Cruz on the subsequent ballots.

    On the Democrat side, the leftist college students seem to think that if they turn out with enough enthusiasm, that Bernie will be the guy. Nearly all (but like 1 or 2) of the nearly-400 super delegates are committed to Hillary, that is an 800 delegate swing (if 400 broke for Bernie, Hillary goes down by 400 and Bernie goes up by 400). Naturally, the Democratic system is pretty rigged too.
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  • Posted by wiggys 9 years, 7 months ago
    As you can see the way the government is functioning is as those employed at the highest levels are delighted. Having the divide means that they will have to work at correcting the situation; of course they do not know or maybe they do that they created the situation in the first place. It really matters not what government employees get involved with they always screw things up. The problem the thinkers have to deal with is the fact that 80- percent of the population is comprised of non-thinkers so they just accept what ever is presented to them. welcome to the land mass generally referred to as america.
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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 7 months ago in reply to this comment.
    When the people are ready, the leader will appear. The people are not ready yet. They are getting angry, as I am, and Trump has appeared to answer that anger. But not enough people are angry to effect a real change, and Trump would be better than any of the other alternatives. If John Galt were running, he would get a few votes, but the people are not ready for him yet. More collapse of the society is required, just as Ayn Rand predicted.
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  • Posted by vwestin 9 years, 7 months ago
    At some point, the answer has to be that if you want to vote you need to be a net contributor to society. If you can vote yourself bread and circuses at someone else's expense, enough always will....
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  • Posted by vwestin 9 years, 7 months ago
    The interesting wrinkle in this is that automation may make it possible to provide a subsistence living for all at minimal cost. Free education is pretty cheap to offer when it is viewing of recorded classes on Kahn Academy. Automated medical bots can make basic healthcare close to free. Given our technology, we will not need the totalitarian state to provide for all. That will not stop many from trying to grab the power for other reasons....
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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 7 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The story of AS was one of continual fighting against statism, with an eventual loss to it. Total collapse had to occur before people would even listen to John Galt. I think Ayn Rand was right that total collapse has to occur before things can change. She said she wrote AS to show people what was going to happen, so that it didnt HAVE to happen. That was a lost cause, which I think she realized after seeing the reaction to AS. Too bad that such a great country cant be made great again until after its destroyed.
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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 7 months ago
    This is probably the last election where we have the socialists vs the capitalists to choose from. If Hillary gets in, our country is on an irreversible course for socialism.
    There are the people who are angry with what the federal government has done under Obama, and are making a last stand by voting for Trump.
    Then you have the true socialists who vote for Sanders,
    The entrenched establishment people vote for Hildebeast.

    The INTENSE hatred for Trump is the establishment's reaction to his brash and politically incorrect views of the establishment.

    The incredible love for Hildebeast in spite of her obvious crimes comes from the people who want the goodies given to them by the establishment continued and expanded.

    The acceptance of Sanders comes from the younger people who arent getting the establishment goodies, but want them.

    Its a real mess. It IS a war between the people who want freebies and the ones who will be tapped to provide them. The productive people are losing the battle, just as in Atlas Shrugged. We cant play by their rules and win, which Dagny and Hank Rearden found out the hard way.
    Unfortunately, the pressure against Trump appears to be too great for him to be even nominated. I will still vote for him as a last stand against the inevitable tide.
    That leaves the establishment pushing us towards more socialism run by wall street, and true socialism run by Sanders and the young people who have been steeped in it during their schooling.
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  • Posted by $ Thoritsu 9 years, 7 months ago
    It will be simply awesome to see the open discussion from these two sides (If they make it), rather than the mealy-mouthed hints and non-positions taken by the middle.

    I just can't wait for Bernie to be forced to explain where all the money will come from, stand up for the complete inefficiency of the government, and stand up for the freedom he wants to take from the people. If Cruz had any Charisma, he could wipe the floor with Sanders. Maybe he'll pick Gary Johnson to run with him, or some excellent, charismatic woman.
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  • Posted by scojohnson 9 years, 7 months ago
    To understand this, you really only have to look at the incredible difference between the generations. These are not 100%, but on a macro level, the era in which we come of age makes a big difference -

    The WW2 Generation, unfortunately, probably doesn't vote in large numbers at this point.

    The baby boomers are kind of evenly split, some grew up missing key loved ones in their lives, others went off to war in Vietnam, many others dodged the draft and smoked dope. I don't know if we can draw a target, but in my experience the baby boomers were very liberal previously but are generally becoming more conservative now when on fixed incomes.

    Generation X (my group), quite honestly, we really did invent the Internet and are not only over-achievers, but we over-achieve in a balloon and popping kind of way. We were / are entrepreneurs in much greater numbers than previous generations. We didn't startup mom & pop shops, we built companies with 200, 500, 750 people. Our idea of national conflict was the Persian Gulf War, with the direct result of our love of and faith in technology. We kicked the crap out of the 3rd or 4th largest army in the world in a few days, then came home. We lived through the Clinton Years with Monica Lewinsky, the Bimbo Eruption, and Hillary's Healthcare Proposals (and she was never an elected or appointed official - she was just a 'volunteer'. We have also watched our dot-com investment portfolios drop so fast we could have lit a match & thrown the money into campfires, we watched our $500,000+ homes crash to 30 or 40% of their original value, we raised our kids with too much of a protective element, and we are still persevering. On average, despite a much higher than ever before savings and investment rate, because of the 3 major recessions we have lived through in our careers, we have a smaller nest-egg overall than our elders. We also like luxury items (I'm not going to lie). As a voting group, we tend to be much more conservative. Our experiences have taught us to pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, and tackle adversity again. As a group, I think we were less-educated on average than our predecessors, we didn't have the necessity of hiding in college and smoking dope to avoid a draft, our parents (baby boomers), quite honestly were self-centered and didn't help much with our coming of age, college expenses, etc... so we had to get it done, get out and get a job.

    Generation Y - Not sure about these folks, similar to Generation X, just kind of under-achievers. They probably feel like they got there too late, and were not part of the first wave of information innovation, and were not part of the second either. Unfortunately, I think their job prospects and experiences have not been kind.

    Millennials - This is the 'everyone gets a trophy' generation. If you participate, you are already a winner. Who pays for all of those trophies? They drop from heaven and everyone must have a money-tree out back. They don't want to flip burgers for $7.00 an hour (Generation X did it for $3.35), so they need $15.00 to ask if you want fries with that. This is a very bizarre group, they don't consider getting another (better paying) job as an option in their career growth, they want to stand there and wait to be noticed and get a raise. They also don't want to stand there very long, or spend more than 30 seconds without checking in on Facebook. Mixing Millennials and Generation X in the work place has been a natural-born conflict. A Gen X or a Boomer will figure out something to do without direction, Millennials want to be told what to do, or they sit there. Literally. If you assign them something, they want a demonstration of how to do it. "Figure it Out" is not something in their lexicon. I really trace this to the 'everyone gets a trophy' thing. When I was a kid, we had winners and losers, the winners got the cute girl and the football trophy and a scholarship. The losers went home and started a business mowing lawns to pay for school (and they became dot-com entrepreneurs later). They seem to take this thing of "we're already all winners" into the workplace... they got a job, now they are set, they don't need to prove themselves again every day.

    So when it comes to politics, we see the boomers probably evenly split. Generation X is overtly and overly Republican, we have already figured out we are self-reliant and we would rather trust ourselves than outside influences. If you notice, the democrats have already figured that out, and they don't market to the Gen-X predominate industries, neighborhoods or social groups. Generation Y & Millennials seem to be the liberals' target. Each election, its more free-shit being promised that is aimed toward their groups (pay off your student loans, all college should be free for everyone, etc.). Gen X is smart enough to know that with our $500k+ homes and $100k+ incomes, we're going to get soaked.
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  • Posted by Mamaemma 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Jbrenner, I have cut down my giving to almost nothing. I will admit I give my services to needy patients sometimes, but not often, as it is a bottomless pit. What I abhor is altrusim in any form, but especially at the point of a gun.
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  • Posted by edweaver 9 years, 8 months ago
    I'm with you Carl. I'm completely disappointed that more than a million people voted to move us to a socialist or fascist government. There are so many people that are busy being entertained, not paying attention, oblivious to what it all means and they will be blaming the capitalists when it all comes crashing down. It is truly sad that we are on this path. Atlas Shrugged really is no longer fiction.

    Who...is John Galt?
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  • Posted by $ 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    This scenario is the reason I wrote my first book: The Fight for Conscious Human Life. It is turning into a series, the next will be much more comprehensive and a bit more professional. I am aiming for the mainstream this time. The first one was just practice kinda; but has sold over 110K so far.
    Our blogs here at the Gulch have helped me sort all this out and find ways to articulate the BIG picture I see in my mind.
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  • Posted by $ jbrenner 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    If someone voluntarily gives food to someone who wants to work, I don't have a problem with that, but most homeless people I met before I came to the Gulch were choosers rather than beggars. After reading AS, I have cut down my altruism by ~90%. The remaining 10% is arguably not altruism. I incentivize some of my students with opportunities to resurrect equipment.
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  • Posted by richrobinson 9 years, 8 months ago
    Hi Carl. I think our choices are more limited than that. I don't know if enough people will wake soon or if those of us who are awake will be able to make a difference. Keep fighting the fight.
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    Posted by Mamaemma 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Jbrenner, I would say that the society only has to be willing to not steal from the productive in order to prevent starvation of those who refuse to work. If an individual has a desire to do so and voluntarily gives food to someone who is starving, that is fine.
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    Posted by $ jbrenner 9 years, 8 months ago
    The population of Atlantis in AS was counted one at a time. It was a very small number compared to the massive population not in Atlantis.

    Conscious humans only have a chance in a society that would let those who do not work starve to death. When the size of human hearts exceed the size of human brains, those with brains had better run off in search of a new place.
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  • Posted by $ 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I know that the people can change, can be empowered and gain entrance into a mind, a conscience and consciousness...but as you state, and your not alone here, there is just not enough of us.
    If we take the extreme...those that actually have ascended into the second and third stage of conscious awareness...that % is only .01% of the population in the US and a lot smaller % elsewhere...that's not really enough unless we/they could go mainstream in a big way.
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  • Posted by Mamaemma 9 years, 8 months ago
    YoungatheartCarl, I am disappointed, as I read Rand at a young age and looked forward eagerly to a world like the Gulch. I have found that those heroes exist, but in much smaller numbers than I had hoped. That's why I take much pleasure in my interactions with people here in this Gulch.
    I don't see people changing. I think the decent, responsible people, the makers, have always been in the minority. I would just like to have the makers be free to produce and live, and I would like to see the morality of the producers recognized as the ideal, which hasn't been the case for a long time.
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