A Troublesome Inheritance

Posted by freedomforall 3 years, 7 months ago to Books
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  • Posted by marc 3 years, 7 months ago
    The situation is as follows: There is only one race, and that is the HUMAN Race! A scientist or three once did a test of DNA from every people group on the planet and lo and behold discovered that there is a tiny infinitesimal percentage of one percent (1%) between the DNA of one people group and that of another.

    Those of blended people groupings have what is known as “hybrid vigor”—they may somewhat less prone to genetic-caused diseases than those of same-people-group ancestry.

    Sorry, folks, but the espousers of “racial purity”, no matter what guise, are full of sh*t.
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    • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
      guess that takes care of national socialism
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        Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
        National Socialism has been POISONED by the politically correct garbage of LOOTERS to such an extent that mention of it makes people assume that you are anazithatwantstokillsixmillionjews.
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        • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
          National Socialism is a poison. If it has been poisoned it is only an extension of the socialist wars of the twentieth century at worst and the anti-socialist wars at best. Once the poison spreads to international socialism we will all be the better for it. Like all forms of socialism it cannot be tolerated in any free society where rights and responsibilities of citizenship are held sacred as our the supreme source of power the individual citizen and citizens in complete control of any government. Giving over that portion of their power is the same as sacrificing their own ability to reason and think no different than drinking a cup of Jonestown Koolaid. Hitler, Stalin, Lenin, Pol Pot, LBJ, Clinton, Sanders or Trump makes no difference. Those who drink are no longer citizens but slaves.
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          • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
            National Socialism was designed by Hitler to generate PRIDE in the German people, a people that had been DEFEATED and DEMORALISED by the outcome of WW1 - a war that was stoked by the financiers as a means to greater profits.
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          • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
            If you want to study the issue closely and without the politically correct censure of the facts - Hitler wanted to get the Jews out of Germany at the SAME TIME AS the Jews were looking to ESTABLISH the state of Israel. When Hitler wasn't moving fast enough towards establishing a Jewish homeland, Judea DECLARED WAR against Germany.
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    • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
      @marc

      I guess that by your 'logic' that Pitbulls, Great Danes, Dachshunds, Chihuahuas, and Golden Retrievers are JUST dogs.

      Maybe Pigeons, Turkeys, Grey Parrots, Bald Eagles, Vultures, Crows, Ostriches are JUST birds.
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      • Posted by plusaf 3 years, 7 months ago
        "Racial Purity"??
        I know a genetic reseacher who loves to get blood samples from Golden Retrievers over ten years old who do NOT have cancer, because there are SO FEW of them.
        His research into the Goldens' cancer proclivity appears to have some possible applications to understanding and potentially helping cure human cancers, too.
        Purebreds tend to be the unhealthiest.
        Let the Aryans breed themselves to extinction.
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        • Posted by  $  Dobrien 3 years, 7 months ago
          My Golden Retriever is soon to be 12 her name is Mulligan. I have been making her dog food for 3 years and she looks better then she did when she was 6. Our 2 previous Golden Retrievers lived to 13 one died of heart failure the other cancer 2 days apart.
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          • Posted by plusaf 3 years, 7 months ago
            Dr. Matthew Breen...
            NC College of Veterinary Medicine...

            CVM Research Building
            4700 Hillsborough Street
            Raleigh, NC 27606

            If you need information regarding submission of samples to the lab please send an e-mail to info@BreenLab.org for further assistance.

            If your Golden has never been diagnosed with cancer, Dr. Breen may ask you to have a blood sample drawn and sent to him.

            Reference: Alan and Claudia Falk and our late Golden, [Shiloh June. 27, 1996 - July 30, 2012. ], who did NOT die from cancer!
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        • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
          To do that you should support the efforts of Europe to keep itself free from Africans and Middle-Eastern people who are moving in.
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          • Posted by plusaf 3 years, 7 months ago
            Not exactly. While I offer sympathy to the European countries suffering from the waves of immigrants, I believe that, yes, it should be THEIR efforts to manage their problems.. "We" should offer moral support but not physical support, because that impinges on their sovereign rights to "own and run their own countries."
            I've observed the news over the past years and have been waiting for Euro-countries (and others around there) to wake up to the idea that there's a huge difference between immigration and "assimilation." Countries or cities where there are Police "No-Go" areas are perfect examples.
            My view is that immigrants should be let into a country if they're willing to assimilate, too. If they want to bring different legal systems, languages or salute their previous Flag above that of their adopted country, I will not support them.
            It looks to me as if several European countries have awakened to that difference, although I think too many people in the US have not.
            And I believe that makes a Huge Difference in how 'things will turn out in the future.'

            As a Socratic Critical Thinker, I also am disappointed that the 'immigrant problem' isn't thought of in terms of Root Cause... WhyTF are so many people LEAVING so many countries in the first place?
            Trying to solve the Immigrant Problem when they land in another country is nowhere near addressing Root Cause.

            But Critical Thinking is Dead today, and that's proof.
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      • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
        That would be a true statement requiring little effort. now if you were to prove Chihuahuas were not dogs you might be on to something. No logic involved. The evidence surrounds us. But objectively we keep looking to find a dog that is not a dog or a bird that is not a bird. Illogical but that is the lot of objectivist examination.
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        • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
          What I am implying by my comment is that there are varieties of dogs and birds and to avoid classification of them into different breeds, removes a level of comprehension that helps to give them a lifestyle catering to their unique requirements.

          Would you leave the same quantity of food out for a Great Dane as you would for a Chihuahua? (A Great Dane would starve if you left the same size portion as you would give to a Chihuahua over an extended timeframe; conversely, a Chihuahua attempting to regularly eat the amount of food suitable for a Great Dane would most likely become severely obese.)

          Would you give the same type of food to a Pigeon and a Vulture? (One eats grain and the other consumes carrion, or the flesh of a corpse)


          If you can follow the logic - White people and Black people have different temperaments and prefer different social structures. So you should allow them to have their own countries where they can live according to their preferences and not be imposed upon by the other.
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  • Posted by Herb7734 3 years, 7 months ago
    My thoughts on the subject may be entirely mythic, but that's never stopped me before.
    I can understand why homo sapiens' evolution is speeding up. All animals except man conform to suit their environment. Man, for the most part conforms his environment to suit himself. Simple observations shows that the more he changes his environment, the faster his evolution takes place. When primitive tribes fail to change their environment at a certain point, they stop evolving. When those same people are brought into a situation where they are forced to change their environment in order to survive, their evolution starts speeding up. This is not "nature's way" which is why humans, by and large, are outside of the traditional definition of "nature." Which is also why, when speaking of humans, environmentalists (so-called) are full of crap.
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    • Posted by  $  Olduglycarl 3 years, 7 months ago
      Spot on Herb...that's why the left wants us to devolve, evolving scares the hell out of them because they can't compete.
      Evolution within species is not about fitness, it simply shows us that the weak will perish and your absolutely correct to point out that mankind, out of mutuality perhaps and many not so good reasons, as well, have perpetuated species, plants and some human conditions beyond what nature itself would have allowed.

      Post Script: I use "environ[mental]ism this way to demonstrate the Hippocracy.
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      • Posted by ewv 3 years, 7 months ago
        The proper abbreviation is "viro". It conserves more letters and reduces their "footprint" on the page. Now reduce their footprint on our necks.
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        • Posted by  $  Olduglycarl 3 years, 7 months ago
          And THAT is pure progressivism...changing our language, the definition of our words in that language so that when we engage in discussions our words would mean something different from the words of another.
          Combined with a liberal refusal to except the authority of the author and make it up to serve themselves...
          That is what was meant by the confoundation of our language by the rulers of Babylon at it's fall.
          And what they feared was our mutuality, our cooperation that eventually, Nothing would be impossible unto us.
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  • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
    There is evidence that the rate of the fixation of mutations in the human population (ie rate of genetic change) has markedly increased since the Neolithic. In a larger population, more favorable mutations will be available to out compete the marginal mutations and become a part of the population.

    A good example of this is anti-malarial mutations, most of which are (a) old and (b) not too good (lots of bad side effects). Hemoglobin S (sickle cell) and C (thalasemia) work by the half-serving (if you are half Hgb S and half normal Hgb, you are in good shape). If you have all-normal Hgb, then you die of malaria; if you have all-HgbS then you die of anemia. Duffy negative people, on the other hand, have no genetic downside...they are just immune to malaria (except maybe P vivax). So the Hemoglobin variants are being selected for-and-against simultaneously, but the Duffy variant is just being selected 'for'. If you lived in a small village in Greece, and all you had genetically available was the HgbC, then that would be better than nothing, but if you live in a large city, your best genetic choice is Duffy.

    I disagree with Wm on the matter of race, though. I think that there are races, but that the answer for many people is, "My race is 'blur'." There are still many races on Earth, and just because Barack Obama is mixed race does not mean that the typical Sami or pygmy is. What we lack is the intellectual integrity to separate genuine races from non-races.

    Jan
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    • Posted by  $  allosaur 3 years, 7 months ago
      I have seen tons of evidence that has made me wonder if the human population is devolving.
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      • Posted by FelixORiley 3 years, 7 months ago
        devolving or "dissolving" Our politicians love to divide and conquer.
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        • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
          The State has been CORRUPTED.

          What could be a discussion and debate about the strengths of various courses of action has, UNFORTUNATELY been transmuted into the 'Bread and Circuses' of politics and the WELFARE STATE.


          The WELFARE STATE is merely the armored camouflage the LOOTERS have devised to OBSCURE their HEIST.
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          • Posted by jdg 3 years, 7 months ago
            The welfare state also provides a lot of the incentive for our evolution in bad directions. 40% of all births in the US are out of wedlock because of the welfare/child support enforcement system. Those kids have no future except to loot and to breed more looters.
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            • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
              I think you need to consider the DISTINCTION BETWEEN 'LOOTERS' and 'MOOCHERS'

              LOOTERS are more inclined to ACTIVELY SCHEME for their benefit at the expense of ALL.

              MOOCHERS are PASSIVE, quickly grabbing WELFARE HANDOUTS, threatening to unleash violence and rioting when the HANDOUTS are slower than they are accustomed.
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      • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
        Our leaf-eating ancestors probably thought that of their strange children who kept killing and eating animals. I think that whether or not we are evolving or devolving right now is moot: We will be able to control what genes our offspring have and most of the detrimental alleles will be discarded.

        Jan
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        • Posted by 3 years, 7 months ago
          But will we (genome) miss out on the unpredictable potentially positive changes evolution brings, e.g., telepathy?
          Or will such functions be man-made by studying the genome and modifying it (as in B5)?
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          • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
            Yes, we will miss out on the random progress of evolution. But if you apply human ingenuity to creating better genetic arrays then we can go faster and produce more useful changes than random mutational events supply.

            I figure there will be a three step process:
            1. People will exclude detrimental genes: sickle cell; coagulopathies, breast cancer...
            2. People will adopt existing positive traits, such as replacing sickle cell trait with Duffy negative. During this phase we may also reactivate some of the archaic genes that we still have but which have lost functionality - for example, we have the gene that allows us to regrow amputated limbs already in our genome...we just do not have the way to turn that gene on.
            3. We will innovate genes, perhaps making a body that will not loose bone density in space. During this phase we may insert genes from other species (if we had the tendon attachment points of chimps, we would be a lot stronger without any additional muscles).

            It will be an interesting future.

            Jan
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        • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
          I think that it developed a little differently.

          I think that the meat eaters started from animals that were opportunistic and found the insects consuming the corpse an easy meal and developed a taste for meat.

          Then it was a short step from eating carcasses to chasing down living animals for food.

          The bounty for the first meat-eaters, lots of food and no significant competitor was enhanced in the colder climates where vegetation was more difficult to hunt down, especially over winter.
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          • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
            Interesting theory. I will keep that in mind. Chimps actually hunt for meat-food, though, so that could be a point of commonality with our mutual ancestor and is also possible.

            Jan
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    • Posted by  $  WilliamShipley 3 years, 7 months ago
      So are there many races on earth? Well there are certainly many ethnic groups. Having given up on an international race table (say ISO-1234) I searched farther and found semi-official tables of ethnic groups. Very large tables.

      In perusing them I came upon Mary's Igloo. In the early 1900's there was a woman named Mary who lived on the Seward Peninsula, northeast of Nome. Because of the attraction -- she is rumored to have served good coffee or something, it became a stopping off point and a village grew up around there. They were devastated by the flu epidemic of 1918/1919 and fell into gradual decay. By 1952 the are was abandoned. But there is a recognized ethnic group based on their decedents called Mary's Igloo.

      When I found that, I gave up trying to classify people according to specific groups. I will agree that there are clusters of common genetic traits but except for seriously isolated groups any attempt at classification is doomed to love.
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      • Posted by jimjamesjames 3 years, 7 months ago
        I classify people based on ABC. Attitude yields a Behavior which yields Consequences. As I used to tell the delinquents I worked with, "If you don't like the consequences, better check your attitude."
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        • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
          That system of ABC may work today, where we have a civilisation that provides food for large numbers of people at little average expenditure of effort on a per capita basis.

          But a population bottleneck where groups find themselves in harsh conditions, strategies for survival would tend to select for those that can master their environment and leaving the least adapted strategies to be left for dead.

          The suggestion that Africans were shaped in the conditions that formed close to the Equator allowed for male promiscuity as the children could survive with their mothers being their sole support.

          As the body chemistry of those promiscuous males spread through their population, the group gains these tendencies that would be encouraged by the culture.


          Now for the White people that found themselves in the harsh winters of Northern Europe, those who could plan for a season of limited availability of food by deferring gratification, developing an emphasis on monogamy to increase the odds of survival for their offspring, a lighter skin to soak up the limited ultraviolet light that signals the transition between seasons. These tendencies that promote survival gain a greater representation in the genetics and the CULTURE THAT REINFORCES these tendencies.
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          • Posted by jimjamesjames 3 years, 7 months ago
            No disagreement with your premise. Thank you. Nevertheless, we all have examples from our own lives of people in dire circumstances but with a positive attitude that led to positive behaviors that led to positive consequences.
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            • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
              YES.

              Anybody that identifies with the ideas put forward by White civilisation will find less headwind and/or obstacles impeding their efforts to improve themselves.

              I want to make the point that the culture can EITHER SUPPORT INDIVIDUAL INITIATIVE or can wear down and diffuse such efforts until they have acquiesced to the Bullies.

              That is why I point out the examination and selection of traits to imitate by the Japanese, SOUTH Koreans, Chinese and Indians, from the subcontinent, to be stronger competitors after British and American influence.
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          • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
            What this means is that we have populations that feel more comfortable with the DOMINANT CULTURE of an area, and populations that want to REPLACE IT with a CULTURE that suits their tendencies.
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            • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
              There is a THIRD group that exists, one that wants to RULE OVER all human beings.

              This group is HAPPY to ENFORCE 'racial mixing' as then there is ONLY ONE DISTINCTION.

              The RULING ELITE and everyone else that are considered a SLAVE CLASS.


              This group that WANTS TO RULE OVER everyone is a DANGER to the FREE WILL of ALL GROUPS, however they want to DEFINE THEMSELVES.
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      • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
        There are many distinct populations - distinct culturally, linguistically and genetically: Basque, Sami, pygmy (to name just a few). What you are saying is essentially, "Because there are mongrels there cannot be purebred dogs." Because there is Mary's Igloo does not mean that there are not populations with distinct traits. We can call these populations 'races' if we wish.

        Jan
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        • Posted by  $  WilliamShipley 3 years, 7 months ago
          There certainly can be purebred dogs -- and the relative speed at which a new breed of dogs can be created certainly argues for a rapid ability for genetic variations to occur.

          However, maintaining pure breeds of dogs takes careful management, attention to breeding charts and so on. One can get back to 'generic' dog pretty quickly.

          Distinct populations can be managed by isolation, or culture, but in a way, classifying them by race is only useful when they interact at which point the margins start being fuzzy.

          We can call these populations 'races' if we wish, but I think that it will imply a more definitive distinction than reality supports.
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          • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
            But it is a useful distinction. This is why I advocate having several 'base genomes' for reference when we develop a genetics module rather than just one. If you have a person who is of Asian extraction, there is a higher probability that they will have the M blood antigen, for example; if the individual is of European origin (note that I do not say 'lives in Europe') then he is probably N and not M.

            Jan
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            • Posted by  $  WilliamShipley 3 years, 7 months ago
              The problem with a base genome is that in the areas with advanced medical care the blur in racial identity is growing. You have to rely, for the most part, on self-identification and we get back to what race is Barack Obama? What allelle's does he actually have.

              There will be a very small technical window between the point when we have the ability to utilize genomic information and the ability to simply scan the actual person and know on a routine basis. When you enter the sickbay of the starship Enterprise you get a gene scan the same way we do a CBC. Except this is going to happen in the next few years, not hundreds of years from now.
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              • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
                There are billions of people on Earth who have discrete racial identities - Chinese and Indian subcontinent. One need not rely on self-identity; one can perform matching of key genes. Then, from that, you can develop a probability of other nearby genes being of a particular character, even though they were not actually tested.

                Jan
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                • Posted by  $  WilliamShipley 3 years, 7 months ago
                  One of my favorite commercials for Microsoft cloud says "it used to take two weeks to sequence and analyze a genome. With the Microsoft Cloud, we can analyze a hundred per day".

                  Even in fairly concentrated groups, the ability to determine someone's genetic components by looking at them or saying "most people in this region carry this gene" is not sufficient when easy analysis and certainty is at hand.
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                  • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
                    But it is not. We are not analyzing whole genomes - which usually amount to just the exome anyway. We are still just analyzing a handful of snips.

                    Jan
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                    • Posted by  $  WilliamShipley 3 years, 7 months ago
                      Still, if you do like 23 and me and pick the 1,000,000 most interesting snips you will do far better than simply looking at someone's 'race'.

                      The cost and time to process a chip will continue to go down and as we identify more snps of interest we will create new chips.

                      If knowing that someone carries a specific gene is important for someone's treatment, we are going to test for it not say that since we think he's Basque he probably has it.
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                      • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
                        If cost is an issue, we will say, "This person has genes R12 and GPS456 so he has a 70% probability that he will also have M78, which causes people to explode when they drink coffee. We will now specifically order a M78 to see if he has it." This way, the insurance will pay for the test for the M28 SNP.

                        Jan
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                        • Posted by  $  WilliamShipley 3 years, 7 months ago
                          Well, that's the payment anomaly. The FDA and the insurance industry has a hard time wrapping their brains around a single chip scan for 1,000,000 SNPs costing about the same as the M28 SNP to perform.
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                          • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
                            The payment was an aside: My main point is that whole genome - or even whole exome - scans are not being done and will not routinely be done for a while yet. Software that can pinpoint 'the most probably detrimental alleles' from a set of SNPs will still be valuable.

                            Jan
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          • Posted by  $  jlc 3 years, 7 months ago
            But it is a useful distinction. This is why I advocate having several 'base genomes' for reference when we develop a genetics module rather than just one. If you have a person who is of Asian extraction, there is a higher probability that they will have the M blood antigen, for example; if the individual is of European origin (note that I do not say 'lives in Europe') then he is probably N and not M.

            Jan
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  • Posted by DrZarkov99 3 years, 7 months ago
    When humans first began to care for and extend the lives of our less robust compatriots, continuation of the species was no longer "survival of the fittest." The more sophisticated our medical technology has become, the persistence of detrimental genetic characteristics has naturally increased. My father, who was somewhat Will Rogers-like in his humor, summarized the condition in one sentence: "The culls are breeding."

    We're just entering the era of promise for genetic engineering, which offers the solution of gene therapies that could possibly eradicate the more unpleasant inherited conditions. The hazard in a rush to fix things is the distinct possibility of unintended consequences. We don't completely understand the human genome, so we may be blundering into creating more problems than we fix.

    Hopefully, sanity and caution will be the guide for genetic tinkering, but humans aren't always careful.
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  • Posted by  $  MikeMarotta 3 years, 7 months ago
    When I worked at Kawasaki Robotics, the treasurer said to me one day that "international people" are the same, and they are different from the people back home.

    When I was learning to fly, I was at my in-laws for a party. I asked the guy from across the road if he was a pilot. He looked like one to me. He was visibly taken aback, as was at least one of the guys standing there. He said that he flew helicopters in Vietnam. The other neighbor who was surprised that I would ask an out-of-the-blue question like that said, "I didn't know that." NASA was surprised to discover that test pilots tend to have female children.

    Just sayin'... "race" is not what you think it is.

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    • Posted by  $  sekeres 3 years, 7 months ago
      From experience of the "Service Brat" (Army, Navy, etc.) subset of "international people," here's a second to "they are different from the people back home." Also, the Experimental Aviation gathering at Oshkosh, WI has the air of a family reunion -- despite being half a million strangers from around the world. As to whether it's nature or nature . . .
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      • Posted by  $  MikeMarotta 3 years, 7 months ago
        It also speaks to the vitality of the city versus the countryside. Strangers come together in the city, each from some different social context. In the city, they build a new culture. But, to me, not being much a traveler, if you can live in New York, you can live in Tokyo or London.

        "Civilized" and "urbane" have deep meaning.
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    • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
      @Mike

      Can you please offer anything about race? Even if it may prove to be incomplete.

      What you have added to the above conversation has NOT given me anything that could add to OR cause me to revise my thinking on the subject.
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      • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
        What is your thinking on the subject and has it progressed to a belief stage?
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        • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
          I have found a bunch of ideas that I have adopted as my current benchmark on the line of inquiry. I am always looking for more data that can disprove my current position.


          I am realising that African-American people are ALLOWED to be PROUD of their HERITAGE.
          Chinese, Japanese, Koreans are ALLOWED to be PROUD of their HERITAGE. The tribes that existed prior to the arrival of White people in North America are ALLOWED to be PROUD of their HERITAGE.


          White people are DENIED the OPTION of BEING PROUD of their HERITAGE and the ALMOST UNILATERAL CONSTRUCTION of ADVANCED CIVILISATION and TECHNOLOGY.
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          • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
            To quote Ayn Rand....Whose going to stop me? If you are correct and I despise the racist term white along with all the others they have individually or as member of the wimp generation become humanoids not terrans..
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  • Posted by Zenphamy 3 years, 7 months ago
    Recent 'discoveries' in the DNA of Neanderthal and Dinosovans that are also found in DNA of Europeans and Western Asians, but not Africans, along with others not yet identified in the paleontological record but noted in modern DNA is revealing a new story of our recent (assumed evolutionary time scale) genetic history and the realities of 'race' that the social 'sciences' would rather not have discussed. The PC of the sciences will take a long time to be eliminated from the proper findings of science fact.
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    • Posted by 3 years, 7 months ago
      As the author infers, we have to be willing to objectively collect and analyze data or the "world" stays flat. Is there a "race" of subjective "scientists" impeding that process?
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      • Posted by jetgraphics 3 years, 7 months ago
        We may individually differ, but we often share our cultural / racial bias, as a means to discern friend from foe.
        My concern is with "predators" who hide among the innocent, and mislead the victims into plural hatred and fear.
        Tolerance of predators is unmerciful to their next victim - though they may share our cultural / racial bias.
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    • Posted by Herb7734 3 years, 7 months ago
      It's always a struggle when accepted knowledge is proved wrong, or different. Also, I believe recent DNA studies are pointing to the probability that Neaderthalis Erectus was just as intelligent as Cro-Magnon. Why one succeeded and the other didn't is yet to be explained, since it appears that Neaderthal was stronger and more robust.
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  • Posted by  $  WilliamShipley 3 years, 7 months ago
    I would argue that there is no such thing as race. We spend a lot of time talking about it, our society frequently makes decisions upon race as do many governments, so it certainly seems as if it exists.

    I used to think it did. I was uncomfortable adding a 'race' field to our laboratory software but under pressure from a number of places, most notably Malaysia, I decided I wanted to add a standard table. That's when I ran into my first problem. Their table of races is entirely different than ours. Ours comes from the Office of management and budget and includes Hispanic, which no one thinks is a race. My search for some internationally agreed upon table failed. We don't agree on what races exist.

    So picking a table at random, say our OMB one, what race is an individual? What race is Barack Obama? There is no reliable way of determining what race someone is and they fall back on "self declared" -- and we have Elizabeth Warren self declaring as American Indian and Barack Obama as black.

    Now there are medical differences between 'races' whatever they are, we have different calculations for eGFR on white and African Americans, even those who don't live in America I guess. But we are simply using these vague terms to determine the existence of the underlying allels that are present. So, which table IS appropriate for Barack Obama?

    Everyone knows that there are races, they just have different ones in mind. Race is a political construct as a gross approximation of genetic composition -- and with travel and intermarriage becoming more meaningless all the time.
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    • Posted by  $  Dobrien 3 years, 7 months ago
      Race is meaningless in my life and I would guess it plays very little importance in most folks lives.
      Although it is critical for civil rights activists.
      They love racial tension and create hateful racism to perpetuate and create more power for themselves.
      In the last 8 years it seems to have received an adrenalin shot.
      It is a sham and a shame.
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    • Posted by jdg 3 years, 7 months ago
      I'll agree that the "races" don't exist in the meaning of having objective biological definitions or attributes. But there are certainly social in- and out-groups, and some of them are called "races", and they are sometimes used as excuses for behavior that discriminates, both by members and non-members of each group. I see no difference between these and any other potential "family", club, or community except in how we each choose to treat people in them.

      Not all of these behaviors are irrational. Sometimes appearance is a good predictor of behavior.
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      • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
        Now you are waffling. It ill suits you and Mr. Shipley has given you the answer as has Ayn Rand. Check your premises and use proper definitions not those changed every minute or two.

        State your original idea in this manner it will have more traction. There is one race and several humanoid version who refuse to be categorized so narrowly. that is a start point worthy of your efforts to date. How many humanoid races have been fabricated?
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  • Posted by LibertyBelle 3 years, 7 months ago
    It makes not much difference to me. Man is a
    rational being. Man has free will. His not having
    free will would be incompatible with any knowledge
    whatever. (See The Objectivist Newsletter for
    demonstration).
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    • -1
      Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
      Makes not much difference to you?

      REALLY?

      So you look at Haiti and think that maybe they could have created the computer that you are accessing the Gulch on?
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      • Posted by LibertyBelle 3 years, 7 months ago
        I do not think Haitians are inferior in intelligence towhites. There are many reasons why civilizationsdevelop more in some places than others. AllGreeks are not geniuses because of can't tell when a genius will come along. But whenit does happen, it can benefit the culture in which he was born, (sometimes after he has
        been hounded and persecuted by his own peop-
        le into an early grave; does Galileo make the
        Italian people born astronomers?)
        In a place like Alaska, the circumstances are
        not very encouraging, where the people have
        almost all they can do to keep from freezing to
        death; then again, in a place like Hawaii, where
        lush vegetation grows without the effort of culti-
        vation, where winter never comes--why bother?!
        Civilization seems to start in fairly moderate
        to benign climates, such as Greece and Italy;
        from there it spreads; but when it spreads, the
        people to whom it does spread are able to adopt
        it intelligently enough.
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        • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
          I found a brief description of the history of the island we know as Haiti. [source needed]

          It describes the French(White) colony thriving. When the ideas of the French Revolution arrived on the island and the Black people MASSACRED MOST OF THE WHITE POPULATION, a few managed to escape by fleeing.

          In the approximately 150 years since the MASSACRE, the United States has sent THREE expeditions to rebuild the infrastructure that the BLACK POPULATION has been UNABLE TO MAINTAIN.


          IQ tests have measured the intelligence of various populations. Asians scored the highest, White people weren't far behind, Hispanics scored higher than the African-American who did better than the African.

          The AVERAGE White scored 1 standard deviation above the AVERAGE African-American, which is 15 IQ points of difference. The AVERAGE African scored 2 standard deviations below.

          As you may be AWARE, the AVERAGE of a group can suggest correlations but further observation is necessary. A COMPARISON of Bell-Curves can reveal more details on how the population compares apples with apples. There can be White people who have intelligence lower than the Black average(a tiny minority), just as there are some Black people who have an intelligence higher than the White average(again, a tiny minority, but they exist).


          It is noted that the more White Grandparents a person with African-American ancestry is, the closer they perform to the White average.


          THIS IS NOT TO SUGGEST INFERIORITY. The conditions under which various populations developed required DIFFERENT SOLUTIONS TO SURVIVAL CHALLENGES.

          WHAT IT DOES IMPLY is that INTEGRATION has HARMED Black people by allowing their leadership to abandon them, in favour of the higher living conditions typically found in a majority White neighbourhood and the salaries they can earn as the TOKEN Black under Affirmative Action policies.

          White people are worried by the arrival of the Blacks benefiting from the Affirmative Action policies due to fears that the undesirable Black Welfare underclass will bring higher rates of crime.
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          • Posted by LibertyBelle 3 years, 7 months ago
            I am not a racist, but an intransigent individualist.
            Therefore, I am deeply against affirmative action,
            believing that it is certainly racist itself.
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            • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
              I think that 'racist' has always been a SLUR, a SIMPLE-MINDED ad hominem attack in an effort to silence people who recognise that there are groups that have different preferences and differing abilities AND members within the groups are often related.

              Being an Individualist is a worthy personal character trait, most efforts seem to function better when you have support from cooperating individuals.



              Robert Kiyosaki points out that business is a team sport, yet cooperation in school is regarded as cheating.

              If you insist on trying to go against a team by yourself you may have a much more difficult time for getting runs on the board.
              Somewhere I came across the metaphor that 'a mediocre team that cooperates can beat a team of 'all-star' players that allows everybody to go out solely for their individual benefit.'

              I do not have a clear guide to when an individual has the upper hand(thinking of entrepreneurship where the individual quickly surrounds themselves with a team that complements the strengths that are underdeveloped.)
              versus where the team has a better chance(thinking of how criminals are separated from the rest of the population.)
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          • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
            The source I use in the above comment was:


            The Kindle Edition of: David Duke's 'My Awakening', Chapter 10: Race History.

            Do a search for 'Haiti'.
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            • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
              Well that explains the overt racism from the Duke Humanoid Collective
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              • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
                What do you prefer?

                Having people be vocal about their beliefs so that you have an opportunity to avoid them if you DO NOT WANT TO COMPREHEND WHERE THEY ARE COMING FROM;

                Or, prefer to be paranoid and always trying to second guess what their actual motives are?
                (real and imagined)


                Personally, I think that it is better to have open discussion.
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                • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
                  None of the Above. You have listed none of my acceptable choices. And I know where you are coming from and where you should go back to. Under a rock.
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  • Posted by Owlsrayne 3 years, 7 months ago
    I think Nicholas Wade is correct in the sense that what is happening in anthropological genetics. In some recent articles I have read it's looking like there were more hominid species interacting with one another in prehistoric times. Researchers have already found Neanderthal genes in people waking around today. There is an hypothsis that some of the junk genes are the remaments of other hominids. So, what makes up the modern human is more complex.
    A few months back I had my genetic ancestry done and found out not only confirmed what I beieved that part of my ancestry (Slavic) was but the Germanic side (Dutch) surprised me. So, far as I'm concerned there is a genetic predisposition for the human potential. Than the human population as a whole are so varied that if there is an evolutionary accelleration happening it is not homogenious.If that is happening Western culture will fracture into many new species of humans.
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  • Posted by term2 3 years, 7 months ago
    Interesting, and there is no doubt that all life seems to evolve over time for SOME reason. Not sure what it is, and maybe someday we will figure it out. Doubtful its some sort of mythical all knowing and all powerful and all controlling creature tht suposedly inhabits space somewhere- and is something that we should pay attention to.
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    • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
      It is enough to say there is something all powerful. Having said that you have no right to question or attempt to explain or find who, what, where, when & why. You have already abdicated your ability to think and reason, If the All Powerful wanted you to know he/she/it would have made it part of the syllabus.Since this didn't happen for you it follows that being All Powerful you are not to know." Unless your All Powerful has clay feet.
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  • -1
    Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
    Does anyone in the Gulch know the meanings of 'dysgenics' and 'eugenics' and their significance?

    Dysgenics is the hazard of civilisation - protection of the 'unfit', the perpetuation of genetic combinations that impair health and reduce contributions to the group for survival scenarios.

    Eugenics is the science, much maligned, of promoting the better quality genetic combinations.


    Simplified, the small or non-existent families of productive individuals, VERSUS the larger families of welfare recipients. This leads over time to decreasing numbers of productive individuals to the detriment of the proliferation of the masses.
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    • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
      and in National Socialism the decision is the province of a few as to what characterizes those who should be killed off. Failing to obey the uber fuhrer chief among them. Under Adolf Hitler even Hitler did not qualify.
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      • Posted by  $  Terraformer_One 3 years, 7 months ago
        YOU should really read the literature of the National Socialists, that way you can DETERMINE FOR YOURSELF what their ACTUAL IDEAS were and JUDGE THEM BY THEIR OWN WRITING.

        I don't know if you are AWARE that the VICTORS OFTEN REWRITE HISTORY to ENHANCE and JUSTIFY themselves to history.


        I think that they were more inclined to stop those that were REGARDED AS 'deficient' from breeding, not allowing undesirable attributes to pollute the gene pool.

        I think that the undesirables were segregated from the population, not killed.
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        • Posted by  $  MichaelAarethun 3 years, 7 months ago
          You should learn to read....Seig me No Heils Comrade I do not serve your party. Nor that of Clinton, Trump or Sanders.

          You think, I don't believe so or you would have said I believe not I think...the ultimate cop out

          .
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