"Equal Pay" really means more mandates

Posted by $ blarman 8 years, 2 months ago to Government
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They're not interested in having people get payed what they are worth. They want to create a panic so they can enforce rules and penalties on people who don't conform to their ideals.

Me? I should be able to pay my employees whatever we negotiate between the two of us - end of story.
SOURCE URL: http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_29448758/us-collect-equal-pay-data-from-all-big


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  • Posted by $ jlc 8 years, 2 months ago
    Actually, from what I have read, if you take into consideration the observation that women tend to put in less overtime, then the work-per-hour comes out about equal for men and women. And given that working overtime is often what gets you ahead of your contemporaries and in line for the next promotion, it also explains some of the discrepancy about women in higher positions.

    That being said, my head is still bruised from all the glass ceilings I hit it on whilst I was in the military - which was a good reason for getting out when my 4 years was up. Which I did.

    Insofar as the 'need for muscle', I agree with CircuitGuy: muscle is overrated. Handy to have, but rarely essential. I suspect, for example, that there are women who could pitch a grenade 15 yards without a problem; and some men who could not. The criteria for 'who throws a grenade' should be 'who can throw it >15 yards' not 'are your reproductive organs internal or external'.

    Women have made huge inroads on a social structure that has limited us for thousands of years; it should not be forgotten that it was MEN who voted in favor of women's suffrage - we do not say 'thank you' often enough for that. It will take a while for women roofers to be common, and it may never be that 50% of the roofers will be women. In the meantime, women doctors and lawyers and scientists are everyday phenomena. This was not true in the world that many of us grew up in.

    Jan, counsels patience
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    • Posted by jpellone 8 years, 2 months ago
      Jan I agree. But women on average have a smaller frame and cannot physically do many jobs that men do. Can they carry three packs of shingles up a ladder??? Some can but most can't. Think about this, a 185 pound man is going to look much different than a 185 pound woman. Most of the men will look buff but the women will be fat.

      Now a joke:
      Why are women's hands so small? To make the guy look bigger!
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      • Posted by $ jlc 8 years, 2 months ago
        Ha! jpellone. Fun joke.

        The reasonable answer to your question is: Why does someone have to carry 3 packs of shingles up a ladder at one time? How about one pack of shingles, and make 3 trips? While women do not have the strength per se of men, we do have greater endurance, so we should take advantage of that.

        Joke: Why did the man want to reincarnate as a spider?

        Jan
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      • Posted by CircuitGuy 8 years, 2 months ago
        I maintain if women on the average had the same abiity to do physical tasks like carrying shingles up a ladder as men, it would not affect the so-called pay gap. I believe the pay gap is caused by more women choosing not to focus on paid work. The whole issue of what one group does vs another is moot thought. All that matters is what you do. I'm 185lbs, not buff, and would not be well suited to carrying shingles. It does not help me that men as a group are more likely to be tall and muscular.
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        • Posted by $ jlc 8 years, 2 months ago
          Analysis of the pay gap supports your argument. This could be solved by women choosing to put paid work at a higher priority, but my observations suggest the opposite: this is going to be resolved by men putting paid work at a lower priority.

          Jan
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          • Posted by CircuitGuy 8 years, 2 months ago
            "this is going to be resolved by men putting paid work at a lower priority."
            I wish people did not perceive a need for a resolution. It's just what people in various demographic groups chose to do with their lives.
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            • Posted by $ jlc 8 years, 2 months ago
              I was reflecting on the articles I have read that indicate that millennials, as a generation (irrespective of gender) place 'getting ahead at work' at a lower priority than prior generations. This is a bottom-up phenomenon, and not an imposed regulation.

              It is interesting to observe.

              Jan
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              • Posted by CircuitGuy 8 years, 2 months ago
                I agree completely. Also some millennials don't clearly identify with one gender and have to tell you which pronoun they use. It's sounds odd to me as a Gen-Xer, but I think this blurring of gender is one more thing that will make millennials put individuals ahead of group identity, reducing the importance of this issue.
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                • Posted by $ jlc 8 years, 2 months ago
                  There are a number of androgyns in my occasional social circle. I tend to get along with them well. "Geek Girls" I get along with superbly - they use the feminine pronoun, but don't subscribe to the social hoopla. It is a relief to be around them, actually...I don't have to talk about my dogs in order to have a topic of conversation (though dogs are certainly sometimes discussed). I can just dive into Minoan archetypes or spinning or genetics; as in the Gulch, I have to be careful what topic to open since there is a Lot of Expertise floating around.

                  The Individual is the important part!

                  Jan
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    • Posted by blackswan 8 years, 2 months ago
      Jan, observe that, for thousands of years, there was no industrial revolution. Women only made progress after the industrial revolution eliminated the need for muscle. Notice also that the rights of man coincided with the industrial revolution. We could have had an industrial revolution in Herons's time, but the idea of the rights of man didn't exist, and that opportunity was stillborn. Several things needed to be in place for women to make progress.
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      • Posted by $ jlc 8 years, 2 months ago
        Overall, I agree: that is what happened. But if you look way back at Bronze Age societies, they run the spectrum from cultures where women play a major role (Crete) to cultures where women live in virtually a separate society than men and are regarded as possessions of their fathers, who then transfer that ownership to their husbands (Greece).

        So, even before the Industrial Revolution there were a lot of different ways for society to deal with men and women. But. By the end of the Bronze Age, all of the cultures had pretty much relegated women to a secondary status. This, as you say, lasted until the Industrial Revolution.

        I do not have an answer for this, but I am interested in it and am looking for information.

        Jan
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  • Posted by Ben_C 8 years, 2 months ago
    Pay is equal. Their premise is an arbitrary placement of relative value of an employee's job description. For example, the secretaries time is worth 1.5 x that of a roofer in a roofing business. When pay is calculated with the multiplier a discrepancy occurs. If the female was a roofer her pay would be the same as the male. Problem is that the female generally cannot satisfy the physical requirements for the roofing job. Most feminists are not willing to accept this fact. Ask the military about women in combat and the physical requirements. So, if both male an female are a secretary and the male is paid more then they have a valid point. My suspicion is that this rarely occurs.
    My business pay is gender neutral. It is based on productivity and what the employee brings to the business. Hard work is rewarded. Piss and moan and you will have the opportunity to find utopia elsewhere.
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    • Posted by CircuitGuy 8 years, 2 months ago
      It's not just the physical requirements. There's not much value in muscle. The value is what you learn on the job. If you take years off the job or dial back to part time for a decade or more, all things being equal you get the same amount of job experience someone who did not reduce his work.
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      • Posted by $ allosaur 8 years, 2 months ago
        Value in muscle depends on the job.
        I've never seen a Krispy Kreme Donut delivery lady.
        You'd think delivering donuts would be easy for a girl because most of it consists of driving along a route.. Uh-uh.
        Heavy lifting is involved and I had that job when the summer heat in the back of the truck would almost make me gag.
        Why the donuts did not melt is beyond me.
        Recall taking sore muscles home too.
        Never saw a lady lumberjack on the History Channel either.
        Seen women hunt gators, though.
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  • Posted by term2 8 years, 2 months ago
    Although a politically incorrect point I will raise- women are worth less than men a lot of times:
    1) They can have babies and will miss work and may take time off and you have to take them back after their parental leave.
    2) They have children and need to attend to them, often during work hours.
    3) Work at home doesnt fly with women who have kids running around distracting them
    4) They tend to need more medical care and are off work more for doctors appointments
    Again- politically correct, but at the end of the year, they cost more than most men do (at least the women who will have babies)
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  • Posted by DrZarkov99 8 years, 2 months ago
    Every time the gender equality issue comes up, it reminds me of my experiences during the President Carter years. One instance in particular stands out: a feminazi was bleating to a congressional committee about how the physical requirements for the military were sexist, and that it was unreasonable to require a female soldier to have to throw a grenade over 15 yards, when she felt that 10 yards was much more reasonable. All the Army General had to say in response was, "Given that the lethal radius of a grenade blast is 15 yards . . ."
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  • Posted by Herb7734 8 years, 2 months ago
    Frustrated and Angry?
    Listen up Ledbetter. I figured out how much I paid in Social Security after taxes. I then figured how much that amount would have yielded had I been able to put it into one of my worst investments. The way I see it, the Government owes me a very large, very tidy sum. Not to mention what they owe my wife.
    Thank you very much, FDR.
    More women are graduating from college than men. Recent studies show that the income gap, is in reality closed once pregnancy times are factored in. More women are CEOs than ever before. We may be turning into a Matriarchal society. Don't get me wrong, I love being taken care of by women. I have a feeling, however, that most women are not so hot on the idea. I'm just sayin'.
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    • Posted by johnpe1 8 years, 2 months ago
      my wife loves taking care of me when I need it, and
      vice versa. . I'm just not sick often enough! -- j
      .
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      • Posted by Herb7734 8 years, 2 months ago
        Mine too (I think).
        but we're from a different kind of generations.
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        • Posted by johnpe1 8 years, 2 months ago
          K was a medical secretary and helper for 28-plus years,
          so she can really help. . but she is only 61. -- j
          .
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          • Posted by Herb7734 8 years, 2 months ago
            In my wife's long and varied career, she was many things and for a while, she was a CNA (Certified Nurse's Assistant) and she learned lots of MD stuff and can take better care of me than I can. Usually I don't need much help except when I do something stupid and fall.
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            • Posted by johnpe1 8 years, 2 months ago
              oh, yes! . you got a great one, too ! . at one point, I was
              taking too much lasix, along with prednisone and warfarin,
              and K called an ambulance when I fell. . crawled to the
              couch. . when I stood up, my blood pressure dropped
              to 65/40. . it was a little hard, with emphysema, to
              keep the O2 flowing to the brain! -- j
              .
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  • Posted by johnpe1 8 years, 2 months ago
    the force of federal-government-choices re-direct the
    use of profits for their priorities, from the EPA to the
    IRS. . why is the economy in the doldrums? . that's why! -- j
    .
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  • Posted by rbunce 8 years, 2 months ago
    Not all employees in the same "category" receive the same compensation. Would it be OK if all lowered to least common compensation?
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  • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 8 years, 2 months ago
    And that's the way it's always been,

    I read a column the other day that suggested that women often get paid the same or more otherwise, if paying women less was all that pervasive then only women would be employed.
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