Great example of false premises/loose consequents

Posted by $ blarman 10 years, 1 month ago to Culture
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So the real cause is not the game, but the partying that goes on afterwards leading to excess drinking and an even greater excess in bad judgment.

If you are a woman in college, what this really should tell you is not to get drunk or hang out with men who do because it significantly increases your chance of assault.
SOURCE URL: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-12-29/reports-of-rape-rise-on-college-football-game-days


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  • Posted by freedomforall 10 years, 1 month ago
    Where are the Ferengi when there is an enormous free market solution to be invented?
    http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Sy...
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    • Posted by $ 10 years, 1 month ago
      +1 for Star Trek reference!

      I found the Ferengi to be vastly overplayed in ST:TNG. The first encounter had them complaining that Yar was wearing clothing and had these ridiculous energy whips. Then you had the one who had a vendetta against Picard.

      I much preferred Quark in ST:DS9. You saw the business side and the avarice, but you could also see where he recognized his own welfare was dependent on others - especially his host! One thing I did appreciate was how they weren't nuanced at all. The Ferengi were as straightforward as any Vulcan - just based on a different ultimate goal.
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      • Posted by freedomforall 10 years, 1 month ago
        Just finished watching the original pilot for Star Trek. Jeffrey Hunter really missed the starship when he decided not to continue the series. (He would probably have lived a much longer life, too.)
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        • Posted by $ 10 years, 1 month ago
          Farpoint was one of the better episodes, with an original plot. I think I still prefer Jonathan Frakes (Commander Riker) with a beard, and the lilac-colored bodysuit and hairstyle for Troi were a wardrobe malfunction IMO. Some of the later episodes, however, were all about the latest "particle" or "wave", focusing so heavily on the physics aspect that they forgot they were supposed to be telling a story as well.
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          • Posted by freedomforall 10 years, 1 month ago
            Troi was a malfunction. She'd have been a redshirt on the first episode had I been directing. Beginning of the end for the franchise, with wimpy looter Pickard adding to the irrational confusion. Riker should have mutinied and formed the rebel alliance with the Ferengi. First adventure would have been capturing "Q" (another completely disgusting character) and exiling him to Sha Ka Ree (the planet with the "God" from Star Trek movie 5.)
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYW_l...
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            • Posted by $ 10 years, 1 month ago
              Lol.

              They wanted to rebuild the series using a kinder, gentler Federation which showed growth and maturity, preferring dialogue to conflict (see all the mediation-based episodes and over-emphasis on the Prime Directive. I think they were trying to paint themselves as the UN. [/sarcasm]

              With the Klingons, they wanted to show how they could reconcile with a warlike group. The thing most forget was that if it weren't for their own self-destruction of a primary planet, they wouldn't have been forced into dealing with the Federation on a non-war footing.

              With the Romulan they wanted to show a Cold War type of scenario, and I think they accomplished that pretty accurately.

              Until DS9, the Cardassians were more like the Chinese: they harbored aspirations of expansion and empire-building, but were stymied by a more advanced and economically-powerful adversary in the Federation. So they play the time game and pick at the edges, engaging in subterfuge and espionage while playing nice.

              One of the things that came out in the Dominion War was that sometimes, there is no way to settle disagreements. It's a matter of who has the biggest guns. The Dominion also represented a lot of unconventional warfare: the federation and its traditional allies were used to "battleship"-style tactics and confrontations. The Dominion introduced carriers and fighters similar to the differences between naval warfare changes between WWI and WWII.

              I think that they did characterize one thing correctly about the Federation, however: their complacency and slowness to respond until an overwhelming threat emerged (like the Borg). Then they panic and throw massive amounts of resources at the problem (Wolf 359) only to lose terribly. Only ingenuity in the end saved the day.
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              • Posted by $ jdg 10 years, 1 month ago
                ST was much too UN-like from its beginning. I thought Roddenberry's original vision of it as a Western should have been followed farther than it was.

                I also felt that some of its criminals, once redeemed, would have made great cops. How about giving Harry Mudd the job of capturing Q?
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                • Posted by CircuitGuy 10 years, 1 month ago
                  "I thought Roddenberry's original vision of it as a Western should have been followed farther than it was."
                  In some interviews he acted like he had to sell it as a Western b/c that's what the suits were buying at that time, but I agree the Western elements made the franchise what it is.
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      • Posted by CircuitGuy 10 years, 1 month ago
        They were beyond ridiculous in most episodes, esp early TNG. Their main virtue IMHO was the Dominion came up first in a Ferengi episode, misleading the viewer into thinking the Dominion was something goofy instead of something that would be key to the arc of the entire series.
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        • Posted by Herb7734 10 years, 1 month ago
          How did drunkenness and rape become a treatise on Star Trek? Although, I did enjoy the Ferengi bartender in the spin-off "Voyager." He was played by Armin Shimmerman who, if you look closely, shows Up in the Atlas Shrugged movie #2.
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  • Posted by Mamaemma 10 years, 1 month ago
    When my daughter started college, I told her if you and a guy get drunk and you go to his room, don't be surprised if he expects sex. I don't understand why the politically correct say otherwise. I told her she had to take responsibility for her "self" and be rational in her behavior.
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    • Posted by plusaf 10 years, 1 month ago
      My first reaction was that if parents didn't warn their kids about exactly that, it should be part of freshman orientation for the chronically stupid or naive. Or make a can of Mace part of the Welcome Baggie at Orientation...

      This is NOT Rocket Surgery, kids...
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  • Posted by Herb7734 10 years, 1 month ago
    I never understood the attraction of drunkenness. I liked a swig of fine adult beverages. I liked the mellow. I didn't like the disorientation and turning into a jackass. After getting blotto once or twice you'd think it would keep a rational person from continuing the practice. Oh wait, I did say rational, didn't I?
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    • Posted by term2 10 years, 1 month ago
      For me, the mellow part comes with a single glass of wine. Hard liquor just makes me sleepy or crazy- neither is a good thing.
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      • Posted by Herb7734 10 years, 1 month ago
        I enjoy a glass of wine especially with dinner. Hard liquor if you can call it that is a shot of single malt Scotch. I never developed a taste for beer, except on very hot days. However, It is all forbidden as the serpent's favorite tree in Eden.
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  • Posted by scojohnson 10 years, 1 month ago
    Well, first of all, it's Bloomberg reporting... the same ones trying to take your guns away because you (personally) are responsible for the x thousand firearm-deaths per year. Second, most girls are not really fans of football, they are there for the celebration and the party. When I was in college, yes, there were a few that were absolute sluts that liked to party, get drunk, and sleep with some dude. They were not all as pure as the driven snow, but these days they can also withdraw consent after the act, so ok, whatever. Third, I'll assume they inflate their numbers already, so we'll use the lower end of their range. 253 additional rapes across 128 campuses (per year). Really? Did they ever think that maybe it is just because most weekends, the kids that are in driving range from home go home for the weekend to raid the parents' pantry & toilet paper stockpile? I have a college junior.. that is exactly what he does... He goes to Chico, CA, during the week there are 15,000 students there, on the weekend it empties to maybe 1000 of them left. If you are not there, you don't get raped. The football games would tend to drag a few remaining that have tickets, and maybe just being there will inflate the stat versus being at home at mom & dad's house and inflating the stat for some other locale.

    Don't you love random statistics that are mostly coincidence that have no causality apparent?
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    • Posted by plusaf 10 years, 1 month ago
      I stopped respecting Bloomberg some years ago after reading a few too many articles that drew really crappy conclusions from illogical data analysis.... also around the same time I realized that Bloomberg, himself, as Mayor of NYC, deserved (earned) virtually no respect from me for his ultra-lib Control-Freak attitude.
      Now I laugh at both of them, but I certainly don't look to the publisher for any wisdom. Whatever.
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  • Posted by $ WilliamShipley 10 years, 1 month ago
    It may be the game and not the partying. Studies have shone that testosterone increases in sports fans whose team has won and decreases in those whose team has lost.
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    • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 10 years, 1 month ago
      True enough but the fights between fans seemed to be started when the home town team loses and the away team and fans are departing....1969 Fayetteville, Arkansas. Longhorns vs Razorbacks. The hogs led and lost by one point in the final seconds of the game...and it wasn't the first time. We had the President, two governors and Billy Graham the famous minister there...oh well...no loss of testosterone with the losing fans that day. They reminded me of books about the gladiators. The mob howling for blood.
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  • Posted by johnpe1 10 years, 1 month ago
    if more men had a sense of respect for the women
    in their lives, this would not be the problem it is.
    the way I was raised, women were considered special
    and worthy of honor. . where have we gone? -- j
    .
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    • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 10 years, 1 month ago
      Where have they gone? The one's we are supposed to accord being worthy of honor. Few and far between by my cynical viewpoint. Those that reached that standard are very special. Now we get 'starter marriages VERY cynically planned to create a retirement income via three divorces perhaps four. We get yammering for rights but refusal of responsibility. We get the most rabid turning against everything they said they believed in in a shake of the proverbial lambs tail and turning against those they swore to protect and uplift. No excusing the males of the species but the last time I opened a door for a woman with a full arm load of whatever and she verbally assaulted me for doing so...I let the door swing back, turned by back and walked. Big NOW button came into view as the packages dropped and scattered everywhere. I was gratified to hear applause from men and women alike. The funny part was she started crying. We, me and the onlookers, all stood and watched do the helpless act. Then went on about our business. Not heartless though. Next day same store I opened a door for the same situation and received a warm smile and a big thank you. When I left someone returned the courtesy. That's the kind you are talking about...we have gone nowhere it's ingrained. Nowadays I hear they dumb ass guys don't buy corsages for their prom dates for fear they'll be sneered at and ridiculed. X+Y=Zero.
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  • Posted by LibertyBelle 10 years, 1 month ago
    I do not condone assault against women, but,as a
    practical matter, it is better not to give possible as-
    sailants any advantage. I realized long ago that it
    is better not to get into a car with a man you don't
    know, (unless it's a cab driver driving his cab), and I don't mean just if you know his name, or
    have known him a few weeks. I mean you should know him well enough to know he is "safe". And, of course, you should not get drunk
    (which a teetotaler does not have to worry much
    about). And it's also better not to be alone with
    a man, without any other people nearby. And, if
    you follow certain conduct rules I can tell you,
    you can live a long time without being assaulted,
    or at least, even an assault may not be suc-
    cessful, and you can get out of it. In fact, with
    real success, you can still be an old maid at
    64. (However, success in certain other areas
    I cannot tell you how to achieve).
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  • Posted by Esceptico 10 years, 1 month ago
    All I can say is I never liked spectator sports, so I was never exposed to tipsy women trying to rape me. However, now I understand the chances are higher if I “hang out” with mutton-heads who love watching concussion causing sports, my chances will improve. I can’t wait for Super Bowl to see if I get lucky.
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  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 10 years, 1 month ago
    But they are away from Mom, Dad, the local preacher. Are heavily influenced by negative role models like teachers, TV, and a culture with no morals of which to speak. Then to how many are not college material to begin with. One doesn't need brains to fill out a student loan application as we witnessed a month ago,
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 10 years, 1 month ago
    Law abiding citizens should be prepared to stop criminals instead of having to avoid drinking or hanging out with people who drink b/c of fear of crime. Instead of saying "if you're a woman, you need to be careful", I say "if you're a criminal, you need to be careful."
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    • Posted by $ Thoritsu 10 years, 1 month ago
      If more people behaved this way, a lot less trouble would be present. Instead most people ignore such trouble, just like they ignore picking up a stray piece of trash they avert their eyes from.
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    • Posted by $ 10 years, 1 month ago
      One does not become a criminal until after the commission of a crime, however. (And really, one is only an alleged criminal until after conviction at trial.) What I would focus on is not putting yourself into the position where you might become a victim in the first place. I'm not saying not to be prepared to defend one's self - not at all. Sometimes we don't choose our circumstances. But when we can, we should.

      I had an colonel just tell us at an emergency communications meeting that the best intelligence source is the Mark I Eyeball and that when you get the feeling that something isn't right, you should pay attention. He called it situational awareness and drilled into us the need for constant situational awareness.
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      • Posted by CircuitGuy 10 years, 1 month ago
        I agree with all of this. In my concealed carry class, they told us if there's a place or situation where you feel it's likely you might have to use a gun, consider not going at all.
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  • Posted by illucio 10 years, 1 month ago
    We have to teach girls to respect themselves in order to have self-respecting women. And as to excess well, we must adress these matters truthfully for we live in a society where all kinds of drugs are up for grabs, the most illegal the fastest to attain. Again, education is key. Sexual education, Emotional Education, etc. If this cannot be achieved in the household, maybe it´s time we adjusted Public and Federal Education and Laws to Help Protect Our Future Citizens. Not only teach them how to drive, which is great too. Applied sciences, especially those that many of despise such as sociology, psychology, etc. must be rendered in the program from an early age.

    Just An Opinion
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    • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 10 years, 1 month ago
      Complexity does not automatically suggest centralization of power.You have a full time job mananging your own life. Your task increases exponentially when you try to control the lives of others and beyond reason when you try to control the lives of millions.
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