A Christian endorsement of Ayn Rand?

Posted by $ blarman 12 years, 3 months ago to Philosophy
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The author is a lawyer and legal professor who maintains his own blog on legal issues. I find his reasoning to be pretty solid in most cases and was gratified to find that while theologically he didn't see eye to eye with Ayn Rand, he could and did appreciate her economic philosophies and endorsed Rand's books as insights into economic matters.


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  • Posted by Hiraghm 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Very well said. And I think also explanatory as to why some of the Christian participants are feeling a bit aggravated at present.
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  • Posted by jimjamesjames 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    RE, animals. I have three psycho cats. I take care of them because there is a return on my investment in time and money. Simple. And, by the way, when I leave them for days on end, I only put out water to tide them over. They hunt (I live, surrounded by a thousand acres of sage, greasewood, rabbit brush with lots of prey) and, as they did for thousands of years before domestication, take care of themselves. Elvis (black Angora monster) is quite adept at killing and eating cottontail rabbits.

    However, my concern re the late night "guilt sales," is that the ROI is negligible and questionable as to efficacy.

    As to humans, some have been taught that the "social safety net" is a good place to live. But, that's another discussion.
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  • Posted by jimjamesjames 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I agree; the issue is perceived value, whether it's Hollywood, religion, or a bag of pinto beans.

    And I concede. Churches (religions) are not moochers. They simply commit fraud (IMO, selling a perceived value for my "contribution") What they are selling, i.e., salvation, 72 virgins, everlasting life, forgiveness of sins, etc., is not, IMO, worth suspending rational thought. Except for the periods in history when they initiated physical force and, thus, were "looters," the place of a church (religion) in my life is not worth the return on investment. Those who wish to participate in religion do so, IMO, because they are lacking in internal validation and, thus, as Eric Hoffer says, looking outside themselves for substance, a cause greater than themselves. The "You are a sinner and not worthy and must come to Jesus, Mohammed, et al." is a great scam. Watch Jimmy Swaggert (who, I see, is back on TV). So be it. Again, re Jefferson, if they do not initiate force to take my treasure, okay by me.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    This is not a site for Objectivists. It is "Galt's Gulch" a site created to support the movies based on AR's book Atlas Shrugged.
    One of the tenets of Objectivism of which Ms. Rand based the actions of her characters, is atheism. Thus, this aspect of the movies - and characters, and just life in general, is that premise that one must ascribe to atheism to ascribe to the other tenets of AS. I, for one, and seemingly several others, reject that proposition. We only look to present a different viewpoint on why that philosophical standpoint is invalid, from our perspective.
    You're free not to read those posts if it offends you so much.
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  • Posted by rlewellen 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Rand's teaching was not rational, she taught that the only right she recognized was property. What is a right? She wanted to get rid of the Bill of Rights, remove this country's culture and plunder. it into submission. That is not a very productive objective.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    So caring for animals is not a valuable "product?" The method of their financing may not be palatable to you, but that does not negate the value of the activity.
    And as for "selling guilt" - you are still free to choose to give or not to give. You've been "sold" nothing unless you choose to complete the transaction.
    And don't go extrapolating that to taking care of my fellow man, they can take care of themselves. Animals are different.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You called all churches "moochers." I say that there is value received for value given. That does not describe a "moocher" relationship.
    The fact that you derive no value does not mean that there is no value.
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    Posted by rlewellen 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Did you let those seven year olds have a lunch after working 14 hours a day?
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  • Posted by LetsShrug 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Who said "stupid"? Don't put words into my mouth.
    Irrational, illogical.... never said 'stupid'.
    This is a site for objectivist... I don't visit religious forums and try to cram objectivism down their throats..why do YOU come in HERE do that? It just seems odd to me and I can't get anybody to answer the question... I keep getting slammed for not having an open mind (um..I opened my mind and starting asking myself hard question about my religious beliefs and THIS is where it took me..) Or I get told how we're all welcome here. I think some are confused by the whole point of the gulch... there was no church and no mention of bible studies going on. It's a good question, I wish someone would answer it rationally.
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  • Posted by barwick11 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Do I come in here and say "Billy Bob objectivist believes XYZ, therefore, objectivism is stupid"?

    Then why do you do the same with the Church?
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  • Posted by jimjamesjames 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Hardly. Hollywood offers a product; each may buy if it fits their needs and wants. Want to see the ultimate (IMO) "moocher"? Watch the late night infomercials for the Humane Society. Talk about "selling" guilt!!
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  • Posted by jimjamesjames 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    A willing buyer, a willing seller. It's no one else's business. "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are 20 gods, or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." Jefferson.

    I might note that my daughter is a pastor in a church in Oregon; I am an atheist. Neither of us tries to sell anything to the other. No force, no fraud. Perfect relationship.
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  • Posted by chcollinsjr 12 years, 3 months ago
    I don't understand the fuss. I read The Fountainhead, We the Living, and Atlas Shrugged from 1958 to 1960 and Anthem in 1961 and recently reread Atlas Shrugged. My appreciation of the lessons of Atlas Shrugged and my Christianity get along very well, thank you. I think God's greatest gift to humans is the sovereign, independent, individual human spirit and I find this completely consistent with the lessons of Atlas Shrugged and with Christianity.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Wow. You really need to loosen up your shorts. They're cutting off the oxygen delivery to your brain - which is clearly shoved way up your rectum.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Yet those who "buy" seem to gain something of value. Your premise needs some checking.
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  • Posted by barwick11 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Where do you get that from? "A" Church is not "the" Church. "The" Church is governed by the Bible. "A" Church is governed by whatever they so desire.
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  • Posted by jimjamesjames 12 years, 3 months ago in reply to this comment.
    All churches, all religions, are "moochers" in that they sell something, without substance, to get something of substance, my treasure. Looters simply take it.

    Last time I checked, the Christian church was teaching "Thou Shalt Not Steal."
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