I agree that the scrutiny of all public officials should be thorough this article is just as biased as all the articles he refers to. Suggesting that the violence against police rate is low because the number of police killed in attacks is at an all time low is ignoring a lot of other factors. The militarization of the police is a major factor and that would tend to make that militarization appear to be a good thing.
There is still nobody talking about the effects of the laws that pit "us against them" in just about every aspect of our lives. What this article and the prior debates on here have not mentioned (that I have seen) is that once upon a time there were 500 deaths per year and that every time... how do I stress this enough?... EVERY SINGLE TIME an officer knocks on a door, or walks up next a drivers window or even sits down to lunch at the doughnut shop, EVERY SINGLE TIME, could be his last. Even with the odds so greatly in his favor, it is still his life on the line. It's not a gamble on a lottery ticket, it's his life. That's gotta have a huge effect on how you approach things. Yeah, he signed up for it but nobody is immune to that kind of pressure. And you can hardly blame him for wanting a fully equipped swat team behind him at every traffic stop.
Cops used to come from the community and they used to be trained as part of the community but too many laws have turned them into "THEM" and us into "That Guy" or "The One". We are being separated and it is hard to see it as not intentional.
An interesting question in the article, which I'd like to address:
"Imagine that teachers were objecting to the fact that they were increasingly being monitored, criticized, and videotaped, and that as a result of that, they felt like they couldn’t actually do their job of teaching (but of course, they felt compelled to actually show up to work and continue to collect a paycheck!). What level of sympathy would we have?"
Well, this is happening. A "movement" to increase teacher accountability by tracking children's performance through their teachers, rating teachers based on how well they teach the subject, standardized testing, etc. are all attempts to increasingly monitor teachers. And how are they reacting? Actual work stoppage strikes are but one such reaction.
But here is where the analogy breaks down and how an aspect the author of the piece comes into the solution. How do we monitor the police? How do we police the police?, if you prefer.
There is a solution, and those verbally attacking police as a group are already behind it. But they are behind it for the wrong reasons and those reasons seem to prevent many departments from being behind it. If you haven't yet figured it out, I am talking about body cams.
Most of the media, buying into the narrative that police are somehow inherently evil, racist, and brutal bastards push cop cams as a solution to poor police behavior. But the reality is they are a solution to poor citizen behavior. I'm trying to find the link to the results PDF, but in the meantime I can summarize why the purported cause is incorrect.
Complaints drop when cameras are worn True. And the internal research departments have done rightly proclaim they don't know if it was due to behavioral changes by police or citizens. However, DoJ research shows a different view. Complaints are withdrawn at a high rate when the complainant is informed the department will review video and/or audio recordings. This strongly implies many of the complaints are either frivolous (true), the complainants know their behavior on the tape may not help their case. These strong lean toward the cause of the reduction being a result of citizen behavioral changes.
Reduction in use of Force Again, true. However, once again the assumption that it is officer behavioral changes causing this is unwarranted. Surveys of police who have body cameras about field experiences show a strong effect is the de-escalation by the citizen or perp/suspect. This is noted by officers who have come to use "this is all being recorded" as a direct and effective means to calm down citizens. No surprise given how arrogant many of us seem to be wrt. police interaction. There is a sense that we have more power than the officer, combined with a right sense that there are many avenues for an officer to find you doing something wrong somehow.
The key here is the direct and confirmed reduction in hostility by the citizen being recorded. The vast, vast, majority of force escalations are in line with proper procedures. By reducing the initiation of the cycle by informing the citizen they are being recorded thus deflating their confidence in being able to falsely portray the interaction, the net result of less escalations is welcome. But if we continue to believe and put forth it is because cops are changing their behavior not we the people we will continue to vilify the entire occupation thus escalating the entire thing before police <-> citizen contact.
Cops Change Behavior on Camera Undoubtedly there is likely some change for some. But the data shows the change is not in the actual interaction. The vast majority of documented change is in reviewing the footage internally and correcting mistakes in procedure. But looking deeper you see it isn't in improper use of force but in things that decrease the officer's personal safety.
As long as we accept the claim that cameras make cops nicer, and refuse to see the reality of it, we will not se each progress. The extremists will always cry that there is still something missing - that data is somehow deleted, or that the angles aren't right to show the behavior, and so on. But the vast majority of people in this country can still be rational about it and thus upon exposure to the reality accept it. Hell, in my discussion with people many admit (as DoJ surveys ALSO show) that they would or do change their behavior knowing the cop is recording them.
Thus I submit this is indeed one place we can make a difference based on reason, provided we stick to reason.
And yes, jbrenner, your local experience may to jive with the national statistics but that doesn't change the fact that overall we are at a major low, and that the trend has been positive (meaning down on the chart) for a long time now, and continues to be.
I do think some of the vilification is a non-conscious reaction to society putting police on a pedestal for so long. Not that I agree with either.
To restate a former post series from May (source Cato Institute). Across the entire spectrum of crimes the percentage of dirty cops as opposed to police population is one percent. Across the entire spectrum of crime committed by the general public as a percentage of population it's again one percent. Sometimes lower sometimes higher but rarely out of the .5 to 1.5 area and and then not excessively.
The 1994 Act signed into law by Clinton required all local police to send in activities reports to a central location. the percentages vary but I've yet to see one over twenty percent.
One reason was lack of personnel to do what is seen as excessive government paperwork leading nowhere. Same thing that happened to the schools.
CATO ran a study for some time with followups to get their figures. It's somewhere under the heading of excessive police force or brutality. From that the one percent figure was derived. Another source we put in this forum was Assoc. of Chiefs of Police but it confined itself to the problem of high speed chases resulting in a death. They did come up with something to offer for positive improvement and correction. The total deaths was one per day or 365 a year
Reportedly there was a very recent push on the information reporting of police activities and crime from the Obama Administration. I found no evidence for the Clinton Administration nor the Bush Administration.
There is however a not well managed and certainly badly researched effort that leaves out a lot of information from the anti-cop crows with a lot of foreign, extremist and left wing media involved. National Guardian and Washington Post come to mind quite often.
The sad part is it incites emotions but does next to nothing to solve any problems. Then the Obama initiative to federalize all local police as part of his protective echelon build up came to light. So now we have the reason.
Is it important? The annual total of police shootings or police being killed and add in the high speed chases with deaths are statistically insignificant in a nation well over 300 million.
BUT think of it in terms of driving on freeway psoted for 65 or 70 doing 80 plus with ten feet or so between cars.
What IF one percent of all that traffic were drunk, on drugs, prone to road rage, unlicensed, uninsured etc. etc. etc. Add to that eating cereal, putting on makeup talking on cell phones, trying to stop family fights looking for a CD or tuning a radio station. That's one out of every 100 vehicles during rush hour.
One of our nations baseball players said there was nothing more dangerous on the road than a women with a cellphone. Got in trouble. But he wasn't wrong. I've flagged enough traffic to know that by simple observation. Make it a teenager in a red car it's worse. John Rocker was forced to apolgize. No way I have to and won't
So take that all to familiar scenario and go the one percent findings of CATO. YES it's important. But it's marginalized, sensationalized and used to incite emotions and riots not change.
Why do I smell secular progressives and the ACLU behind the recent publicity.
And my thank to the 99 percent who somehow manage to keep it together and do a good job.
focus one the one percent how did they get hired what are the common factors. make changes. I can support that on a national basis.
Not seeing it used to create a fracking police state
(If you aren't part of the solution you are the problem.)
I know what the article said. It largely contradicts my local experience. Violence by police and against police is definitely at its highest in my county's history, as acknowledged in the last month by the local sheriff on talk radio. Much of what is happening is being staged, but a lot of "copycat" violence is being condoned.
The highest number of police death by shootings and murder was 1930 at +/- 300 during the peak of Prohibition. This year there will be more police deaths from traffic/auto accidents than by shootings as is true for the last couple of decades or so. In communities where police have been mandated to wear body or head mounted cameras, citizen complaints, beat-up arrestees, and such have drastically dropped. Cop doesn't want to do his job (as he defines it)--GREAT.
There is still nobody talking about the effects of the laws that pit "us against them" in just about every aspect of our lives. What this article and the prior debates on here have not mentioned (that I have seen) is that once upon a time there were 500 deaths per year and that every time... how do I stress this enough?... EVERY SINGLE TIME an officer knocks on a door, or walks up next a drivers window or even sits down to lunch at the doughnut shop, EVERY SINGLE TIME, could be his last. Even with the odds so greatly in his favor, it is still his life on the line. It's not a gamble on a lottery ticket, it's his life. That's gotta have a huge effect on how you approach things. Yeah, he signed up for it but nobody is immune to that kind of pressure. And you can hardly blame him for wanting a fully equipped swat team behind him at every traffic stop.
Cops used to come from the community and they used to be trained as part of the community but too many laws have turned them into "THEM" and us into "That Guy" or "The One". We are being separated and it is hard to see it as not intentional.
"Imagine that teachers were objecting to the fact that they were increasingly being monitored, criticized, and videotaped, and that as a result of that, they felt like they couldn’t actually do their job of teaching (but of course, they felt compelled to actually show up to work and continue to collect a paycheck!). What level of sympathy would we have?"
Well, this is happening. A "movement" to increase teacher accountability by tracking children's performance through their teachers, rating teachers based on how well they teach the subject, standardized testing, etc. are all attempts to increasingly monitor teachers. And how are they reacting? Actual work stoppage strikes are but one such reaction.
But here is where the analogy breaks down and how an aspect the author of the piece comes into the solution. How do we monitor the police? How do we police the police?, if you prefer.
There is a solution, and those verbally attacking police as a group are already behind it. But they are behind it for the wrong reasons and those reasons seem to prevent many departments from being behind it. If you haven't yet figured it out, I am talking about body cams.
Most of the media, buying into the narrative that police are somehow inherently evil, racist, and brutal bastards push cop cams as a solution to poor police behavior. But the reality is they are a solution to poor citizen behavior. I'm trying to find the link to the results PDF, but in the meantime I can summarize why the purported cause is incorrect.
Complaints drop when cameras are worn
True. And the internal research departments have done rightly proclaim they don't know if it was due to behavioral changes by police or citizens. However, DoJ research shows a different view. Complaints are withdrawn at a high rate when the complainant is informed the department will review video and/or audio recordings. This strongly implies many of the complaints are either frivolous (true), the complainants know their behavior on the tape may not help their case. These strong lean toward the cause of the reduction being a result of citizen behavioral changes.
Reduction in use of Force
Again, true. However, once again the assumption that it is officer behavioral changes causing this is unwarranted. Surveys of police who have body cameras about field experiences show a strong effect is the de-escalation by the citizen or perp/suspect. This is noted by officers who have come to use "this is all being recorded" as a direct and effective means to calm down citizens. No surprise given how arrogant many of us seem to be wrt. police interaction. There is a sense that we have more power than the officer, combined with a right sense that there are many avenues for an officer to find you doing something wrong somehow.
The key here is the direct and confirmed reduction in hostility by the citizen being recorded. The vast, vast, majority of force escalations are in line with proper procedures. By reducing the initiation of the cycle by informing the citizen they are being recorded thus deflating their confidence in being able to falsely portray the interaction, the net result of less escalations is welcome. But if we continue to believe and put forth it is because cops are changing their behavior not we the people we will continue to vilify the entire occupation thus escalating the entire thing before police <-> citizen contact.
Cops Change Behavior on Camera
Undoubtedly there is likely some change for some. But the data shows the change is not in the actual interaction. The vast majority of documented change is in reviewing the footage internally and correcting mistakes in procedure. But looking deeper you see it isn't in improper use of force but in things that decrease the officer's personal safety.
As long as we accept the claim that cameras make cops nicer, and refuse to see the reality of it, we will not se each progress. The extremists will always cry that there is still something missing - that data is somehow deleted, or that the angles aren't right to show the behavior, and so on. But the vast majority of people in this country can still be rational about it and thus upon exposure to the reality accept it. Hell, in my discussion with people many admit (as DoJ surveys ALSO show) that they would or do change their behavior knowing the cop is recording them.
Thus I submit this is indeed one place we can make a difference based on reason, provided we stick to reason.
And yes, jbrenner, your local experience may to jive with the national statistics but that doesn't change the fact that overall we are at a major low, and that the trend has been positive (meaning down on the chart) for a long time now, and continues to be.
I do think some of the vilification is a non-conscious reaction to society putting police on a pedestal for so long. Not that I agree with either.
To restate a former post series from May (source Cato Institute). Across the entire spectrum of crimes the percentage of dirty cops as opposed to police population is one percent. Across the entire spectrum of crime committed by the general public as a percentage of population it's again one percent. Sometimes lower sometimes higher but rarely out of the .5 to 1.5 area and and then not excessively.
The 1994 Act signed into law by Clinton required all local police to send in activities reports to a central location. the percentages vary but I've yet to see one over twenty percent.
One reason was lack of personnel to do what is seen as excessive government paperwork leading nowhere. Same thing that happened to the schools.
CATO ran a study for some time with followups to get their figures. It's somewhere under the heading of excessive police force or brutality. From that the one percent figure was derived. Another source we put in this forum was Assoc. of Chiefs of Police but it confined itself to the problem of high speed chases resulting in a death. They did come up with something to offer for positive improvement and correction. The total deaths was one per day or 365 a year
Reportedly there was a very recent push on the information reporting of police activities and crime from the Obama Administration. I found no evidence for the Clinton Administration nor the Bush Administration.
There is however a not well managed and certainly badly researched effort that leaves out a lot of information from the anti-cop crows with a lot of foreign, extremist and left wing media involved. National Guardian and Washington Post come to mind quite often.
The sad part is it incites emotions but does next to nothing to solve any problems. Then the Obama initiative to federalize all local police as part of his protective echelon build up came to light. So now we have the reason.
Is it important? The annual total of police shootings or police being killed and add in the high speed chases with deaths are statistically insignificant in a nation well over 300 million.
BUT think of it in terms of driving on freeway psoted for 65 or 70 doing 80 plus with ten feet or so between cars.
What IF one percent of all that traffic were drunk, on drugs, prone to road rage, unlicensed, uninsured etc. etc. etc. Add to that eating cereal, putting on makeup talking on cell phones, trying to stop family fights looking for a CD or tuning a radio station. That's one out of every 100 vehicles during rush hour.
One of our nations baseball players said there was nothing more dangerous on the road than a women with a cellphone. Got in trouble. But he wasn't wrong. I've flagged enough traffic to know that by simple observation. Make it a teenager in a red car it's worse. John Rocker was forced to apolgize. No way I have to and won't
So take that all to familiar scenario and go the one percent findings of CATO. YES it's important. But it's marginalized, sensationalized and used to incite emotions and riots not change.
Why do I smell secular progressives and the ACLU behind the recent publicity.
And my thank to the 99 percent who somehow manage to keep it together and do a good job.
focus one the one percent how did they get hired what are the common factors. make changes. I can support that on a national basis.
Not seeing it used to create a fracking police state
(If you aren't part of the solution you are the problem.)
This year there will be more police deaths from traffic/auto accidents than by shootings as is true for the last couple of decades or so.
In communities where police have been mandated to wear body or head mounted cameras, citizen complaints, beat-up arrestees, and such have drastically dropped.
Cop doesn't want to do his job (as he defines it)--GREAT.