oh. look how conditioned I've become in here

I am not a hippie...no, I refuse to coexist with non-Objectivists...for, a truly Objectivist society cannot exist if we must compromise our morals with the non-Objectivist. That is a contradiction to Objectivism.

that's because you are uncommon, duh

And not 5,000 1 oz gold coins?

no really, I wanted 5000 points

whoa. I'm all teared up :)

I hope you're not one of those people who have a "Coexist" sticker on your vehicle. Question: How does one "coexist" with a civilization who's bent on killing you simply because you don't believe them? If you think I'm talking about Christianity, you're way off course. Christians tolerate, to the point they die for it. Just ask the Coptic Christians in Egypt. Ask them how the Religion of Peace is tolerating them.

Anyways, you and I don't have much in common. Welcome to the Gulch anyway.

I'd like to be the first to congratulate you on your 5k. And no, I'm not talking about running. =)

Let's Shrug is going to eat you for dinner. lol
do you agree to take antibiotics? you are killing things for your life. When you wash yourself, you are killing organisms. what is this about? the cute, cuddly things you won't eat?

snort. I call it food. hahahahha

I actually find your "what if" situation quite humorous. So, in what event would I be forced to kill animals to survive? There would need to be no vegetation left upon Earth. Now, without vegetation, there would be no animals left. So which animals, exactly, do you suppose we should eat in this situation? Sure, then animals could eat each other...but the bigger animals feast upon the vegetarian ones, so they would not survive long. After that, there would only be one type of animal left. By your scenario, you would kill fellow man and eat of his flesh. That is against moral code, for man shall not harm another man unless he has attacked first. So, that is why I see a "what if" scenario as useless. Ayn Rand followed a philosophy of "reality is reality" and that unless you can prove it real, there is no use as calling it real.

Are you implying my morals are waverable? Different things could happen, no one knows with complete detail how things might go down and being prepared for different things does not make me less moral. I am certain without a doubt I will kill animals to survive if need be. We are hunters so it's not a problem. Call it slaughter if you like...I call it food.

I never said they were equal. In fact, I said they were incapable of morality and philosophy. But that doesn't mean we must be. I have sworn to only threaten a life if it threatens mine first...and so I put that for all animals. If I can go my whole life as vegetarian, as a human can live happily without slaughtering an animal, then I see it as avoiding useless slaughter. It's a personal choice. We have no right to police animals, for they do not understand law and will never understand. So, I am not saying apply human morality to the animal kingdom. I am simply saying that I try to keep myself as far away from their behavior as possible. They may kill, but that is because they have no philosophy. I have philosophy and so I do not kill.

hey, Ryan. please consider weighing in on the pregnant dad post.

so if you are a vegetarian for moral reasons, how do you explain how this is consistent with Objectivism? Are all animals morally equal? if so, should we put a lion in jail for eating a zebra?
animals and people are not the same. let's start from choice vs. morality

Ah, but you misunderstand. I would not change my morals for any reason. Would I become a Christian if I was the only atheist left? No. Would Ayn Rand have quit Objectivism if nobody followed her? No. My morals are the one thing that will not waver. If I did not trust my own morals, why have any at all? And I plan my future with certainty. Do you think Ayn Rand ever asked "what if this doesn't work out" or Dagny Taggart asked "well what if this fails"? No. If they had, Objectivism would not exist and the Taggart line would have been sold at the beginning of Atlas Shrugged.

No, but I would kill an animal so my kids don't starve. You try not to ask "what if"? How do you plan your future in today's climate without asking what if?

What if I was starving? I try not to ask "what if"...but for the sake of answering...no I would not. If you were poor, would you become a looter?

If you were starving would you kill an animal to survive? Just curious.