...and there is really no good way out of a poison pill...

Sigh.

Jan

From the time I was in my teens, it was clear to me that SS was not going to work and that I was probably never going to receive it - certainly not rely on it. Since I am one of the least 'street wise' people I know, I labor to understand why this was not apparent to everyone.

Jan

That is the part that most people forget. Our infrastructure and affluence are so deep that there is a big lag between cause and effect. This has led to the socialists thinking that their programs were working when all that was happening was that they were in the lag phase.

Jan

Rand Paul recently introduced a bill that requires members of Congress to themselves be subject to the laws and regulations they pass...

Jan

Is there any reasonable way you can get the money out of your IRA and invest it in something tangible and more difficult for the gov to take?

Jan

Very true! Austerity to them means that we the taxpayers get to try to live on less...scaling back on government is NEVER part of the equation.

I love how liberal consider raising taxes part of an austerity program.

As one of those now receiving Social Security, I can tell you I've voted repeatedly for any politician I could find who expressed an intent to revamp the program, but ironically, it turns out that those in favor of the Ponzi scheme have been strongly supported by younger voters who are now paying for my retirement. Don't blame us retirees (who, by the way, spent all of our working life "investing" in the scheme without any choice), who are more conservative than those who are being currently victimized.

Do I want to have my benefits cut? I don't think that will be a personal choice. In spite of the perception that government programs are a contract with the citizens, I have no doubt that there will be an excuse for breaking that contract, as there has been with Medicare ($500B of that fund transferred to support Obamacare). Even though I saved my own money in an IRA, I suspect that before long the government will find a way to raid those private savings, as there's no way they can resist the estimated $5T in those IRA, Keogh, and 401K accounts.

Under the US Constitution, payment on the sovereign debt of the United States is the first obligation of the President when spending money. It must be paid at the expense of all else.

I admit I am torn by this issue. How much is the US debt mine? Am I contractually bound to pay a debt incurred by a ship placed on its course 80 years ago by people now dead and kept there by 2 generations of corrupt politicians over which I had no control?

As for social security, those receiving it now are closer to the roots of this problem than I am and continued to vote for polticians who would not tamper with this ponsi scheme for which I am now paying.

Governments make laws. They do not have to live by them. There is no sanctity of contract with a government or any other protection racket.

Sovereign debt has the nature of an unconscionable contract. Politicians who have no moral right to bind their current constituents, let alone the unborn and those not of voting age, have bound them to future slavery. Bankers have been dealing with these obligations with full knowledge that they are only honored by inflating the money supply, from stealing without consent. It is fully within the moral rights of the constituents to repudiate this contract, and declare "not now, never again."

the only thing I would add, is that a re-structuring we allow for in US business practice. From the inception of the EU, we all knew this is what what happen. some partners were toxic. They took their poison pill.

https://news.yahoo.com/major-greek-bank-...

yes

What ever happened to the idea of the sanctity of a contract? Greece entered into a contract with the bankers, in which the bankers advanced Greece money with the promise by Greece that it would be repaid. I would think that Objectivists would favor the honoring of contracts. Syriza is incapable of resolving the problem because he is a Communist.

Washington needn't castigate Greece too badly; we've taken all of the same missteps to a greater or lesser degree. The simple fact is that our economy is so much more massive than theirs means it will take more time, but the end result will be the same.
The mills of the gods grind slowly.

Yup, Social Security is bankrupt. I shudder to even think about how DC is going to play that storm out. Greece is the word. Greece lightning, Greece lightning, Greece is (will be) everywhere..

I don't recall the exact numbers, but in order for the Social Security schemes work, there had to be something on the order of 23 workers per payee. It functioned correctly for many years. In order for it to continue, three things needed to remain constant or increase.
1). The death rate had to remain constant or increase.
2). The birth rate had to remain constant or increase
3). Wages needed to increase.

Well, we've violated not one, not two but all three of these conditions. By 2025, it's expected that we will be down to TWO workers per retiree. This isn't some theory folks, this is arithmetic.

I've often felt that repudiation was going to be the approach taken to Social Security. For many years, the Social Security tax has been a slush fund that government could borrow from and 'promise' to pay back when needed.

Very soon there will be more money going out then coming in and it will be a burden on the general fund not an asset.

At this point I expect the politicians to 'reform' Social Security from a mandatory pension plan to a pure welfare one and fund it out of taxes so that the 1% can pay their 'fair' share.

This may well involved canceling the debt to the Social Security trust fund as part of the reform.