Altrusm What does it really mean.

Posted by woodlema 11 years, 2 months ago to Philosophy
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Full Definition of ALTRUISM
1: unselfish regard for or devotion to the welfare of others
2: behavior by an animal that is not beneficial to or may be harmful to itself but that benefits others of its species.
Full Definition of SLAVE
1: a person held in servitude as the chattel of another
2: one that is completely subservient to a dominating influence
Full Definition of COMMUNISM
1a : a theory advocating elimination of private property
b : a system in which goods are owned in common and are available to all as needed
2capitalized
a : a doctrine based on revolutionary Marxian socialism and Marxism-Leninism that was the official ideology of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
b : a totalitarian system of government in which a single authoritarian party controls state-owned means of production
c : a final stage of society in Marxist theory in which the state has withered away and economic goods are distributed equitably

‘The Greater Good’ — “The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Or the one”

The Myth of the Greater Good
Politicians must stop acting like the ends justify the means.
Sheldon Richman | February 24, 2012
I—and most other people, I assume—grew up being taught that the end doesn’t justify the means. Basically, this is an injunction not to rationalize one’s behavior while using other people as mere means to one’s ends.


Altruism, Slavery, Communism, “The Greater Good.” “The Ends Justify the Means” are all at their core the same thing whereby one person or persons are slaves or forced into a position of sacrificial lamb for the benefit of others. They the same evil that has no place in a rational society.

Galt’s Gulch has had many, many comments referring to altruism, but no real discussion on what altruism really means, and how insidious it is. The phrase “Give Back” is a classic example. This phrase instills an innate subconscious guilt on those who “have” to sacrifice the product of their labor to those who did not earn or provide value to receive. To really appreciate this term altruism I want to hear from everyone on just what they “think” altruism is. Ayn Rand was very clear on altruism.

Ayn Rand - The Morality of Altruism
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51pMod2A...








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  • Posted by salta 11 years, 2 months ago
    If we ever use the word "altruism" in conversations about objectivism, I think it starts to drive a wedge between us and other people. The reason is the modern usage is so much more relaxed. Even decades ago, Rand realized she almost always needed to clarify her own usage (the original meaning "holding others as higher value than self"), because she knew her audience would assume she meant just charity or kindness.
    The primary rejection of Rand is because she was "against charity or kindness", and once people get that idea in their head they psychologically block any further understanding.
    I try to use the "higher value" phrase instead of the actual word, when talking to a non-objectivist, but would like your suggestions on how you approach the definition problem in conversations.
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    • Posted by $ DLCarr17 11 years, 2 months ago
      I agree with you salta. I try not to use the word altruism in discussions with people because they automatically assume that I'm against charity altogether. People seem to shut their ears and minds at the first hint you may be saying something that they disagree with. At that point trying to explain the difference between self sacrifice and charity does no good. I have found that starting from the point that I'm okay with charity as long as its not coerced from the giver in any way seems to keep them from shutting down altogether.
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      • Posted by Zenphamy 11 years, 2 months ago
        I don't like others trying to own words and their definitions.
        Words have identities through common usage over many, many years. That may mean that I have to clarify definitions in conversations with some that don't understand the word or have attached some negative emotional response to, but thats OK. It just deepens the conversation.
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        • Posted by 11 years, 2 months ago
          THAT is exactly why the specific definitions matter. To fully understand you MUST know what the specific meaning of a word or words were WHEN they were used and in context of the time.

          If I tell you I smoked a fag today that has a VERY different meaning in 2015 than it did back in the 1940's. Being Gay today very different today from 70 years ago. To play the game smear the queer is not the same meaning today as back in the 70's.

          So definitions AREE very important...
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  • Posted by fivedollargold 11 years, 2 months ago
    According to Social Exchange Theory a person weighs the costs and benefits of altruistic acts. As someone pointed out, this does not have to require something tangible. Social psychologists paid little attention to altruism prior to the murder of Kitty Genovese in the 1960's, when appriximately 40 bystanders refused to intervene as Winston Moseley killed her.
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  • Posted by fivedollargold 11 years, 2 months ago
    To Fivedollargold altruism means helping others of your own free will. It does not apply if the State takes from producers by force to give to moochers. This is simply state-sanctioned theft.
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    • Posted by $ WilliamShipley 11 years, 2 months ago
      I think the key distinction of altruism is that it be a self-sacrifice, that you derive no personal benefit from it. This may be why the left only supports military action when we have no national interest -- when it is altruistic.

      Now, as Rand points out it's perfectly reasonable to help others if you derive a benefit from doing so. That benefit doesn't even have to be tangible.

      I would also suggest that self-interested does not mean short-sighted. You can do things that you think will benefit you in the long run even if they have no short-term benefit.
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  • Posted by fivedollargold 11 years, 2 months ago
    Altruism involves self-sacrifice to the extent that you trade time and/or money to assist others. It does not mean you are psychologically deficient. John Galt was certainly not lacking in self-esteem when he chose to help Dagny out of the crashed plane.
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    • Posted by 11 years, 2 months ago
      Altruism is an involuntary self-sacrifice, coerced though guilt or force.
      2: behavior by an animal that is not beneficial to or may be harmful to itself but that benefits others of its species.

      If you opt to provide aid or help, or self-sacrifice willingly with the product of your own labor, for something you find of value, then it is not altruism, it is charity.
      Charity:
      noun, plural charities.
      1.generous actions or donations to aid the poor, ill, or helpless: to devote one's life to charity.
      2. something given to a person or persons in need; alms: She asked for work, not charity.
      3. a charitable act or work.
      4. a charitable fund, foundation, or institution: He left his estate to a charity.
      5. benevolent feeling, especially toward those in need or in disfavor: She looked so poor that we fed her out of charity.
      6. leniency in judging others; forbearance: She was inclined to view our selfish behavior with charity.
      7. Christian love; agape.
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 11 years, 2 months ago
    I think of the two dictionary definitions as very different.
    “unselfish regard for or devotion to the welfare of others “
    This is not the kind Rand condemns because people have a right to pursue what they have a regard for or devotion to.

    “behavior by an animal that is not beneficial to or may be harmful to itself but that benefits others of its species.”
    This is what Rand condemns because the person is doing something he really doesn't want to do.

    I like the way Salta describes the common misunderstanding. I don't know a good word or phrase that describes specifically the second definition (the one we mean) of altruism. Many people who reject Rand because she was supposedly against charity or kindness would agree that forced kindness or grudging kindness motivated by pity are wrong.
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  • Posted by SaltyDog 11 years, 2 months ago
    Let me, if I may, open another line of thought. The Nash Equilibrium is a model for non-cooperative gaming. Let's say that there are three of us living in a neighborhood where houses are being robbed. Now each of us could stay up on guard 24 hours a day. That won't last long. However, if each of us looks objectively at the situation, and each of us independently comes to the conclusion that 24/3=8, and each of us takes one of the three eight hour watches, all three of our houses can be guarded 24/7. So each of us can come to the conclusion that 8 hours is the optimum number so that each can accomplish his/goal in the most efficient manner. In other words, doing what's best for the group IS what's best for me. From that viewpoint, what can be considered altruism IS in fact what's best for me and doesn't meet the classical definition of altruism at all.
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    • Posted by 11 years, 2 months ago
      That IS rational self interest. Also IS cooperative and voluntary not coerced thought guilt or force.
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      • Posted by SaltyDog 11 years, 2 months ago
        For the purposes of the dicussion, non-cooperative means that the three (or two or seven hundred) did not start out with a collaborative effort in mind. It only becomes cooperative when all parties realize that their individual decisions are based on the probable outcome of the others.
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        • Posted by CircuitGuy 11 years, 2 months ago
          This almost seems a barter situation. I could pay the neighbors to keep an eye on my house, but it turns out they need the same service but at a different time. We just so happen to have mutual coincidence of wants, so we agree to barter: I'll take the evening shift if you guys take other shifts.
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  • Posted by fivedollargold 11 years, 2 months ago
    John Galt helped others find Atlantis of his own free will. No one paid him to travel around the country at the cost of his time and personal safety to do so. Contrast this with the current Regime, which compels you pay for moochers' cell phones, crappy Moochelle school lunches that kids won't even eat, ad infinitum.
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