Global Jihad vs Islam Enlightenment

Posted by khalling 9 years, 4 months ago to Philosophy
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A religion is to a great extent a construct of its adherents. It consists of the beliefs, values, priorities, assumptions, and expectations shared by those adherents and reinforced by their culture and institutions. Academics arguing that particular acts of violence and repression are not condoned by the Koran do not negate the fact that millions of Muslims still believe they are.


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  • Posted by Robbie53024 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You should look up Queen Latifah (the source of the quote was meant to elicit some sarcasm - but I do think that she makes a valid point).

    I cannot agree that emotions are good or bad, like facts they are. As you say, and I agree with, what you do based on them is what counts (and is the basic point from the QL quote - it is rational to feel fear when walking past a dark alley, particularly in NYC and similar, and so you should swing wide around them instead of walking near the opening - that is rational action based on the feeling of fear).

    As to the success of your business (congratulations, by the way), your failures were not necessarily in creating a business, but in areas like negotiating, interpersonal interactions, vendor selection, etc. I firmly believe that if you've never failed, then you've never really pushed yourself and played things too safe.

    Lastly, fear is only debilitating if you let it be. As a soldier, I was more encouraged by a fellow soldier who was afraid, but harnessed that fear and overcame. Much better than those who were "fearless" as they often were also careless, not having a rational sense of fear to keep them cognizant of the danger and therefore to prepare appropriately. Having gone to jump school, there's a reason that they make the chute packers jump with a randomly chosen chute on a regular basis. If you have a reasonable fear of a bad outcome, you pay closer attention to what you do. I wouldn't let a chute packer who said they weren't afraid to die to continue packing.
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  • Posted by Maritimus 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Hello, R,
    I have two problems with what you say.

    On my moral scale, hate and envy are bad and love and courage are good (e.g.). These things used to be called vices and virtues. Of course political correctness police will not let you utter them in reference to anybody. "We are all equal!" Yah, I heard that before. The virtues and vices, in my opinion, are "emotions" based on "feelings" and by definition not products of Reason. How you judge and act, presumably based on Reason, is the only thing that counts in the end.

    Queen Latifah may be a great philosopher, I do not know. Never heard of her, to be truthful. But, " ... anyone who has had success has failed before." is a preposterous overgeneralization and, in fact, false. Years ago, on my first try, I started a business (technical services to manufacturers and users of very high reliability equipment). In 20 years, it grew about 9-fold in revenue. I call that a success. There was no failure before. I was employed. At the same time, you can look at any mistake as a "failure". All my adult life, I called it a good day if I made less than 100 mistakes.
    Do you now see why that is a preposterous overgeneralization?

    By the way, I call fear a debilitating poison of the human mind.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Emotions are neither good, nor bad, neither logical or illogical. They merely are. What you do with them, how you allow them to control your actions, that is what is undesirable.

    With all due deference to the wise and noble Yoda, fear is only the path to the dark side if you allow it to be. It is how you react to the fear which is the path, not the fear itself.

    As the great philosopher, Queen Latifah has said: "Fear can be good when you're walking past an alley at night or when you need to check the locks on your doors before you go to bed, but it's not good when you have a goal and you're fearful of obstacles. We often get trapped by our fears, but anyone who has had success has failed before."
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  • Posted by $ blarman 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Aren't emotions by definition irrational? That they can be incited is true to a degree.

    I think the underlying premise in your comments is that I am asserting that emotions are bad or undesirable. I do not wish to assert any such thing. Emotions are helpful - to a point. Force of conviction arises from emotion and spurs us to greater acts of service and heroism than we might have otherwise entertained. Emotional connections to friends, spouse, or children can all be very positive things. But we must beware of the power of negative emotions such as anger and hate, because those lead to detrimental consequences.

    "Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering."
    - Yoda
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  • Posted by $ blarman 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Hatred is by definition irrational, is it not?

    I worked with some Iranians in Cyprus who were seeking asylum. The woman one day had gone out her doors with makeup on. Some boys - not even teens - rode by on bicycles and slashed her face with razor blades held between their knuckles as a "punishment". The family said that they wanted to abandon Islam because of this and many other things. So I still hold out hope that there are some who live in Muslim nations who - if given the opportunity - would abandon it.

    I, too, have read the Qu'ran and I agree with you - it is an evil book. It can not be reconciled with freedom because it openly calls for slavery of many kinds. I would like to seek out and provide asylum for those who wish to embrace freedom, but I freely admit that this means abandoning Islam. I can not reconcile the Islamic faith with a support for the Constitution of the principles of liberty.

    As to how to prevent these massacres? Unless we are willing to call a spade a spade and stop pandering to Islam in general, the killings will not stop. Bullies don't stop until you bloody their proverbial noses with a resolved response. But I do not see that happening anywhere in the world, and until the world wakes up and is willing to confront the demon before them, they will continue to lose their lunch money.
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  • Posted by johnpe1 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    yes;;; I was just attempting to observe the similar
    patterns of behavior between one group exploiting
    sex and another group exploiting avarice. . I agree
    completely with your analysis. -- j

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  • Posted by Maritimus 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I am not religious either. The enlightened Muslims need to segregate themselves from their fundamentalist brethren. I see virtually no evidence of that. Each sect seems to be fighting all the others to death. Protestants started about six centuries ago.
    You did not answer my question: what actions we choose right now to prevent massacres?
    Friends as always.
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  • Posted by $ blarman 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The way Islam's rules treat women is abhorrent. It is nothing short of enslavement of sentient beings and should be decried by NOW and every other women's organization in existence. Their deafening silence is telling.

    To me, it is the generational institutionalization of their way of life that is what needs to be overcome. They won't embrace capitalism or Western ideas until they realize that they are free to think for themselves. To them, the mullahs are the ultimate authority which can not be challenged, regardless the lack of logic, decency, etc. displayed. There needs to be some event that completely undermines the authority of the mullahs in order for large-scale change to be effected.
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  • Posted by johnpe1 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I have come to believe that the muslims have learned
    to exploit sex like capitalism exploits self-interest (or
    avarice) -- muslims exploit sex-related-things to
    take over the world by extravagant reproduction, as
    capitalism exploits self-interest to take over the
    world by physical advancements ... if there were
    an example of capitalism to watch....... -- j

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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    "They Martial lawed it and told business owners (of jewish establishments) to shut their doors during this heightened terrorist time."
    Where can I read about the French gov't telling Jewish people to close their businesses and declaring Martial law?
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  • Posted by $ blarman 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Agreed. Freedom does not just apply to one sex. Nor does it apply to any skin color, IQ, etc.
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  • Posted by $ blarman 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Until those countries come to grips with the fact that Islam is an intolerant and irreconcilably different mindset than western culture, they will fail. In order to fight something either physically or ideologically, you have to be willing to see reality for what it is, call a spade a spade, and then act. Oh, and you have to have some set of clearly-defined ideological principles yourself. I think that is why the EU is so wishy-washy - they don't want to have to pick a single set of morals to live by, mistakenly thinking that "diversity" is a good thing.
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  • Posted by $ blarman 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    +1.

    That's because they have big lobbying groups backed by lots of money, lots of politicians, and a biased media. It's still an ideological battle, but those doing the reporting aren't going to out themselves.
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  • Posted by RevJay4 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The real enemy is the people who insist on ignoring what is going on in the name of a "religion" based on a book which advocates the elimination of those who would not submit to its beliefs. The "moderate" muslims are as guilty of the bloodshed for not speaking out against the perpetrators of the massacres. To not take action is to enable the jihadists. Read the comment by Temlakos below in this thread.
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  • Posted by $ blarman 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I don't understand why they would be visiting any kind of religious institution in the first place if it's a public school. Wouldn't that automatically set off the PC police as "promotion of religion"?

    I can think of a lot more constructive field trips to spend money on, like to a natural history museum, a factory... Good grief, the choices are abundant.
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  • Posted by $ blarman 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    If they self-identify as Muslim, I think there is ample room for justified suspicion. And not because I disregard "innocent until proven guilty", but because of "predominance of evidence" and their own tenets. It isn't someone acting against the tenets of their religion, but acting in support of them. And when a religion attempts to enforce itself on others - especially through violent means - that's just wrong.
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  • Posted by RevJay4 9 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    A natural deduction from my comment, I suppose. No is the answer. I am in favor of tolerating others if they will tolerate me. The "exterminator" comment was a flip remark at the time. I am tired of hearing of Islam as a "religion of peace" when, in reality, it is a cult of submission of the rest of the world to the beliefs of the followers of that cult. You get the drift.
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  • Posted by johnpe1 9 years, 4 months ago
    any set of rules, religious or not, which devalues
    women like they do, is wrong. -- j

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