AND WHY DON'T THEY?
.... Your first answer is probably not the real cause...

breaking...

Zen, have you heard the old saying, "Tell me how you're going to measure or reward me and I'll tell you how I'm going to behave"?

So you and the others blame the POLICE for acting the way they're REWARDED for acting, without asking Who is DOING that rewarding and WHY they're doing it and How?

I thought this was a group of objective, rational people here!

As I've said too many times before, here and elsewhere.... the root cause of the 'issue at hand' is virtually NEVER the first 'reason' anyone comes up with!

Critical Thinking is Dead in the US. I think it died somewhere back in the '80s.

Now, back to the regularly-scheduled generalizations...
Happy Holidays, all!

I didn't say anything about revealing personal information. I asked you to provide publicly verifiable information about the Internal Affairs department within some police force or another cleaning house of dirty cops.

Put another way, I asked you to put up or shut up, and you chose the latter. Cool. I win. You lose. Buh bye.

As for my identity, I'll play your game. My name is Chris Beavers. I am 42 years old, live in Fort Worth, TX on a street that starts with an L and ends with an A. If you really do have some real association with the police (which I seriously doubt), you shouldn't have too much trouble verifying my criminal record or complete lack thereof. How's that for putting up, Hon?

of course, it doesn't hurt me much that my freedom
to shoot my friendly neighbor is curtailed....... -- j

Come on Zen. You have to admit that there have to be consequences for braking traffic laws. Yes, they may have quotas but if you are not braking the speed limit or driving recklessly you will not get a ticket. I will bet that the ratio of raiding the wrong house is at least 1000:1. Everyone makes mistakes and sometimes it turns out badly.

Why shouldn't the police/SWAT have proper tactics to take quick control of a possible hostile area? And yes, sometimes it may be in our neighborhoods... As far as them being a brotherhood and that they have each others back, well, they should. Look at unions, the military, corporations, and many other businesses. Without a team, it just don't work!!!

It sounds to me that you just paint all police with the same brush...

My wife doesn't feel appreciated at her work anymore except by her immediate boss. The patients and their families act like they are her only patients, when they're not. The bureaucrats in charge of her hospital that took over when her hospital got bought out by a company from outside the county are universally hated by the employees and the patients (and their families). The Six Sigma program that the new administration tried to put into place succeeded in alienating just about everyone involved. Part of the reason for this "failure" is that there isn't a whole lot of incentive to be cost efficient because hospitals' profits are dictated mostly by either insurance companies and/or Medicare.

So unless I reveal personal information you can check on you doubt my veracity on anything I say and feel you can call anything I say "blindly following".

You have no ethics, sir.
I don't spend my time debating with such people.
I owe you nothing and by your own standards you have no credibility yourself.

I'll leave you to the last word - it's become worthless to me.

I have this odd propensity for believing in "Innocent until proved Guilty".
Sad to see that so many of you have abandoned it.

The police haven't and the evidence backs that up.

I'd say you're a criminal that got caught too many times and has a grudge accordingly.
Of course you could prove me wrong by revealing a bunch of personal information so I could check otherwise I'll stay with my assumption.

Seems reasonable to you.
I'm done with this site - none of this represents Ayn Rand or Objectivism.
It's alarmist garbage for the most part.
It's cheap to hate the government (or an group blindly).
Takes no ethics at all.

Just as when Columbine was the host of violent attacks, the press and others put the focus on the wrong thing. Then, they made it about guns, when it was a host of things which continued, from drugs to brainwashing. Now, everything is because cops supposedly abuse blacks. Bull! I have worked around cops over the years, and most are caring, doing a difficult job, and want the best for the community. Yeah, there are bad ones who take drug money, abuse the badge, and are even racist, but they are the minority. The real problem here is a cultrue of youth, all colors, who have no sense of self responsibility, an overblown sense of entitlement, no respect for anyone, and have become deadened to the results of violence. School brainwashing, poor parenting, and politicians who USE this demographic are the real culprits who need to be exposed. Race problems have increased under Obama, because of his need to use the Saul Alinsky set race against race dogma. He is the number one offender, and all the other politicians hoping for personal power gain by using black citizens. They have stolen their chance at a productive future. In 1949, black friends of my father sat on our couch watching our new TV with us. They also ate with us. They were friends of family, respected colleagues of my father - that is how you deal with race relations. Stop blaming the good cops. The government is already forcing some departments to train to use guns against citizens to enforce UN Agenda 21, how would you like your boss asking that of you?

There are numerous things my wife and I do that could be considered charity, or expressing appreciation in noticeable ways.

One in particular, is whenever my wife and I are in a restaurant and we spot uniformed police, or uniformed military. we will buy their dinner, and instruct the waitress and/or management not to let them know who bought them dinner,

We also tell them that they are to tell the officers, or military this dinner in in appreciation for the work they do. Thank you.


I am hoping that someday someone will do the same for this officer to show him that for as many people like the jackasses in Ferguson, Obama, Sharpton, Holder and all these other blatantly obvious racists, that the rest of us do indeed value and appreciate their service to our community and way of life.

You said, "Please point out where I blindly defend anyone."

OK, fair enough. Earlier, you wrote, "They don't publicize such things but the internal affairs department doesn't sit on their hands.
You can see them any way you like, but unless you've seen the records of internal affairs and the efforts they make - you're reacting off of the news as if it is reality and ignoring the evidence that contradicts it."

So, that begs the question. What Internal Affairs investigations are you personally familiar with? You claimed earlier that people, presumably like yourself, that have an association with the police know better. Well, Hon, start naming names, citing specific examples that can be independently verified. If you can't or won't then I'd say your credibility is what is in doubt.

Why should I take your word for anything based on faith? You claimed some association with the police, so put up or shut up. Prove me wrong, Hon. Give me some compelling reason to think that the average Joe Policeman actually cares more about the ordinary citizen than he does for another cop or his job. Unless/until you can, I won't be retracting anything.

As for showing your blind defense of the police, I would assert that your default position is to simply assume they are guiltless in general, or at a bare minimum, active in weeding out the rotten in their ranks. You claimed to have some knowledge, so show it. In the absence of specific evidence, I'd say my assertion regarding your blind defense is right on the money.

Zephany, if I'm reading your earlier (about 2 hrs ago) comment correctly, you are saying that only dishonest, corrupt people should become police officers????

How can we expect police officers to properly perform their jobs when they must constantly be in fear of being sued, jailed or worse. People who obey the law don't get hassled by the police, so here's a thought- Don't break the law! BTW Chris Rock has a very funny video about this called How To Not Get Your @ss kicked by the Police.

When it reaches the point that we are expected to respect and accept authority from those that just hold a position in government rather than demand that respect be earned and authority be granted and limited to only that necessary--then we live under tyranny.

It might well be that the police that have a difficult, gut wrenching job have that as the result of their working to reduce and eliminate the individual rights of those they are meant to serve. The police under Hitler probably had much the same complaints.

we have cited evidence about the corruption of the police. You have made claims. Every civil asset forfeiture should be considered a crime. statistics are stacked. How many judges on the take end up in prison. People are reacting to very real issues. Rand said you have a legitimate right to express outraged emotion when your rights are violated.

Twenty years ago I had cause to deal with the police due to a tragedy. My experience with the police at that time, was very positive. I'm finding it hard to reconcile that with what you describe. If I take your word for it, things have rapidly deteriorated in twenty years.

Was that reasoning?
Please point out where I blindly defend anyone.
Otherwise, please keep your straw man arguments to yourself if you don't want them pointed out.
That reveals more than anything else - when you defame or exaggerate someone's arguments and then deny your own exaggeration.

Feel free - your credibility is at stake, not mine.
My challenge stands, IamTheBeav.
Show where I blindly defend anyone.
Or if you have ethics, retract.

I find the fact that I'm the only one posting positively revealing about the mood of people today.
Compared to the general population they perform far fewer crimes statistically. That's all I'm saying.

I can disagree, but I cannot condemn you for lack of ethics.
You ARE following your ethics - you consider the entire police force corrupt.
I disagree, but am glad you stand by what you believe - we need more people who do, regardless.

Thanks for clarifying.
Keep speaking up, Zenphamy.

j; the difference I see is that your wife is probably earning appreciation, while I don't think the cop is earning his. It sounds more like he's expecting appreciation because of his position, rather than his contribution.

Indeed! +1

All societies that have made the transition to statism/collectivism want their police seen as heroes or the super race and then just transition to thuggery. I don't know of any that haven't.

There is a sickness in our society that is having an effect on all of those who seek out the service professions. Not just police, but the medical and teaching professions as well. The sickness is "diversity", seeking to divide all of us into separate boxes, and make us believe we're all "victims". Because this societal plague makes us suspicious of each other and our motivations, trust and a sense of unity has eroded to the destructive point.

When you hear police say they feel their main concern is to make sure they come home to their family, it's a sign of the diversity disease. If you feel the police in your community have become the enemy, and you make no effort to bridge that gap, then you're infected too.

It is disturbing to see so many stupid anti-police comments. Policemen have a difficult, gut wrenching job, and deserve respect from those they protect. They deal with the dregs of society, Now they are under attack. Both Michael Brown and Trevon Martin have been elevated to sainthood, and the truth about their backgrounds hidden. Michael Brown assaulted a officer doing his duty. Trevon Martin assaulted a neighborhood watch volunteer protecting the neighborhood where he lived. Both attempted to get the officers gun and were killed. Had they behaved properly both would be alive. Brown probably would have received a slap on the wrist by the court system and would have continued his punk behavior. Trevon Martin probably would have continued down the path he was on and would have wound up in the court system.

"Those who abjure violence can do so only because others are committing violence on their behalf."